Retail powder prices-the 'economics' just hit me.

[Ignition Override]

After reloading for a year and a half, I finally divided the 454 grams in a 1 lb. bottle of IMR 4064 by the weight of a powder load, after excluding the paper cup used to hold the powder. The 'g' on the tiny digital scale should be grams.
This powder measure is for 38 grains, used in my Enfields.

With only about 105 loads per 1 lb. bottle, it occured to me that if I decide to reload the empty cases of 30-06, even with certain cheap bulk bullet prices, this might cost almost .40/rd., which is what I recently paid for a batch of M2 Ball.

Right now it's just Prvi .303, commercial .308 and "Win. 7.62".
I must have been wrong thinking that possibly reloading M2 Ball would be economical(?). Even buying powder in bulk on line, I'm not so sure that much money would be saved. The press is the Lee Single Stage with just basic equipment.

 

[Shadow 7D]

Ah, yes that old hat

Plinking rounds won't break even MOST of the time compared to the cheapest range ammo
BUT compare a custom (to your gun) accurate round with premium ammo and that's where the saving are at.

 

[LiveLife]

I reload .308 because I can tailor the accuracy of the load depending on the bullet/powder/primer used. If I want to shoot cheap plinking rounds, I use bulk steel cased ammo bought at gun shows.

I would like to shoot Black Hills ammo for .223, but even reloaded blue box is cost prohibitive for me. So I reload .223, not for cost savings as I can buy 20 rounds for about $6 at gun shows, but for accuracy of reloads.

But you are right about economics of reloading rifle, I wonder sometimes ...

As for pistol, I get both benefits - much cheaper than retail bulk ammo and match grade accuracy whether I am shooting jacketed/plated/lead bullets.

 

[dmazur]

I won't show all the math, but I get around $0.45/round for .30-06 for a Garand, using bulk prices for

Varget (8 lb)
Hornady 150gr FMJBT (1000)
CCI #34 primers (1000)
Winchester brass (1000) ... assuming 5 firings/case

I find it easier to work with grains, instead of converting to grams. 1 lb of powder is 7000gr, or around 150 loads at 46gr/load.

This is close enough to milsurp prices that I'm not interested in surplus ammo.

Besides, I get to control the ammo, instead of hoping it is uniform.

 

[scythefwd]

38 grain loads will do almost 200 cartridges per bottle. A 1 lb jug is 7000 grains (just shy of 454 grams).

Using cheap ammo, I'm doing this for .308 reloads
primers - 4$ per 100 - .04 per cartridge
Powder - at 30$ a lb - .16 per cartridge
Bullet (using sierra game kings... match kings are cheaper, .308 caliber 165 grain).35 a bullet

.55 cents a round. I'm expensive and I'm not buying in bulk it appears.

You are WAY off on your cost per round if you are only assuming 105 reloads per lbs of powder though.

$40.00/7000gr of powder =0.004285714 $ per grain of powder
0.005714286$ x 38gr = 0.162857143 $ per cartridge

7000 grains in a lb / 38 grains per charge = 184.210526316 cartridges per lb.

3000 cents per lb / 184.210526316 = 16.2857143 cents per cartridge (a number arrived at via multiple methods).

Using pulled M2 projectiles, at $150 per 1k, or 15 cents per round, your cost is down to 34 cents a round. That is surplus ammo range with custom ammo quality...

 

[Funshooter45]

$40/lb for powder???

Wow, and I thought we were getting hosed here. At the local gun shops, I can buy Ramshot powders for about $21/lb, Hodgdon costs $25/lb, Reliant costs $29/lb and Vihta Vuori costs $32/lb. Now that I have finally decided on at least a few favorites, I think it might be time to buy a good bit from Powder Valley at $19/lb.

 

[oneounceload]

Even buying powder in bulk on line,

Incorrect.

Typical 1# prices around here are 25-30 per pound. 8# jugs on line cost me $110 delivered, or about HALF

Same thing for primers - 209's cost me $4/100 or 40/1000 which equals 200 per sleeve. I buy a sleeve of 5000 on line for 115, almost HALF again

 

[IlikeSA]

You also have to count the shipping of that heavy ammo to your house when looking at prices.

 

[Galil5.56]

You might look into casting your own bullets, and save a ton for mid velocity plinker ammo. These same cast bullets many times can have a gas check added, but makes the price jump quite a bit unless you make your own from free aluminum cans.

Properly cast and sized rifle bullets using a gas check, and good lube can be driven to full .303 service velocities (180 grain), and faster from what I have read from others. I drive 150 grain cast bullets I make to 2000-2200 fps or so, and performance is very good, and cheap. Without gas checks I drive the same bullet to 1300-1400 fps, accuracy is very good, and costs less than .10/round.

As for cheap M2, I'm afraid those days are long over with current regs, $4+/lb copper, and huge shipping cost... I'm on my last lot of WW 147 grain FMJ BTs I bought 15 years ago, and folks would cry if I said what I paid for them.

 

[scythefwd]

fun - its what i paid.... cant use their rang if the components aren't bought there... and they can ask for receipts. i can probably do 30-35 for a can of h4895, 20 online.

ilikisA- think about how much can be shoved into a flat rate box. i can squeeze several hundred match kings into the 6ish dollar box.

Fun - correction and good catch. I was looking at the line on the receipt for my partitions. The powder was 30.

 

[jcwit]

M-80 147 grain, FMJBT Spitzer bullets are still available for $125.00 a thousand.

 

[Cosmoline]

That's why you load up cast bullet plinkers using a pistol powder load. I save Varget and the pricey powders for the expensive bullet loads. It's too hard to find powder here to be wasting it on ordinary practice rounds.

 

[armoredman]

You can't use the range unless you buy your components there? Is there another range you can use? Egads.

 

[Shmackey]

Incorrect.

Typical 1# prices around here are 25-30 per pound. 8# jugs on line cost me $110 delivered, or about HALF

Same thing for primers - 209's cost me $4/100 or 40/1000 which equals 200 per sleeve. I buy a sleeve of 5000 on line for 115, almost HALF again

Where can I get 8-lb containers of powder for $110 delivered? I want.

 

[scythefwd]

armored - the nearest all year range is 1.5 hours from where I live. The closest range requires a 300 a year deposit (wont save that much in the difference in components costs to off set the expenditure) or is only open for some of the year. The one I go to is the nicest of the three.

The one I go to has the policy that you buy the ammo or components there... They are a little more expensive, but that goes to keeping the range open so all in all it's the best bet. Their ammo selection is better than a box store, though not near what bass pro (the one here is extremely well varied for caliber) or green top have. One of the few places I can find .32HR mag on the shelves. The only place I can find aguila ammo.

 

[EddieNFL]

With only about 105 loads per 1 lb. bottle...

Are you loading 66 grains in the .303 or the .30/06?

 

[noylj]

If all you care about is saving money, then reloading is not for you.
Most cost is for bullets and cases.
8# of 4064 at Powder Valley runs $136.50. Varget is $139.50 for 8#. Of course, you need to place a large enough to offset the $25 HazMat.

 

[oneounceload]

Where can I get 8-lb containers of powder for $110 delivered? I want.

I get mine from my shotgun club - have a jug of Red Dot coming this week

 

[Sawblade]

Can only shoot reloads if you use their components?

I'd be finding a different range. It's one thing not letting you shoot reloads out of rentals or even not at all, but allowing their components only is over the top.

 

[scythefwd]

Well, sawblade. i could always travel another 40 miles to get to the next one that allows me to shoot rifles.

I don't think you guys appreciate the situation, possibly from having ranges close to you. I have to take 3 hours out of my day just for travel to even shoot rifles. Period. There ARE NO ALTERNATIVES. So either I can play their game and pay an extra 20 dollars per 150+ rounds worth of components, or I can spend more than than getting to the next closest range. Get over the "I cant live with these rules so I'll go elsewhere" because there isn't anywhere else to go. Remember, not every is so blessed as to have land to shoot on or a range 20 minutes from the house. The rest of us have to get by where we can. I can spend an extra 8 dollars round trip every time I go to the range, or I can spend a total of 20 dollars or so extra for the whole 180 rounds (which will take me more than 3 range trips to fire off).

 

[Funshooter45]

Ahhh... I see now. Yep, some of us don't know how good we have it. For long range rifles, I shoot on a friend's 640 acres just 10 minutes from my house. We have our bench there with target stands (old pallets actually) at measured distances of 100-500 yds. Nobody around for miles and no other shooters either.

Now that you say the powder cost is only $30 instead of $40 a pound, it's n ot so obscene. So... you have your receipt for a couple jugs you already bought there right? Keep that receipt, but buy some cheaper powder elsewhere once in awhile. Who's to say where that exact powder came from that you're shooting?

 

[scythefwd]

fun .. still on first jug. for what I reload, brass won't cost a thing, so powder is the only real cost. I'm getting a couple of 50 cal ammo cans and a "bucket" full of once fired .308. Just about everybody at work shoots .40 and they don't reload. 9mm is the same deal. I'll only save a couple dollars for a jug of powder shopping elsewhere, but I'll spend more in gas getting to the shops. Closest LGS/gun shop is gander mountain or dicks. I'm lucky if they carry my powder. Next is green top, which is awesome to shop at the 2-3 times a year I head that direction (its 20 miles south of me and I work to the north of me). The range is on the way home from work (though I don't like leaving rifles in the car for 8 hours at work).

Back to the original topic on hand... If I was shooting surplus, I probably wouldn't bother as I can't compete price wise. I could probably match price on surplus, but with all the extra time I wouldn't see it as worth it. On the other hand, I do save a buttload of money on rifle ammo vs. commercial stuff because of the insane prices they are asking per box of partition loaded stuff.

 

[jcwit]

Just did a google search for ranges near Ladysmith, Va and I got 6 ranges within 1/2 hour of Ladysmith.

 

[scythefwd]

JC - The range is handgun only.
Quantico is not open to non military.
Dominion is indoor only, 25yd.
Range 82 is about the same distance. Not open to Rifle shooting everyday. 250 a year membership fee and a background check just to become a member. 16 dollars a first hour, 4 dollars every 15 minutes after that for guests.
Fredericksburg Rod and Gun club is a members only range... must be sponsored AND $300 initiation fee. It's an hour away, so the extra half hour saved, plus gas, and the lower price of reloading components won't add up to $300 a year.

The range at CF Phelps is only open September through March.

A couple others I was able to pull up aren't really ranges but stores. If you came up with different results, please PM them to me. I'd love to NOT have to drive 1.5 hours to shoot. I might be able to get in at Quantico if I can find a coworker who can work with my schedule to sponsor me there. I just don't like taking firearms on to Post. I'll get over that before getting over a couple hundred dollar membership fee to a hunt club (local and not in the Google results, only open part of the year).

 

[jcwit]

Probably shouldn't say it and its only ment in jest, DO NO TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY.

My first thought was "move".

I've sure got it luckly here in No. Indiana, closest range that I can use if 6 miles from my front door. Indoor range that I a member of is 12 miles from my door. Outdoor range that I frequent most because of friend there is 30 miles away.

Best to you
jcwit