I live in fairly rural area and I carry openly quite often. A few years back I diffused a very sticky situation by simply turning a little so the BGs could see the piece on my belt, problem solved! I found it quite interesting how their demeanor changed and how quickly they had to be going. That said I probably wouldn't go walking around in the city OC all the time, but I sure as heck will if I want to.
Open Carry
- Thread starter Shortdog22
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jayofthejungle1985
Member
I think some people look too deep into carrying openly. I ve never even gotten a second look from people, nothing to tell me anyone even notices... oh 1 time a little girl asked me if was a cop.... i dont do it all the time but ive done it enough... at least as far as my part of the country goes.... its not that serious
PennsyPlinker
Member
JesseL put it very well. There are always going to be detractors who come up with whole lists of reasons why you should not open carry. But they are just that - lists. If you want to do some serious research on OC, go over to the PAFOA site (www.pafoa.org) and read the journals some of us are keeping on our OC experiences. WARNING: I am not responsible if you are bored to tears for reading "OC'd today, nothing happened", over and over again. 
Many of us list the places we have visited, with reactions or non reactions noted.
There is one HUGE thread going on regarding a very serious violation of the law - by the police. There is going to be lots more coming down the road on that as well. But overall, OC turns out to be a quiet, boring, yet comfortable activity, despite the doomsayers who claim otherwise.
Many of us list the places we have visited, with reactions or non reactions noted.There is one HUGE thread going on regarding a very serious violation of the law - by the police. There is going to be lots more coming down the road on that as well. But overall, OC turns out to be a quiet, boring, yet comfortable activity, despite the doomsayers who claim otherwise.
Prince Yamato
Member
Note the emotional responses to everything. This is why I said, when all carry laws are equal, open carry is more of a first amendment issue than a second amendment one.
Carry however you wish, but personally, when I can legally carry, I prefer to carry concealed. My being armed is nobody's business but my own. And having my weapon concealed may offer a tactical advantage.
I agree completely.
I have also noticed that some amongst the OC crowd could easily be categorized as confrontational. Not all, just several. Their whine goes something like "I GOT MY RIGHTS!" While this is true, do you really want to be the "test case" for your portion of town? Just because something is "legal" does not necessarily mean it is a good idea in every case.
To me, CC has advantages that I prefer to avail myself of.
ScottyT
Member
I have been OCing everywhere but work for a little over 3 months now, the only time I ever see someone else do it is when a few OCers get together for dinner or whatever. I have done it while wearing slacks and a shirt and tie, and I have done it wearing shorts and a t-shirt. In those 3 months I have had exactly ZERO negative encounters with anyone, and at least 10 positive encounters from curious folks.
95% of people are locked in condition white and will never see it.
95% of the people who do see it don't mention it.
100% (so far) of the people who mention it are either:
-Asking what kind of gun it is
-Saying "nice gun"
-Asking about the laws (or lack thereof) that permit OC
-Telling me they CC all the time and it is great to see someone openly exercising their rights.
Nobody has called the cops -- or at least the cops haven't actually responded. Nobody has run away screaming about a man with a gun. Nobody has been shot --- well, I guess in the last three months lots of people have been shot, but none as a result of my OC!
95% of people are locked in condition white and will never see it.
95% of the people who do see it don't mention it.
100% (so far) of the people who mention it are either:
-Asking what kind of gun it is
-Saying "nice gun"
-Asking about the laws (or lack thereof) that permit OC
-Telling me they CC all the time and it is great to see someone openly exercising their rights.
Nobody has called the cops -- or at least the cops haven't actually responded. Nobody has run away screaming about a man with a gun. Nobody has been shot --- well, I guess in the last three months lots of people have been shot, but none as a result of my OC!
OMGWTFBBQ
Member
I think most of us can agree that OC should be legal, and that no one should be hassled by police if they choose to OC. Unfortunately the only way to go about making sure it stays that way is to educate people and show them that your average Joe with a pistol on his hip is no more dangerous than if he were unarmed by being an example. The flip side of course is that wrong or right it can and will get you hassled in alot of places, whether it's legal or not. Many people see it as being too big of a PITA to bother trying to change that by exercising their right, others don't.
As someone whos parents are moving to KY and not being a resident when I visit them I was wondering if I had a pistol tucked into my waistband(in a holster) would that be OC(tucked in shirt no jacket visiting them in Aug.)? It's a full size 1911 so it's not tiny
NavyLCDR
member
It would be close. Why not wear a belt holster on the outside of the pants? There would be no question, then. I do not know what the legal definition of concealed is in AZ. Some states define it as the whole case/weapon must be visible, some define it as only enough must remain visible to clearly identify it as a weapon.
NavyLCDR
member
Here's the definition of concealed in AZ statutes:
F. Subsection A, paragraph 1 of this section shall not apply to a weapon or weapons carried in a belt holster which holster is wholly or partially visible, or carried in a scabbard or case designed for carrying weapons which scabbard or case is wholly or partially visible or carried in luggage. Subsection A, paragraph 2 of this section shall not apply to a weapon or weapons carried in a case, holster, scabbard, pack or luggage that is carried within a means of transportation or within a storage compartment, map pocket, trunk or glove compartment of a means of transportation.
F. Subsection A, paragraph 1 of this section shall not apply to a weapon or weapons carried in a belt holster which holster is wholly or partially visible, or carried in a scabbard or case designed for carrying weapons which scabbard or case is wholly or partially visible or carried in luggage. Subsection A, paragraph 2 of this section shall not apply to a weapon or weapons carried in a case, holster, scabbard, pack or luggage that is carried within a means of transportation or within a storage compartment, map pocket, trunk or glove compartment of a means of transportation.
I generally CC. However, in Virginia, you have to OC while eating in a restaurant that serves alcohol. I've had someone ask me or talk to me about my gun, maybe a dozen times in the almost-13 years I've been carrying.
Even with a two-tone FEG PA63 on, people rarely notice. I also tend to sit in booths, with my gun side toward the wall.
Now, if I'm out with a bunch of RKBA activists, that changes. That, however, is a case where I AM trying to make a point by OCing.
Even with a two-tone FEG PA63 on, people rarely notice. I also tend to sit in booths, with my gun side toward the wall.
Now, if I'm out with a bunch of RKBA activists, that changes. That, however, is a case where I AM trying to make a point by OCing.
I've lived in two different states where OC is lawful (NC and VA) and I've exercised it in both. I OC'd exclusively in NC, and now that I'm in VA I will CC about half the time, and OC when I don't feel like trying to hide it. When I OC, it's a 4" XD 45 worn at 3:00. I have yet to have a single problem (knock on wood). I don't consider myself confrontational, nor am I trying to shove anything down anyone's throats.
Also, I don't see how me having a gun on my hip is more of a statement than someone's "Save the whales" bumper sticker, or their "Obama 08" sign in their front yard. I don't care about their views, and most people don't care about mine. The greater majority of people don't even notice it. Most of the time, I get "Is that a glock?". I can count the number of times on one hand that I've been asked if I was a cop, or "why do you need that thing". I just calmly explain that it's my right as an American and that it's perfectly legal. This usually goes into a brief conversation where people ask me about my experience with it, and that's about it. As a matter of fact, I ran into someone in NC a few weeks later, and they had a Sig on their hip.
If it's not for you, then so be it. Just like I don't care if your car is plastered in "Go Green" and "Vote Democrat" stickers, you shouldn't care if I don't feel like trying to hide a gun under my tee-shirt today.
Every time that this topic comes up, it's the same arguement. For those that don't want to OC, then don't. Just like CC, OC has it's advantages and disadvantages. All I have to say is, don't knock it until you try it. If you've have no experience OCing, then (for the most part) you have nothing of value to add to a conversation about OC (besides what you've read on the internet). I don't mean to be rude, really, but if you don't know what you're talking about, stay out of it.
Also, I don't see how me having a gun on my hip is more of a statement than someone's "Save the whales" bumper sticker, or their "Obama 08" sign in their front yard. I don't care about their views, and most people don't care about mine. The greater majority of people don't even notice it. Most of the time, I get "Is that a glock?". I can count the number of times on one hand that I've been asked if I was a cop, or "why do you need that thing". I just calmly explain that it's my right as an American and that it's perfectly legal. This usually goes into a brief conversation where people ask me about my experience with it, and that's about it. As a matter of fact, I ran into someone in NC a few weeks later, and they had a Sig on their hip.
If it's not for you, then so be it. Just like I don't care if your car is plastered in "Go Green" and "Vote Democrat" stickers, you shouldn't care if I don't feel like trying to hide a gun under my tee-shirt today.
Every time that this topic comes up, it's the same arguement. For those that don't want to OC, then don't. Just like CC, OC has it's advantages and disadvantages. All I have to say is, don't knock it until you try it. If you've have no experience OCing, then (for the most part) you have nothing of value to add to a conversation about OC (besides what you've read on the internet). I don't mean to be rude, really, but if you don't know what you're talking about, stay out of it.
As a matter of fact, I have carried openly when in Arizona. I still prefer to conceal my gun. I don't have any great desire to publicize my views to strangers, and I'm candidly puzzled by all the folks who festoon their vehicles with bumper stickers announcing their political views, what their other car is and the accomplishments of their kids. If they want to it it, they of course may; but I think it's silly.
And just as I prefer generally keeping my thoughts to myself, unless and until I choose to disclose them to whom and in the manner I see fit, I believe that concealing my weapon gives me a tactical advantage.
I've had a few conversations on this point with some of my instructors during various visits to Gunsite, and the overall feeling seems to be that the tactical advantage of keeping one's weapon concealed outweighs any deterrent effect of carrying openly.
And just as I prefer generally keeping my thoughts to myself, unless and until I choose to disclose them to whom and in the manner I see fit, I believe that concealing my weapon gives me a tactical advantage.
I've had a few conversations on this point with some of my instructors during various visits to Gunsite, and the overall feeling seems to be that the tactical advantage of keeping one's weapon concealed outweighs any deterrent effect of carrying openly.
The one that commits the crime.
Not to many years ago many of you CCW's were begging for support from those who had the right to carry. Many OC'ers responded and helped out as your states buckled and gave you the right to carry. Now in your infinite wisdom many denounce what and how we do something. Now that's gratitude for you. When there is a thread about CCW seldom do you see a remark about OC, but on the other hand an OC thread brings the CCW remarks out in droves. These remarks also seem to point to actions no one has actually seen committed. How about those who have never personally experienced legal OC refrain from all the speculations and rumors.
Like I said, if OCing makes you nervous, or you don’t like it, then don’t do it. Simple as that. I don’t see OCing as “publicizing my views”; I see it as me being unwilling to wear something heavier than a t-shirt when I go grocery shopping. I do CC often, it really just depends on which gun I want to carry that day.
"I've had a few conversations on this point with some of my instructors during various visits to Gunsite, and the overall feeling seems to be that the tactical advantage of keeping one's weapon concealed outweighs any deterrent effect of carrying openly."
What is this opinion of "tactical advantage" based on? For the average guy, I don't think having my weapon concealed provides me any advantage when I go to Wal-Mart over the weekend. The advantages and disadvantages of both styles have been discussed thoroughly. What most people don’t seem to realize is, even though I don’t have a shirt over my gun, I’m not flaunting it. It’s apparently fairly discrete, because no one seems to knows. I’m not trying to push my views on you, or say that you should OC everywhere you go, just explain that it’s not as bad as some people make it out to be. As always, your experience with it may have been totally different than mine, which is why you’re opposed to it, and that’s understandable.
"I've had a few conversations on this point with some of my instructors during various visits to Gunsite, and the overall feeling seems to be that the tactical advantage of keeping one's weapon concealed outweighs any deterrent effect of carrying openly."
What is this opinion of "tactical advantage" based on? For the average guy, I don't think having my weapon concealed provides me any advantage when I go to Wal-Mart over the weekend. The advantages and disadvantages of both styles have been discussed thoroughly. What most people don’t seem to realize is, even though I don’t have a shirt over my gun, I’m not flaunting it. It’s apparently fairly discrete, because no one seems to knows. I’m not trying to push my views on you, or say that you should OC everywhere you go, just explain that it’s not as bad as some people make it out to be. As always, your experience with it may have been totally different than mine, which is why you’re opposed to it, and that’s understandable.
JesseL
Member
Paragon said:
IMHO, it's often based on peoples tendency to focus on short term tactics and ignore strategy. A lot of people are inclined to ponder the open vs. concealed question in terms of "which is better if I find myself in a fight?", whereas the question should be "which is better for my long term survival?" *. It becomes obvious that avoiding fights is better than winning them and the value of deterrence has been thoroughly proven many times.
The first line of defense with a home security system is the sign in the front yard, for a poisonous frog it is its bright color, for a country it is a conspicuously well equipped military (including publicized nuclear tests), and my first line of defense is an openly carried sidearm.
*There have been a few concealed carriers who gave the impression that they would prefer a chance to whip out their pistol and surprise a mugger, over never running into the mugger at all.
I am a resident of Maryland, but have another home in West Virginia. I have several non-resident concealed carry permits from other states. When I'm in West Virgnia I have to carry open as they do not recognize any non-resident permits and do not issue a non-resident permit themselves.
When in Virginia, you have to expose your concealed carry piece whenever you enter a restaurant to eat (if they also serve alcohol). So, although I would rather carry concealed most of the time, in these two states I am forced to carry openly all or part of the time.
When in Virginia, you have to expose your concealed carry piece whenever you enter a restaurant to eat (if they also serve alcohol). So, although I would rather carry concealed most of the time, in these two states I am forced to carry openly all or part of the time.
Paragon, do as you wish. I have no desire to debate the point, and the choices others make are not my concern. I've merely described by thinking and experience.
Shortdog22
member
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- May 27, 2008
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I really appreciate all the input from everybody. I will OC when I feel its good policy to do so. I don't want any confrontations, and am not that worried about violence. If it comes my way so be it, hope I am OCing at the time or I can get to my PK or glove box or whatever. Listening to everyone rings true. CC gives the advantages of surprise and privacy, while OC gives the advantages of deterrent, public awareness, and probly a quicker draw! Hope I can get my CCW but until then the afore is the way to go I reckon.
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