Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by SharpDog, Sep 11, 2022.
Another option would be put a 16" upper on it, right?
Here are your options on what to do with a braced pistol if/when the rule change goes into effect.
This information has been posted several times on The High Road in multiple threads.
As far as the amnesty thing goes. For now all we know is that the ATF has asked for funding. I don't think anyone has seen where this is a 100% sure thing that is going to happen.
We need to wait for the rule change and amnesty to be released before we know exactly what is going on.
the ramifications of the BATF pistol brace amnesty period, I am wondering what to do if I (potentially) have a braced AR pistol:
''If U bought it from an FFL assembled that way (ed: that is, with a brace attached) your choices become narrower and this is how I understand it. 1-install a 16'' barrel, 2-register it 3-destroy it per ATF rules. And there are other things linked with the next post...''
That (* ^)would seem to be not true as per the ATF document provided here (below)....
And also as published verbatim in a Senatorial letter attachment...
specifically, pg2 para #4;
''...and later added
one, ATF will permit them to destroy their pistol braces (but not if the gun owners purchased the firearms
already equipped with braces). Or they can...''
IF, the letter refers to a brace is in fact a stock, which IS the ATFs position for101 of 100 people who own them. In any event, the Senators of which are all attorneys didn't pull their portion of letter out of thin air.
So it does seem that a braced AR pistol purchased manufactured as so e.g. through an FFL , that particular owner cannot simply remove the brace, destroy it and be in compliance.
FORTUNATELY, this will all be hashed out in court soon !
I’m bring back the late 90’s $15 people!!! Good Enough too
Gag me with a spoon!
If OAL includes the brace, then with a collapsible brace at maximum extension wouldn't the firearm be over 26" in OAL even with a very short barrel?
Didn't some piddly-dinky Agency recently get spanked for doing something like that?
I'm not signing this one so nobody will know who posted it.
If you read the entire worksheet and the proposed rule change along with older letters, an AR pistol is measured from the end of the buffer tube to the end of the muzzle ( unless muzzle device is permanently attached)
The ATF has already determined that folders are measured in the folded position when attached to pistols with braces. They went after people with AR’s (both with and without braces) that were over 26” OAL with a folder AND a VFG. The ATF determined that with the folder folded those were now under 26” and were unregistered AOW’s
Not folders, a normal adjustable brace like the SBA3. But measuring till the end of the buffer tube sounds like the brace would not be considered part of the OAL, is that correct?
Correct, a brace is not included in the OAL
In section 1 of the Worksheet 4999 under explanations
And from the top of the 4999
12Bravo20, I appreciate your efforts, expertise, and attempts to tie it all together into a logical whole, but at root, it all boils down to the single word "infringed." This was added to the Constitution in order to prevent misconstruction or abuse of the government's powers.
This agency, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, is an abuse.
Thank you and yes I agree that this is infringement.
As usual, the ATF has made things clear a mud yet again. And you can do everything possible to meet the rule changes and they can still say you have an unregistered SBR if they feel like it.
This is the part that gives me heartburn. If I had a braced AR pistol, there's absolutely no way I'd send pics to the BATFE, knowing that they could simply decide, "Nope. You have an unregistered SBR. Thanks for the evidence."
12Bravo20, I want to echo 230RN's sentiment. You've obviously spent quite a bit of time and energy sorting this thing out, and you've done us all a great service in that. Thank you.
Another thing that bothers me about the worksheet is when they take about different sights not being usable at arms length. I especially disagree with them saying that the standard AR/M16 iron sights are not usable. I have no problems using A2 sights at arms length on my 9mm Colt SMG clone. And I wear bifocals too.
Straw-grasping. My crystal ball shows a guy at one of their staff meetings exclaiming that those sights are unusable at arm's length and everyone chiming in with "Right on, JB!" "Good going !" "Excellent point, JB !"
NFA'34 includes the authority to declare an amnesty. That's how they will do it. ATF will take the position that arm braces were incorrectly approved, and that any firearm so fitted must either be stripped of the brace or registered as an SBR. To evade some of the inevitable lawsuits, they would use the amnesty power to allow no-cost SBR registration.
I think what they are going to do is take their little form 4999 or what ever they call it, use the pictures and descriptions on the new amnesty form1 to say something to the effect of "you never had a braced pistol, you illegally built/bought an SBR, pay $200 or surrender it or else" for a large portion of amnesty applications. Once you send them all the information I have a feeling they're not just going to let you put a 16 barrel on it turning it into a rifle or replace the brace setup with a slick tube and forget the whole ordeal. Maybe I'm wrong, I hope I'm wrong, but I got a bad feeling. If I'm wrong this is a great way to get a free gateway NFA item.
Either way I think this is a great way to get millions of people who never heard of the NFA to start demanding it's abloshment.
If they just want to cut a whole lot of tax stamps to people screaming "shut up and take my money" all they would have to do is reinterpret the Hughes ammendment to say something else.
Since the LOWER on an AR type gun is the firearm.
What happens if you send them a photograph of the braced lower with out the upper?
Again asking for a friend
Bro, don’t play around with the AFT… they not your joking buddies, they hate gun owners and are obedient to the supreme leader
I'd say ask that one during the amnesty period.
Speaking of amnesty, I'd say be more concerned of THIS admin's super-quickness to, ''redefine'' what is a known item to...what is convenient/ politically expedient for & at the moment.
So, amnesty does exist within the law or rules, but, voila, we CHANGED the meaning to XYZ, and, you're in violations. Again.
FACT BASED SOURCE: that's what this whole thing is about! They originally said ''its Ok we examined it etc.'' then again & again, now yelln FUNZIES
I would think if they say, “well, a brace is not a stock.”, would that not blow away their entire argument for putting them into the NFA branch?
Are they really going to make braced AR pistols their own extra special type of SBR where you can only put a pistol brace on them? Yes oh yes please do it.
There's really no way this ends well for the NFA.
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