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Should someone who carries never get drunk?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Mr. Ready, Apr 3, 2013.

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  1. Mr. Ready

    Mr. Ready Member

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    I know the first rule of concealed carry is always carry because otherwise carrying is pointless. But at the same time i know its wrong to be carrying in a state where the decision making complex and motor control are adversely affected. So is it as simple as dont go out and get drunk or high if you are someone who carries?
     
  2. PRM

    PRM Member

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    Sounds pretty simple...

    It's also illegal to CC if your intoxicated in my state. So, get caught, and you won't have to worry about legality of future carrying.
     
  3. Ryanxia

    Ryanxia Member

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    If you drink responsibly then carry on in my opinion. I'm not going to disarm every time I go out for a drink or two but at the same time if I'm going out to a bar with friends with intention of consuming an extreme amount of alcohol (rarely go to bars for that :) ) then I'll disarm.

    All depends on who you are though I guess.
     
  4. Teachu2

    Teachu2 Member

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    Some things are absolute, and this is one of them. Drinking responsibly while carrying means non-alcoholic beverages only.
     
  5. USAF_Vet

    USAF_Vet Member

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    In my state you can have your permit pulled if you are drunk while carrying.

    If you are going to drink, leave the gun at home.
     
  6. tomrkba

    tomrkba Member

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    Nope. This is a case of a rule gone too far.

    Don't carry when drinking beyond one drink. Lock your guns up and don't take them out until sober. I use the rule of one drink because two leads to ambiguity (how many did I have last hour?). This rule is more about easily tracking what you have had. Now, if you're one of the exceptions and cannot have one drink without becoming sloshed, then drink nothing while carrying.

    ONE beer or cup of wine is fine because you are not impaired enough to matter. I have no problem with one cup of wine with dinner. Any more than that goes beyond drinking the beverage for taste.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2013
  7. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

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    So you leave the gun home...

    Are you then able to adequately defend yourself from an attack of deadly force while disarmed?

    Or might you be implying that violence never befalls an alcohol consuming individual?

    When you refer to 'a state where the decision making complex and motor control are adversely affected', do you mean they are affected in a way that you are so much more able to employ bare-handed deadly force in defense of your life that you need not even carry a gun?

    Why does the consumption of alcohol automatically mean that you no longer need an effective weapon for the purposes of self defense?
     
  8. Arkansas Paul

    Arkansas Paul Member

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    Yes it is.
    The "high" part should go without saying, as it is ILLEGAL. You shouldn't do that even if you're not carrying.
    The drunk part, yeah, leave the gun at home. If you use it while drunk, it won't bode well for you if you're facing a jury. You can believe that.
    A drink or two is different.
     
  9. stumpers

    stumpers Member

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    Would you drink anything and then drive a car? I wouldn't. Even .01% won't get you a ticket for driving while intoxicated, but may get you an impaired driving ticket.

    Now think about a self defense shooting and the extreme scrutiny you'll be subjected to.

    Criminally liable? Depends on the law and who is enforcing and prosecuting it.

    Civilly liable when that crackhead's mom all the sudden cares about her boy and wants your life savings? Have fun in court telling a jury you just drank a PBR 10 minutes before shooting someone in what would normally be clear-cut self defense.
     
  10. Arkansas Paul

    Arkansas Paul Member

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    I don't think I would ever admit to drinking a PBR. :neener:
     
  11. USAF_Vet

    USAF_Vet Member

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    Are you advocating that one should break the law and carry while drunk?

    That attitude is a little irresponsible. A gun in the hand of a compromised rational mind, impaired by alcohol is a bad idea. If you think you'll need to defend yourself from a lethal threat, maybe you ought to rethink your evening plans. Carrying a gun is not always the answer.
     
  12. oneounceload

    oneounceload member

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    Absolute in YOUR mind maybe - but not everyone shares that view. Some folks can handle their liquor a whole lot better than others - it is up to each person to know their limitations and act accordingly
     
  13. mrvco

    mrvco Member

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    It's simply not worth the risk in my opinion, regardless of the legality. If you have to defend yourself and are found to have any alcohol in your blood, clearing yourself is going to be just that much harder. If you can't feel safe drinking somewhere unarmed, then either don't drink or find somewhere else to drink.

    Disarm. Drink. Sober up. Rearm.
     
  14. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

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    Getting high is not actually illegal everywhere anymore.

    Neither is carrying while intoxicated universally illegal.

    I know the OP mentions 'going out' and drinking, and I'm still trying to understand the majority of opinion here. Is it the 'going out' part that makes carrying unethical? Would a person be within his right to defend himself and his family from an attack of tremendous violence if they were barbecuing at home?

    Or does one just simply lose his right to self defense of himself and his family when alcohol has passed his lips? Must he simply stand helplessly disarmed and idle while violence overtakes him or a loved one in such a situation?

    What about contact weapons? Would it be more ethical to be armed with a good fighting knife or striking weapon while consuming adult beverages? Is it just about guns then?
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2013
  15. Ryanxia

    Ryanxia Member

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    It is not illegal to drink while carrying, not everywhere anyways.
     
  16. oneounceload

    oneounceload member

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    In many states ( and mine is one), carrying in a BAR is a no-no. However, carrying in a restaurant that serves alcohol is perfectly fine, as long as you are not sitting at the bar. Never understood the logic as the alcohol doesn't get weaker the further from the bar the waitress carries it - 6 drinks at the bar is the same as 6 drinks in a booth - but nevertheless, if you are planning a night out that involves getting gutter drunk, it would be advisable to leave the gun at home.

    If you are going to the sports bar with friends to watch the big game and eat and stay within your own limitations, than I see no issue
     
  17. Arkansas Paul

    Arkansas Paul Member

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    I'm trying to find the legalities in Arkansas. I know you can't carry anywhere (with the exception of a restaurant) that is licensed to dispense alcohol for consumption on premesis. I'm sure most states have similar restrictions, but not all.
    You have to see your states regs on it.
     
  18. Derek Zeanah

    Derek Zeanah System Administrator Staff Member

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    I'll compare this with my wife (the MD) and her take while on call.

    She doesn't drink a drop. She has never had a single drop on alcohol while she was on call. Ever. Not even once.

    The reasoning is two pronged:
    • Alcohol degrades performance. If she has to drive 100 mph to get to the hospital right freaking now because a newborn will either die, suffer brain damage, or have a normal life depending on how quickly she gets there, then she won't want to have any alcohol in her system. Even if her performance is degraded to such a small degree that it won't be indicated on any cognitive or physical aptitude tests.
    • If there's a bad outcome with a bad situation while she's on call, she doesn't want to be stuck under oath in a civil trial saying "well, I only had one or two glasses of wine."
    So, mental/physical performance + liability = no drinking while on call.

    I think this thinking translates well when carrying. You may be put in a life-or-death situation with no warning and need to respond without a lot of time for reflection. Someone may die based on your performance. If you're impaired, it's more likely to be you. If you're impaired and you prevail, then you're going to wish you hadn't been drinking when it comes time to deal with the legal system.

    Don't do it is the general rule. And it's a good one.
     
  19. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    It is that simple. If you carry you should not carry while intoxicated in any way.
     
  20. Plan2Live

    Plan2Live Member

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    All aspects of concealed carry require compromise. For me this is an absolute. The legal issues are just too big.
     
  21. mcdonl

    mcdonl Member

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    I would apply the same rules for driving. If you would not be considered impaired or over the limit to drive a vehicle than CCW is no different.

    I quit drinking, but when I did there were plenty of times I would have a beer or two on a summer day with friends, drive home and have my CCW... no laws broken, no danger to myself or anyone else.
     
  22. mljdeckard

    mljdeckard Member

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    I won't say it's absolute. I'll say it's just like driving. You know what your limit is, don't exceed it. In Utah, the legal standard is the same, .08.

    Having said that, understand, there are distinct legal disadvantages. I had a neighbor once who was home having a beer. Halfway through it, her husband called needing help, he had a flat. She went out to meet him, and in the process had a minor collision with his car. No one hurt, minor damage, single owner. But when the police came, she was telling them the story, and included the "I was having a beer" part. They cited her for DUI. She said; "But I'm well under the limit." The didn't care, if she admitted to drinking, and was then involved in an accident, it's DUI.

    Now apply this logic to carrying. If you are ever in a shooting, and you are suspected of being intoxicated, now the presumption of innocence has a BIG dent in it.
     
  23. Greg528iT

    Greg528iT Member

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    I've not gone out to "get drunk" since high school. Pretty much I've grown up since then and while I will partake in a drink or 2, I don't see the need to get drunk. I have occasionally slipped passed in control to a wee bit tipsy. If I was carrying, I would return to my car and safely store my firearm and then pass my keys to a sober companion for a ride home.
     
  24. J-Bar

    J-Bar Member

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    I don't know of any shooting range that permits alcoholic beverages to be consumed while guns are uncased. I wouldn't shoot at any range that does. If you are carrying, you are on the range.

    Will Rogers said that drinking and sex are best done at home. He was right, whether you are carrying or not.
     
  25. mrvco

    mrvco Member

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    My take:

    Assuming you do find yourself in the unfortunate situation where you have to defend yourself (regardless of location) and do make all the right and defensible decisions... it is still going to be more difficult to defend your actions if you had been drinking... one drink or a dozen, it is inevitably going to come up during the investigation.
     
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