NJ arrests another one....this time from Fla.

[milemaker13]

Window tint is a weird law, right? Cuz round here I thought it was always illegal.. guess they changed the law since everyone seems to have tint now. Mostly mild, but some so dark I don't know how they are able to drive.
I mean, my mini van has tinted windows (ok, its"privacy glass" and only the rear cabin but still.)
I think the changing laws may have to do with energy efficiency... Air conditioning efficiency...

 

[hdwhit]

xXxplosive wrote:
A Florida woman was arrested after cops found she was carrying a handgun loaded with hollow point bullets in her purse during a traffic stop, Frenchtown police said.

Well, we often talk about "responsible gun ownership" and with the carrying of weapons left to a patchwork of state laws, the only responsible course of action for a gun owner before traveling to find out what the laws are in the jurisdictions they will be traveling in.

 

[scaatylobo]

http://www.nj.com/hunterdon/index.s...man_arrested_after_cops_find_loaded_hand.html
Woman arrested after cops find loaded handgun in her purse

A Florida woman was arrested after cops found she was carrying a handgun loaded with hollow point bullets in her purse during a traffic stop, Frenchtown police said.

Cops stopped Donna Marie Gracey, 59, of Seminole, Florida, on Tuesday for having tinted windows and a view obstruction on Bridge Street in Frenchtown. While she was searching for her license, officers spotted a concealed weapons permit, according to a press release.

An investigation revealed Gracey had the handgun in her purse, authorities said.

Though Gracey had a permit to carry the gun in her home state, New Jersey's strict gun laws require weapons to be stored unloaded and locked in the trunk.

While legal to possess hollow point ammunition, there are heavy restrictions in N.J. regarding transporting and using the bullets.



it is also illegal to possess hollow nose or hollow point bullets unless you are engaged in one of the activities that are considered "exemptions." These include: hunting, fishing, and target shooting.

Gov. Chris Christie has pardoned a number of out-of-state residentswho were caught with weapons, but is against a GOP-led bill that would allow gun owners with state-issued concealed-carry permits to carry in states that allow concealed weapons.

Christie is against the change, noting it's a state's rights issue that the federal government should stay out of.

Gracey was charged with possession of a loaded handgun and possession of hollow point bullets and summonses for tinted windows and view obstruction. She was released pending court.

Sophie Nieto-Munoz may be reached at [email protected]. Follow her at @snietomunoz. Find NJ.com on Facebook.

Here we go again.....and who stops an out of state registered vehicle for tinted windows when it is legal in that state....

IF she had not permitted a search,they would have had to get a search warrant.

That takes hours,and can vacate what is found IF your held for unreasonable time [ like hours ].

And she would not have faced any more charges if they actually did get that warrant.

btw = not knowing how stupid and restrictive their laws are was really stupid,criminally so.

 

[milemaker13]

I've always said (to my dumb friends) that a cop is going to do what he wants on the side of the road. You can argue how unfair it was in court.

 

[Good Ol' Boy]

We all talk about being pro 2A with state regulation, well if we're going to live by this accord than you have to know what you're going into. I mean if we're going to abide by current law then you need to know the laws of all states. It would be considered a mental illness IMO to CC a gun from out of town in CA, NY, DC or NJ in the current state of things.

Is it right? IMO no. But it's the way things are.

 

[cfullgraf]

Here we go again.....and who stops an out of state registered vehicle for tinted windows when it is legal in that state....

My wife from Tennessee with a Tennessee diver's license, driving a car registered in Tennessee with tinted windows legal in Tennessee recently got stopped in Virginia for windows tinted beyond Virginia's laws.

'Nuff said.

 

[Danoobie]

So glad that I left the State, when I retired. It's the Arm Pit of the United States.

... and this woman just became one of NJ's newest revenue streams. Part of voting with your wallet is avoiding getting caught up in their
kangaroo court jurisprudence.

 

[AirForceShooter]

Wait one.
This all started with tinted windows on a car registered in Florida.
How can New Jersey enforce the vehicle code of Florida?
Are you saying every car in Florida that has tinted windows can't go to New Jersey?
Florida doesn't have front plates either. Could NJ ticket for lack of something that doesn't exist?

AFS

 

[alsaqr]

Yes, out of state motorists are arrested when caught carrying a concealed weapon in New Jersey. Savvy folks with concealed weapons permits check this stuff out before taking a trip.

BTW: The lady probably drove through Maryland, a state that does not have reciprocity with Florida.

http://www.youcancarry.com/maryland-ccw-reciprocity/

 

[Peter Gun]

The tinting laws are pretty clear. And it’s also clear that other states can’t cite you for following the laws of the state of registry.
However:
The cops can pull you over to check your tint is legal. We also know that a cop might mistakenly issue a citation for tint anyway, which you will fight in court and win.
We don’t know the tint on this car was legal for Florida , either.
They mentioned a “view obstruction”. This is usually a decal banner across the top of the Front windshield, which is illegal in all states except for the approved 4 inch sun visor. The car may have had the front windshield tinted all over, also illegal in all states.
The current car mod craze has influenced many people to drive around with illegal tint and lights. Some places , like NJ, enforce these laws a lot more than others.
If I was a state police officer, I would spend all day busting people for illegal headlights around here.
BTW, I do state car inspections, I deal with this all day.

 

[BSA1]

Well, we often talk about "responsible gun ownership" and with the carrying of weapons left to a patchwork of state laws, the only responsible course of action for a gun owner before traveling to find out what the laws are in the jurisdictions they will be traveling in.

Edit; patchwork of state, county and municipal laws.

Sounds simple and logical enough…

Except…

Where and how is a gun owner suppose to be able to learn what the State, County and Municipal Laws are in every place they are traveling through?

Even after spending hours researching this information how can the person be sure it is correct?

It would be considered a mental illness IMO to CC a gun from out of town in CA, NY, DC or NJ in the current state of things.

And Maryland.

But on the other hand, no one can expect police to not enforce the laws of the State.

Isn’t that the same argument the NAZI’s used when on trial at Nuremberg?

To say “I was just enforcing the law” removes all individual responsibility for the consequences of their actions.

Actions like arresting a women such as Shaneen Allen and Donna Marie Gracey continue to create mistrust of the Police and Government.

When we drive to visit family in Baltimore, Maryland we do not take any firearms or weapons with us. Typically we drive through nine or so States depending on the route and make two overnight stays somewhere. The harsh reality is I am more scared of the actions of the Police (not just in Maryland but other States like Illinois) than I am of being a victim of a violent crime. My wife and I have discussed this at length and have concluded that flying is much, much safer.

p.s. And yes I am intentionally making a comparison to Nuremberg and yes I do expect the Police NOT to ENFORCE ALL laws.

 

[Speedo66]

So just got my CCW in NE but in my class I was told I'm required to present my carry license with my driver's license if I'm ever stopped even if I'm not carrying at the time. I take it take isn't the case everywhere?

I'd love to see a cite on that, be very surprised if that were true. Your papers please!

As far as tinting, there's usually a legal % of light transmission, varies by state. I would imagine it's darker legally in hotter states.

 

[Robert]

Isn’t that the same argument the NAZI’s used when on trial at Nuremberg?

So any cop that enforces a law you disagree with is a Nazi? Get a speeding ticket, Nazi! No seat belt, Nazi!

 

[xXxplosive]

IMO, the best way to see NJ is from your rear view mirror going over the Delaware Memorial Bridge.

 

[Sistema1927]

And yes I am intentionally making a comparison to Nuremberg and yes I do expect the Police NOT to ENFORCE ALL laws.

Bingo. An unjust law should not be obeyed, and to do so is a violation of one's oath.

So any cop that enforces a law you disagree with is a Nazi? Get a speeding ticket, Nazi! No seat belt, Nazi!

I don't think that is what he said. It is dangerous to argue with a moderator, so I will limit my remarks. Illegal, unconstitutional laws should not be enforced, and if the police won't do it then citizens should exercise jury nullification. Any officer who enforces an unjust law is in violation of their oath of office.

 

[Walkalong]

Ignoring reality is one of the biggest mistakes people make.

Know the law, follow the law, stay out of trouble.

Well, we often talk about "responsible gun ownership" and with the carrying of weapons left to a patchwork of state laws, the only responsible course of action for a gun owner before traveling to find out what the laws are in the jurisdictions they will be traveling in.

Pretty much it.

 

[Tommygunn]

.... Isn’t that the same argument the NAZI’s used when on trial at Nuremberg? ....

Not quite. The "Nuremberg Defense," as it is called, refers to following orders. The question then becomes "are said orders legal?" Like it or not, the Nuremberg Trials involved a butt load of politics. But it also created or clarified some principles regarding what are illegal orders and when they can, or must, be refused. And soldiers can still get in deep Kimshe if they refuse an order.
In American jurisprudence, these matters are handled in the courtroom, not at the traffic stop, so far as civilian law is concerned.

 

[GAF]

No matter what anyone here thinks, The simple solution was for the woman to have had the for sight to check the laws of the states she was traveling through and obeying their laws. I do this every time I travel out of my home state of Wisconsin.

"When in Rome" as the saying goes.

 

[Frank Ettin]

Wait one.
This all started with tinted windows on a car registered in Florida.
How can New Jersey enforce the vehicle code of Florida?.....

New Jersey isn't enforcing Florida law. It is enforcing New Jersey law. When one is in a State, one is subject to the laws of that State.

.... Are you saying every car in Florida that has tinted windows can't go to New Jersey?....

If New Jersey law prohibits that degree of tint on any car using the roads in New Jersey, yes.

The tinting laws are pretty clear. And it’s also clear that other states can’t cite you for following the laws of the state of registry.....

Cite legal authority to support that claim.

Edit; patchwork of state, county and municipal laws.

Sounds simple and logical enough…

Except…

Where and how is a gun owner suppose to be able to learn what the State, County and Municipal Laws are in every place they are traveling through?.....

Nonetheless, that is the nature of the federal system. And it doesn't just apply to gun law. It applies to all state and local laws. We must comply with the laws where we are.

...And yes I am intentionally making a comparison to Nuremberg and yes I do expect the Police NOT to ENFORCE ALL laws.

Then you are a very foolish person.

...Illegal, unconstitutional laws should not be enforced,...

That is a very ignorant statement. Your opinion regarding what laws are illegal or unconstitutional doesn't count. That Founding Fathers assigned the authority to decide that to the federal courts.

 

[P5 Guy]

NJ used to, and may still have a law that only the inspection sticker can be in the area swept by the windshield wipers on the windshield. Also nothing can be hung from the internal rearview mirror.
My sympathy to the poor woman for getting caught up in NJ's draconian legal system, but as already stated one MUST know the laws of the states one is passing thru or visiting.
My advise to anyone is stay out of NJ at all costs.

 

[Sistema1927]

That is a very ignorant statement. Your opinion regarding what laws are illegal or unconstitutional doesn't count.

Where did I give an opinion as to what law(s) should be enforced. I thought that I was speaking in generalities, and agreeing in principle. The ignorance is not all mine.

 

[Danoobie]

IMO, the best way to see NJ is from your rear view mirror going over the Delaware Memorial Bridge.

I travel THROUGH New Jerkistan, but I don't have to stop, anymore. It's so empowering to just keep on going, and not spend ONE THIN DIME there.
Takes a while to get the sewer plant/landfill aroma out of the car, tho.

 

[BSA1]

Then you are a very foolish person.

Please elaborate your comment.

 

[BigBore44]

Then you are a very foolish person.

Laws are not enforced everyday. If officers followed the letter of the law to the “T”, they would never be able to respond to calls. You know this Frank. It’s officer discretion. And seeing as how none of us were there, or read the official report, it’s all speculation anyways.

 

[Frank Ettin]

Laws are not enforced everyday. If officers followed the letter of the law to the “T”, they would never be able to respond to calls. You know this Frank. It’s officer discretion. And seeing as how none of us were there, or read the official report, it’s all speculation anyways.

That's true, but the key words are "officer discretion." Since it's a matter of officer discretion one can never expect or count on getting a pass on something. To expect or count on an LEO exercising his discretion to your benefit is foolish. True enough be might. Then again he might not.