Sam Gabbert of SGAmmo on the status of Russian ammo

[Poper]

Am I paranoid to think of Our Leaders saying "Let's take a break from ruining the national economy, public health, and foreign relations and think of a way to screw gun owners that won't have to go through congress or the courts."

Yes, IMHO.......

 

[OleBuckshot]

Well, it’ll take some time (probably more than we’d like) for them to move it to another country and repackage it. Like China does with honey.

 

[Jim Watson]

I could believe that but if you can no longer import Russin ammo and you want to setup and become that US ammo maker making these hard to find Russian calibers it would be a wise investment. And if the market gets slow at some point in the future there are lots of reloaders that would be happy to buy primers from you.

SIG is adding brass drawing and primers to their Mississippi operation to free themselves from Vista and WW. I don't know if that will end up with SIG components on the retail market, but it will somewhat loosen up the overall supply.

 

[Jim Watson]

Yep, I’d say 80+% of my “never shoot” stash is Russian.

That kind of hurts my head. You have ammunition you do not intend to shoot? So what is it for? Barter after the apocalypse or something?

 

[mcb]

SIG is adding brass drawing and primers to their Mississippi operation to free themselves from Vista and WW. I don't know if that will end up with SIG components on the retail market, but it will somewhat loosen up the overall supply.

A few more independent primer makers is definitely a good thing for the US firearms/ammunition market in general and hopefully us reloaders too.

 

[DeepSouth]

That kind of hurts my head. You have ammunition you do not intend to shoot? So what is it for? Barter after the apocalypse or something?

That’s kind of the point, I don’t know what it’s for. As they tell me at work when I have to work Overtime for no obvious reason and I ask why……. Just in case.

Another way to put it is that I’d rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

It’s simply staying a little more prepared for _______.

 

[Shanghai McCoy]

I remember back in the 1990's when Clinton banned the Chicom ammo from being imported. Ironically, it was Russian and other former Soviet Bloc countries that picked up the "slack".
If the hole is big enough someone will try to make a buck filling it...

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

That kind of hurts my head. You have ammunition you do not intend to shoot? So what is it for? Barter after the apocalypse or something?

I call it "New Money."

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

I remember back in the 1990's when Clinton banned the Chicom ammo from being imported. Ironically, it was Russian and other former Soviet Bloc countries that picked up the "slack".
If the hole is big enough someone will try to make a buck filling it...

True, but the Ruskies already had recently idled plant capacity paid for and ready to go.

 

[twarr1]

Once you have the manufacture's FFL and required paper work to manufacture ammunition they can buy the raw material and make their own primers.

I’m not sure it’s that simple. Obtaining the chemicals to make primers has its own tangles of red tape and hoops.

 

[Shanghai McCoy]

I call it "New Money."

In one of P J O'rourke's essays from Somalia one of the members of his security crew pulls out his Glock and calls it "The Mastercard of the future.."

 

[mcb]

I’m not sure it’s that simple. Obtaining the chemicals to make primers has its own tangles of red tape and hoops.

True but once you in deep enough to become a licensed ammunition manufacture that extra paper work for that is relatively trivial in comparison. Its just paper work and following the rules. In the grand scheme of things not all that difficult just time consuming and moderately expensive.

 

[WiTom]

It will be alot harder, to open up another one of those spam cans, to feed those hungry SKS's, from here on. It was already bad, but this is just another papercut on the path of us shooters, to slowly bleed out. The anti-gun crowd just keeps up their slow march to the endgame.

 

[Old Dog]

These trade laws can change quickly. I don’t think we’ve seen the end of Russian ammo imports. It’s a political bargaining chip in an endless poker game.

At least one other person here gets it.

While I have been a loyal patron of SGAmmo for a long time, Mr. Gabbert is in the business of selling ammunition. Just sayin' ...

Is it being rude of me to suggest that some folks actually read the new policy proposed by the State Department?
https://www.state.gov/fact-sheet-un...-russia-for-the-poisoning-of-aleksey-navalny/

It hasn't helped that the NRA has fueled the hysteria about this issue by declaring that the sanctions will "certainly lead to more ammunition shortages, higher prices, and therefore fewer Americans excising their fundamental right" as well as "It may also result in the shuttering of American small businesses that rely heavily on the importation of Russian ammunition. All of this is of course by design for the Biden Administration."

It's not that I personally have any love or respect for, or trust in, the Biden administration, but this is simply another political ploy, intended to impact one of Russia's big export items, pressure Putin for the (alleged) plot against Navalny and be something Biden can later point to as an accomplishment in his campaign for "gun safety." Clinton exercised many of the same sort of tactics (mainly directed against China, of course).

 

[entropy]

Agree with all those saying "whaaaa????" to the numbers. Just looking through the brass piles, there is VERY little steel cased 5.56 (for example) at the several ranges I frequent. Like... 1% of the cases left behind (and there's a LOT of brass left on the ground so there's not obviously survivorship bias at work here). Also comports with what is in people's bags when I am at club matches, walk down the line, etc. 9 mm? I'll see a handful of steel cases once a year. 7.62x39? Sure. Makarov, 54R, etc? Sure. But western cartridges? Naw.

There will have to be parts of the country where they shoot nothing but russian 5.56 and 9 to make up for those numbers. I want to see the math on that.

Read below. Not everybody immediately shoots up what the just bought. Also consider that some of it probably gets shot up on 'the back forty' or other private places, particularly when conditions for recovering brass are sketchy. I tend to shoot steel cased ammo more often in the winter, because I am not going to dig through snow to recover brass.

I bet we don’t see much steel cases at the range because lots of it never gets shot. It’s at the bottom of deep stacks in the basement!

And at strategically placed individual deployment caches.

 

[vintovka]

Almost all the discarded cases at our rural range are steel. Been seeing fewer and fewer "mag dump piles" lately. Most all the brass gets picked up either by shooters or scavengers even .22s!!!

 

[Jim Watson]

My protege shot 9mm some at the indoor range last week. When she swept up the cases out of the lane, everything went in the sack. I applied a magnet to get out the steel. Looks like the previous customer had shot a box worth.

 

[wally]

I'll see you and raise you a case of pre Clinton ban Chinese 9mm, 45ACP, .308, & 5.56. The case of Chinese "steel core" in 7.62x39 may actually be collectable now.

 

[Phaedrus/69]

At least one other person here gets it.

While I have been a loyal patron of SGAmmo for a long time, Mr. Gabbert is in the business of selling ammunition. Just sayin' ...

I've been a customer of SGAmmo for 11 & 1/2 years. In that time I've yet to see Sam's advice/predictions go much wide of the mark. Just saying...

 

[Old Dog]

I have also been following his communications for a long time. And at the end of the day, he is still a distributor for whom Russian ammunition constitutes a major share of inventory and sales.

 

[Ignition Override]

A number of import professionals must be able to know at which time the first license (or contract etc) for importing Russian ammo runs out and is up for renewal, whether weeks, or months, maybe over a year (?) after September 7th.

They all seem to be keeping quiet, likely for multiple reasons.

It would be interesting to know When (the first renewal etc) is supposed to happen, and then read any corporate press releases.

 

[DoubleMag]

In the balances, I'll trust SGs opinion on this way way way over JRBjr. His being wrong has less consequence then the other.


EDITED: In bed at 11 and up since 3:30 and NO ONE needs to be burdened with my Atari score from the 70s


My apologies.

 

[Old Dog]

Anyone thinking already in eight short months that JRBs proposals aren't as bad as they look, just stay in your PJs refill your lemonade glass and get to level #20 space invaders games on your Atari. The REST of the adults got your back, no sense in squabbling with 3.4 years to go.

Yeah, so who was that directed to?

Didn't see anyone in the entire thread who didn't acknowledge the potential crap outcome of the Biden admin's continued anti-gun stupidity.

All I'm saying is that I will take the opinion of someone whose livelihood is enhanced by selling crap-tons of Russian ammo the same way I take anyone else's opinion -- by doing my own research and looking at every aspect of a given situation. (the "grain of salt" approach).

Now, when Biden's minions in the State Department indicate they're gonna try to ban importation of ammunition from Ukraine, Romania, Bulgaria, Bosnia ,Serbia, Yugoslavia, Venezuela, Philippines, Germany, Taiwan, Czech Republic, Slovenia, Mexico and Israel, then we've got a problem-- they're willing to destroy the economy so long as they can show that they're "tough on guns."

Wait and see. Thing about adulting (since you suggest that those who don't agree with you aren't good at it) is that we shouldn't be compelled to insult others who don't automatically agree with our own opinions on a topic.

 

[rust collector]

I have noticed that people tend to make statements and predictions that advance their interests. Politicians do not have a monopoly in this regard. You may agree or disagree with Sam's analysis but he has done nothing vile enough to warrant comparison to a politician.

 

[Ignition Override]

Old Dog: well-spoken.

A shooting club buddy of the guys who is a little concerned about ammo importations in the future (but has a nice ammo reserve) is almost retired, presently building twelve houses in Southaven MS and east of Memphis. He is very level-headed.
Another is a buddy who was an A-320 Captain at Northwest Airlines several years ago. His coded, Literal "walk in" vault has "many" cases of ammo and milsurp rifles , but he is very concerned about our gradual erosion of freedoms.

Most people don't conform to the standard-stereotype "Mom's basement with Cheeto Dust fingers".
Shakespeare's comment often applies in similar these discussions: "Misery loves company" (I see Lots of Misery on AKfiles, maybe many "sovereign' types...) , and on gun boards "Familiarity breeds contempt", as elsewhere.