DMK
Member
Sometimes when folks have their own particular hammer, everything in the world looks like a nail.
Gun owners often have this problem as well.
My head just exploded
- Thread starter DontBurnMyFlag
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Gun owners often have this problem as well.
Prince Yamato
Member
He's the fist first version of the gunshop commando. Martial arts are great, but can only do so much. Unless you are a grand master, you're not going to be kicking everyone's ass with Hollywood ease. Even martial arts competitions are controlled environments. Most people are fighting in the same styles. Points are awarded on knocking someone down, not knocking them out or killing them.
In the real world, people fight very differently. People may take "performance enhancers" (be they steroids, meth, or cocaine). Hell, even Chuck Norris has bodyguards.
Your friend is trying to run his business. That's the same reason my Kung-Fu instructor kept telling me I had to learn all these "forms" before I progressed to the next level. I would have made a better ballet dancer than fighter at the end of 4 months. I quit and used the money I would have spent on Kung-Fu to buy a gun. In other words, keep the myth going, keep up business. I had to spend more time (and money) learning stuff I never would use anyway.
In the real world, people fight very differently. People may take "performance enhancers" (be they steroids, meth, or cocaine). Hell, even Chuck Norris has bodyguards.
Your friend is trying to run his business. That's the same reason my Kung-Fu instructor kept telling me I had to learn all these "forms" before I progressed to the next level. I would have made a better ballet dancer than fighter at the end of 4 months. I quit and used the money I would have spent on Kung-Fu to buy a gun. In other words, keep the myth going, keep up business. I had to spend more time (and money) learning stuff I never would use anyway.
tuckerdog1
Member
He's sure been in a lot of fights. Maybe classes on situational awareness would serve him better.
Tuckerdog1
Tuckerdog1
Ahhh...so true so true.
It sounds like this guy believes that martial arts is THE answer to dealing with trouble. AND that having a gun will make you a target, because people will want to steal it from you.
Interesting perception....and honestly I believe that there may be some truth to that in some places. BUT that’s the benefit of CONCEALED carry ....they don't know you have a gun.....right?
As was shown by Regen it’s hard to draw and fire in a short period of time. It seems many people deal with this fact by trying to keep people a safe distance away.....which is ridiculous in a city environment..... it can't be done. (Honestly those posts where people say they considered drawing down on a bum asking for change because they got too close make me wonder a little.
)So skill in hand to hand could be essential in some situations in order to MAKE SPACE so you can draw and fire if you need to. Or better yet, end the threat in that matter with no need for your firearm.
Nails can be hit with many types of hammers.
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
Well, heck. Something's got to fill up the far end of the bell curve, right?
wally
Member
Tell him: "Gun-Fu is my martial art!"
--wally.
--wally.
Quote
Sometimes when folks have their own particular hammer, everything in the world looks like a nail.
Gun owners often have this problem as well.
The martial arts I was trained with was mostly open hand fighting with few strikes. This is the form I am most comfortable fighting with. But I know of ways to mix martial arts with a firearm, though I find it difficult to practice with anyone because anyone I know thats into martial arts is not into guns and vice versa...but a mix of different forms and use the most effective tools for the job...as a reference to martial arts think of a gun as a long pointy stick that the trigger sets off over and over again and all you need to do is line it up with the target. I could see some martial arts schools start teaching forms using firearms in addition to the rest of their weapons, all it is doing is brining hand fighting into the 21st century.
Also NEVER practice this with a real gun thats dangerous, get a plastic one thats made for this sort of thing (about 10 or 20 bucks).
Sometimes when folks have their own particular hammer, everything in the world looks like a nail.
Gun owners often have this problem as well.
The martial arts I was trained with was mostly open hand fighting with few strikes. This is the form I am most comfortable fighting with. But I know of ways to mix martial arts with a firearm, though I find it difficult to practice with anyone because anyone I know thats into martial arts is not into guns and vice versa...but a mix of different forms and use the most effective tools for the job...as a reference to martial arts think of a gun as a long pointy stick that the trigger sets off over and over again and all you need to do is line it up with the target. I could see some martial arts schools start teaching forms using firearms in addition to the rest of their weapons, all it is doing is brining hand fighting into the 21st century.
Also NEVER practice this with a real gun thats dangerous, get a plastic one thats made for this sort of thing (about 10 or 20 bucks).
Deanimator
Member
Just say to him, "If it's that easy to take a gun away from someone, if they take mine, I"ll just take it right back!" 
DontBurnMyFlag
Member
it just seemed like an infinate loop of an argument.
i just needed positive responses from other like minded individuals to put my head back together. i'm still picking pieces of brain matter off my wall, but in a few weeks, the swelling will go down.
thanks guys.
i just needed positive responses from other like minded individuals to put my head back together. i'm still picking pieces of brain matter off my wall, but in a few weeks, the swelling will go down.
thanks guys.
Fast Frank
Member
Martial arts are cool!
Personally, I practice the ancient art of powding.
I look across my sights, pull my trigger, POW! DING! It's a done deal.
60% of the time, it works every time!
Personally, I practice the ancient art of powding.
I look across my sights, pull my trigger, POW! DING! It's a done deal.
60% of the time, it works every time!
Hypnogator
Member
He's right -- If they know you're carrying!
File this under Open Carry Bad Idea, reasons why.
I know it's a "discussion board" but there ain't much to discuss on this guy. His type appears frequently in the martial arts community, and occasionally in the gun community.
Basically these guys really like martial arts and use everything they can to justify their obsession. Like they buy into kung-fu movie hype. My steel cobra stance lets me fend off twenty armed ninjas with uzis...
It IS good for fitness, spirituality, self-knowledge, self-defense, sport, and fun...but it isn't the BEST form of self-defense (or fitness for that matter). If you get spirituality, self-knowledge, and some sporting fun out of it great. Clearly anyone who has advanced in the martial arts has a good deal of self control. But the fact is that some people justify their obsession with rationalization. Kind of like the guy in the firearms community who is just aching to have his home broken into or be assaulted in an armed confrontation. It's machismo, and silly.
EDIT: I don't mean to generalize. Lots of people in the MA community aren't as extreme as I described above. However, many of them are very reluctant to admit that their years of work might be useless in a real down-and-dirty situation with multiple armed attackers or whatever. They think of guns as the "Easy way out." Again, machismo.
You really shouldn't even believe that "martial arts expert" if he says he's been in tons of street fights. Just leave him alone.
Basically these guys really like martial arts and use everything they can to justify their obsession. Like they buy into kung-fu movie hype. My steel cobra stance lets me fend off twenty armed ninjas with uzis...
It IS good for fitness, spirituality, self-knowledge, self-defense, sport, and fun...but it isn't the BEST form of self-defense (or fitness for that matter). If you get spirituality, self-knowledge, and some sporting fun out of it great. Clearly anyone who has advanced in the martial arts has a good deal of self control. But the fact is that some people justify their obsession with rationalization. Kind of like the guy in the firearms community who is just aching to have his home broken into or be assaulted in an armed confrontation. It's machismo, and silly.
EDIT: I don't mean to generalize. Lots of people in the MA community aren't as extreme as I described above. However, many of them are very reluctant to admit that their years of work might be useless in a real down-and-dirty situation with multiple armed attackers or whatever. They think of guns as the "Easy way out." Again, machismo.
You really shouldn't even believe that "martial arts expert" if he says he's been in tons of street fights. Just leave him alone.
DontBurnMyFlag
Member
I was reading "on combat" by Lt. Col. David Grossman.
He stated that a local police department recruited a Mixed martial arts fighter for a defensive tactics seminar. The fighter was so conditioned for the fights, he could do it sleeping if need be lol.
So the SWAT team took him for a simunitions training exercise in a shoothouse. The fighter was so dead set on using his fists his entire life, he dropped the weapon and basically panicked in his first run through the shoot house.
This can be said for anyone without training in anything. But I thought it was relatively useful info.
He stated that a local police department recruited a Mixed martial arts fighter for a defensive tactics seminar. The fighter was so conditioned for the fights, he could do it sleeping if need be lol.
So the SWAT team took him for a simunitions training exercise in a shoothouse. The fighter was so dead set on using his fists his entire life, he dropped the weapon and basically panicked in his first run through the shoot house.
This can be said for anyone without training in anything. But I thought it was relatively useful info.
JackBurtonJr
Member
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2008
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- 294
I have a friend who is a quite good mixed martial artist and a big ol' boy to boot. We were talking about self defense once and he told me the only time he got mugged he reacted by smacking the guy upside the head with the briefcase full of papers he was carrying.
The best weapon is the one at hand.
The best weapon is the one at hand.
jahwarrior
Member
i used to have that mindset. i grew up, literally, studying one martial discipline or another. my parents, brothers, cousins, we all did. from kindergarten on, i was prepped to defend myself. it helped on numerous occasions, but it also came with a hindrance: the naivete, or arrogance, that many martialists have concerning firearms. i had it, until i was held up at gunpoint. all of my training, all the "warrior" philosophy, all the honorable intentions, they all counted for nothing. i took a long, hard look at everything i'd learned, and realized that i had been ignorant. i soon came to see that guns were no different than knives, or swords: they were just tools, to dfend, to equalize, to serve life. i came to embrace the notion that learning to handle a gun was the next step in martial training. i now go to the range, go to seminars, and read books on gunplay as religiously as i went to the dojo to study aikijutsu, kenjutsu, iaijutsu, kali, boxing, and wing chun.
Claymore1500
Member
I used to work with a guy who was a third degree black belt in TKD, Also an instructor in the same (part time).
He was extolling the benefits of MA to me once, Telling me how easy it was and that HE doesn't have to go and get his protection, I just looked him in the eye and said.
"Yea, But mine works from the back seat of a car". He got the message and shut up.
He was extolling the benefits of MA to me once, Telling me how easy it was and that HE doesn't have to go and get his protection, I just looked him in the eye and said.
"Yea, But mine works from the back seat of a car". He got the message and shut up.
James T Thomas
Member
a legend in his own eyes
My experience in life tells me that "jahwarrior" comes closer to the truth than most others.
Your martial arts friend is arrogant! He or she has taken a high and mighty
-ethical position that leaves all the logic and argumentation and even the facts of reality down at the bottom of the high hill that they stand upon.
I'm supposing for the sake of your friendship and their safety too that you will continue to persuade them to consider their viewpoint, but do not become upset if there is absolutely no reaching them.
May I quote an ancient book of wisdom that has absolute truth in it?
"Speak not in the ears of a fool; for he will despise the wisdom of thy words."
"Answer -not, a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him."
-"answer a fool -according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit."
My experience in life tells me that "jahwarrior" comes closer to the truth than most others.
Your martial arts friend is arrogant! He or she has taken a high and mighty
-ethical position that leaves all the logic and argumentation and even the facts of reality down at the bottom of the high hill that they stand upon.
I'm supposing for the sake of your friendship and their safety too that you will continue to persuade them to consider their viewpoint, but do not become upset if there is absolutely no reaching them.
May I quote an ancient book of wisdom that has absolute truth in it?
"Speak not in the ears of a fool; for he will despise the wisdom of thy words."
"Answer -not, a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him."
-"answer a fool -according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit."
bukijin
Member
Shooting is a martial art.
I think weapon retention is a lot easier than weapon disarming.
I think weapon retention is a lot easier than weapon disarming.
Thernlund
Member
DontBurnMyFlag said:
Depending on a few factors, he may be right to some degree. In a very bad neighborhood that you are completely unfamiliar with, gun or no gun I expect that you are already at a disadvantage. If your attackers are street-smart enough, I think they'd have a few solid ideas on how to disarm and then beat the poop out of some yuppie with a Glock with no collateral damage.
There are probably some neighborhoods where the locals could beat the most bad-assed Delta/SEAL/Ranger/Recon guy to within an inch of his life without even dropping the ash off their cigarette.
Neither a gun nor training is a magic talisman that keeps evil away. Avoidance is key.
-T.
LightningJoe
Member
Don't talk to stupid people. How do you think they got that way?
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