Oh yes, another PGO thread!

[Okiecruffler]

I am dumbest member on this board, and the least qualified.

But you hide it so well.

Well I'm outee too, I just remebered something my granny said about pig rasslin'.
So use your PGO, heck, use a no stock shotgun, that would be really fast. What do I care. And any new folks reading this trying to make a choice, run out and get yourslef a PGO and a case of OO. Take her out to the range. I believe things will become very clear.

 

[lil weezer]

I believe the OP is defending PGO's and his ownership of one because he is too lazy to buy a proper stock for his SG.


He also thinks they "look cool".

 

[buzz_knox]

He also thinks they "look cool".

They do. And they have their uses. Unfortunately, those uses are fairly limited.

 

[lil weezer]

My Seecamp LWS .32 looks cool, but I wouldn't want to use it as a "go to" in a home defense scenario.



Unless thats all I had.

 

[PJR]

What you need to know about beachcola

Join Date: 07-31-08
Location: Florida
Posts: 77

Comes here and after two days posts how he's hot snot with a PGO. When asked to prove his "talents" against other shooters he puts up some jibberish about breaking into his home.

Check some of his other posts in other forums.

It's pretty clear what we are dealing with here.

Ignore him and he'll go away.

 

[bleachcola]

I don't see how people are in danger now that they know I have a personal preference for PGO's. But if you guys really think that is true then I'll shut up about it. I thought I was clear that it was a personal preference but some people are incapable of understanding that. I like butt stocks when I'm in open spaces and I like PGO for when I'm in enclosed spaces. Perhaps if I took several training courses and dedicated a lot of time and money to implementing the butt stock into my brain, I would be superiorly tactical like everyone here. But I haven't had the opportunity to do that yet. One day though. In the meantime I stick with what I'm comfortable with bc I think it is more important for me to remain calm and undistracted in a home defense scenario rather than having the exact weapon that all the experts use. Software before hardware like you guys preach. Until I am reprogrammed, the hardware stays the same.

 

[bleachcola]

But as a parting shot on this thread, just bc I'm stubborn, I think you guys are doing more harm to novices than I am. Some guys may have just learned that somebody else likes to use a PGO. Big deal. But you guys make it seem like a man can't defend his home unless he has the same tools and training as all the experts out there. Many people who come here aren't capable of obtaining those things. So instead of trying to make them feel inferior you should be focusing on teaching them to use their brain first and make the best with what they have. What good is having the ultimate tacticool shotgun if I am stupid enough to run outside into unknown situations the way guys like Tactical Ninja think you should.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

I say let's all pitch in and buy sm a PGO!

To bleachola - hey whatever works for you - I say go for it. If you are proficient at hitting what you aim at, that's what counts! You might be doing it the hard-er way, but if it works, it works. You may change your mind later down the road, or you may not. But stick around and ignore the buttholes.

 

[JShirley]

instead of trying to make them feel inferior you should be focusing on teaching them to use their brain first and make the best with what they have

I have to say your posting in this thread is close to the poorest excuse for logic I've seen on a gun board.

You think we are doing newbies a disservice by suggesting they choose a more effective tool than a less effective tool that costs the same?

Brilliant.

You are projecting your behavior onto us. Very nice. Somehow we are the bad guys because we want people to be able to choose effective defensive tools instead of less effective ones.

Can you climb down off the cross? Some kids want the wood for a tree house.

J

 

[Correia]

Dude, my Maserati will smoke you like I just smoked a $190 Cuban cigar. While my supermodel wife hand-fed me escargot and caviar. On my personal Learjet. In outer space.

Yeah, you talk a big game with that Maserati, but it's going to be kind of hard to pass my Civic with sm hanging out the window with a 28 gauge! Well... unless he's using a PGO, then you should be relatively safe... because I don't know if he's the the superior hand and eye coordination to shoot cars going 150 miles an hour. Never mind.

I think you guys are doing more harm to novices than I am.

I teach 80-150 relatively new people a month, and have done so for the last five years. Man. I've done a lot of friggin' damage!

Many people who come here aren't capable of obtaining those things.

They may have to save for a couple of days in order to get together the $20 they're gonna need for that stock to screw onto the end of that Mossberg. Ouch!

So instead of trying to make them feel inferior you should be focusing on teaching them to use their brain first and make the best with what they have.

Last time I checked, the only people we make feel inferior are the ignorant ones that are too stiffnecked and opinionated to listen, unless somebody bludgeons them over the head with the truth like it's a dead fish.

I smell fish...

Man, if I had known that you were a bouncer, I wouldn't have said anything! Because the stress of dragging a drunk out and tossing them into the parking lot is exactly the same as a gunfight.

And I love when a moderator points out that somebody is wrong, then in the response it is all about how the moderators are just big, sucky, meanies. And how taking The High Road, means that when somebody comes along with a really stupid idea, we should just pat them on their soft little heads and say "Good for you! Here's a cookie!"

 

[Jeff F]

I knew when I saw the title of this thread it was going to be another good one.

 

[jpatterson]

This thread is quickly going down The Low Road. Mods and members alike.

 

[Gord]

if I am stupid enough to run outside into unknown situations the way guys like Tactical Ninja think you should.

You could try putting down the wood-grain alcohol and reading my responses accurately:

How do you know where the BG is, or will be? How do you know he doesn't have backup waiting in a shadowy corner of the yard, or around front?

By which I meant - quite plainly, as far as I can see, but maybe others can chime in if that sounds ambivalent somehow (anybody?) - that if someone kicks down your door at 2AM, they aren't necessarily going to enter the house. They might, say, kick in the door, and then move back out of sight in order to get the drop on you when you step outside to look around and shut and lock the door again.
They might break a window as a diversion, and then come at you from a different window or door, maybe on the other side of the house. They might have a partner already waiting in a different location to barge in while your attentions are focused elsewhere. They might do any number of things that you obviously haven't given a moment's thought to, because you're perfectly happy to sit on your behind with your fingers in your ears and believe wholeheartedly that your home invasion will go Exactly As Planned.

You've been going around and around in circles for a dozen or more posts now, with not a shred of reason to be found. You're indignant, brash and accusatory in the same breaths as you are whining for people to Get Off Your Case, Man, You Didn't Mean It Like That. You've provoked every negative response. I'm not sure what else you're expecting.

I knew when I saw the title of this thread it was going to be another good one.

We aim to please.

This thread is quickly going down The Low Road. Mods and members alike.

Being that our hero continues to defy the vast amouns of logic being flung his way, it probably won't be long before Dave throws his hands up in exasperation and locks the miserable thing down. Grab a soda and some popcorn and watch the fireworks, we don't get many OPs of this... caliber in here - enjoy it while you can.

Internet: it's serious business.

 

[sm]

Never mind.

I said I was through with this one...

 

[SuperNaut]

Larry, I hereby take up your PGO vs. stock challenge.

Just 'cause I haven't seen you in forever and we need an excuse to hang out.

 

[RacingJake]

"A THR Primer on Courtesy"

"Most of the following are suggestions. Using them will not necessarily guarantee that you do not break the rules in other ways, but will help you be welcomed as a polite member of the group.

Vulgarity:
1. The quality or condition of being vulgar.
2. Something, such as an act or expression, that offends good taste or propriety (American Heritage Dictionary).

This is in opposition to being polite, which is what you agreed to when you registered. "Creative" attempts to get around the language filter are not acceptable. They are an obvious disregard for other members and THR's mission of reaching out to the uninformed and undecided people that we have a chance to better inform on RKBA issues. Such a violation of the principals of civil discussion may subject you to disciplinary action. There are words that are not blocked out by the language filter, usage of which will demean what you have to say and that will lower the level of conversation to the "locker room".

Don't insult people, but challenge arguments. Correcting factual information or discussing how your experience varies from another member's is very different from slinging personal insults.

In the same vein, don't insult others indirectly by posting stories, articles, jokes, etc., for the sole purpose of disparaging a group, profession, state, or country. We have a wide variety of members from many professions, states, and countries; nothing is gained by attempts to belittle them, but a great deal can be lost."

 

[Okiecruffler]

Well, I will say this. If I was in a nasty, unfriendly situation buut had a couple of the good folks on this board, DAve, Steve, Larry, so many qualify, at my back with a PGO, I would feel fairly comfortable. But I also know they would be wishing they had a full stock.
Try a tactical (see I can use the word with out spelling it "tackycool") reload with your PGO without lowering it from ready.

 

[JShirley]

PGO shotguns do have their place. That place is as powerful reactionary defensive tools for those who cannot have a stock due to size constraints. They also make good breachers or backup weapons for CQB. I saw one just before a raid by 3rd Group in early '07, (actually, it was a Serbu Shorty 12, but I guess that's close enough to PGO for gov'mint work). Understand that the E7 holding it was using a 10.5" M4 as primary. And those guys always used their stocks. I never saw any ODA or attached troop firing their M4 from the hip.

I believe folks with those limitations are now probably better served with the newer sliding stocks and a pistol grip. Sliding stocks may not shoulder as well as more traditional stocks, but any stock beats no stock.

John

 

[Bartkowski]

This thread is quickly going down The Low Road. Mods and members alike.

I wouldn't say that. It isn't the best and most polite thread, but there isn't anything low road about it.

I just spent a fair amount of time reading the whole thread and bleachcola, why do you insist on posting every thought in a different post. Did someone pick on you for having a low post count?

This thread was a huge waste of time though. It comes down to this. Some members on here have very well trained and have experienced a lot more than you(bleachcola) and they have offered a suggestion. You decide you are better off with a PGO shotgun and argue that they are great for some people. The others disagree, and you still think they are good for your situation.

I don't see anything changing here and don't care what anyone uses to defend themselves. It's not me they are defending, so if they make a bad decision and choose a PGO shotgun its their choice.

 

[kingpin008]

Entertaining as it's been, I don't see why this thread is even still open. There's not a whole lot left to be said, on either side, and opinions on both sides seem pretty firmly set.

I agree that it hasn't gone low-road yet, but I wonder how much further it can go before all that's left is low-road. I'm not calling for it to be closed, but I am curious as to what benefit it brings to the board by remaining open.

 

[Gord]

It's high entertainment.

 

[bleachcola]

You guys put this much effort into bashing folks in the revolver forum? No major police or military force in the world uses that platform. So it is fine for folks to use a revolver in defensive situations bc that is what they are comfortable with, though tactically inferior. Yet someone wants to use a PGO and you act like he's the antichrist here to steal your souls. Why the double standard?

 

[JShirley]

The only thing the revolver "suffers" from is limited capacity. It has benefits that can be weighed against that, such as simplicity, reliability, and additional power.

The PGO-shotgun is another matter entirely. It is, in effect, a poorly balanced pistol firing a powerful load.

If you look at what's been said, your COMMENTS especially have been bashed, and that's because you've said some stupid stuff. I'm not saying you are stupid, but contending that a PGO is somehow better because you hit stuff with it at the range is ridiculous. YOU put yourself into a position of arguing that PGO was better, and then are unable to defend that untenable position, because it's not true.

Suggesting that people break into your house and act as moving targets just moved your posts from ill-considered to outright idiotic and juvenile.

We perhaps should have locked the thread when you did that. Those comments were actually that stupid, just dumber than rocks stupid. Like, stupid squared stupid. More like stupid to the nth power. I in fact am going to close this thread, on reflection. Dave can feel free to open it back if he sees any value in it.

John