beatledog7
Member
OP, when is getting "drunk" a good idea?
Should someone who carries never get drunk?
- Thread starter Mr. Ready
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There's the law, and there's common sense.
Obey the law or be subject to its wrath.
If the law allows you to drink but not be intoxicated but you're the type of person that does not know their limits and how to remain legal, regularly does stupid things with stupid people while intoxicated, etc then don't drink at all (..and probably not just when carrying...).
Obey the law or be subject to its wrath.
If the law allows you to drink but not be intoxicated but you're the type of person that does not know their limits and how to remain legal, regularly does stupid things with stupid people while intoxicated, etc then don't drink at all (..and probably not just when carrying...).
toiville2feathers
Member
The first rule of conceal carry is to always carry RESPONSIBLY.
If you have to ask a question like that, maybe you shouldn't have a CCW permit. Some states don't allow weapons in a place that serves alcohol or while your using or in possession of illeagal drugs.
We had an incident here in MN when the CCW holder was in the bar and got drunk. He got into an argument (just a mouthfight) and pulled his gun. The owner got the situation under control and got him to leave the bar. So far everything is in the favor of the CCW holder. He is illegal for having a gun in the bar, the owner has not called the police on him, just asked him to leave. The ccw holder leaves with a couple of friends and about 3 minutes later he comes back into the bar and fire 3 shots into the bar. Now the owner calls the LEO, this guy has stepped over the line. Now this bar is located on the Indian Reservation so this violation is a felony under the federal rules. This was at a time when the state was in the process of rewtiting the CCW rules.Of course the antis, the TV and Radio, news papers had a hay day with it for a couple months. That irresponsible SOB gave every CCW owner in the country a black eye because of his ignorance. End of the story he got 3 years in the Federal lock up and he will never be able to possess a gun again.
CCW is a tremendous responsibility and should not be taken in a cavalier attitude. When you make mistakes there is no redo available.
If you have to ask a question like that, maybe you shouldn't have a CCW permit. Some states don't allow weapons in a place that serves alcohol or while your using or in possession of illeagal drugs.
We had an incident here in MN when the CCW holder was in the bar and got drunk. He got into an argument (just a mouthfight) and pulled his gun. The owner got the situation under control and got him to leave the bar. So far everything is in the favor of the CCW holder. He is illegal for having a gun in the bar, the owner has not called the police on him, just asked him to leave. The ccw holder leaves with a couple of friends and about 3 minutes later he comes back into the bar and fire 3 shots into the bar. Now the owner calls the LEO, this guy has stepped over the line. Now this bar is located on the Indian Reservation so this violation is a felony under the federal rules. This was at a time when the state was in the process of rewtiting the CCW rules.Of course the antis, the TV and Radio, news papers had a hay day with it for a couple months. That irresponsible SOB gave every CCW owner in the country a black eye because of his ignorance. End of the story he got 3 years in the Federal lock up and he will never be able to possess a gun again.
CCW is a tremendous responsibility and should not be taken in a cavalier attitude. When you make mistakes there is no redo available.
In my state the limit for BAC is 0.04% which for most people roughly translates to one 12oz beer with a 5% ABV.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_alcohol_content#Blood_Alcohol_Level_Chart
Unfortunately, I enjoy craft beer and they come in pints (16oz), and the ABV can be in the 7-10% range, so my general rule is no drinking while carrying. Especially "out." I will drink one 12oz light beer if I am at a friend's or my parents' house, and know I am not going anywhere for a little while, but that's it. It is obviously a very serious matter, but that is what I feel comfortable with. Some people may feel comfortable drinking a bit more, and others have an absolute rule against it.
Also keep in mind, (especially those of you who have a 0.00% no-tolerance rule in your state) you only metabolize so fast, so if you drink one beer that gets you to 0.03% BAC, then wait an hour, you are still probably at about 0.02% and that next beer may put you over the limit. And likewise, if you go out for a night of fun and get drunk, and then only sleep for 6 hours, you could still be impaired the next morning when you wake up and head out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_alcohol_content#Blood_Alcohol_Level_Chart
Unfortunately, I enjoy craft beer and they come in pints (16oz), and the ABV can be in the 7-10% range, so my general rule is no drinking while carrying. Especially "out." I will drink one 12oz light beer if I am at a friend's or my parents' house, and know I am not going anywhere for a little while, but that's it. It is obviously a very serious matter, but that is what I feel comfortable with. Some people may feel comfortable drinking a bit more, and others have an absolute rule against it.
Also keep in mind, (especially those of you who have a 0.00% no-tolerance rule in your state) you only metabolize so fast, so if you drink one beer that gets you to 0.03% BAC, then wait an hour, you are still probably at about 0.02% and that next beer may put you over the limit. And likewise, if you go out for a night of fun and get drunk, and then only sleep for 6 hours, you could still be impaired the next morning when you wake up and head out.
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silicosys4
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To me, its either I carry, OR I intentionally put any amount of an intoxicating substance in my body. Not both, in any amount, ever. Drinking is a voluntary, recreational activity, and if you feel the need to be armed while drinking, I feel you should make better choices in how/where you recreationally drink.
If I feel I need to be armed to drink, I find a better place to drink in which I don't feel the need to be armed. Since I'm drinking and acknowledge that I will generally be in "looser" control of my facilities and actions, I want to be in a safe place anyways away from any chance of conflict.
If I feel I need to be armed to drink, I find a better place to drink in which I don't feel the need to be armed. Since I'm drinking and acknowledge that I will generally be in "looser" control of my facilities and actions, I want to be in a safe place anyways away from any chance of conflict.
I'll just ask this... which is more important: drinking, or having the tools to adequately defend yourself? if drinking is more important, maybe you should evaluate your drinking needs.
We don't stigmatize people who say "no thanks, I'm driving" or "i'm a designated driver", why can't that extend to "no thanks, I'm carrying." (even if you don't want to announce the fact you're carrying. just use the driving excuse.)
I like my alcohols just as much as the next person, but I take into consideration where I am, what I'm doing, and what I plan on doing before I drink.
We don't stigmatize people who say "no thanks, I'm driving" or "i'm a designated driver", why can't that extend to "no thanks, I'm carrying." (even if you don't want to announce the fact you're carrying. just use the driving excuse.)
I like my alcohols just as much as the next person, but I take into consideration where I am, what I'm doing, and what I plan on doing before I drink.
RetiredUSNChief
Member
If you're carrying concealed, you're assuming a tremendous responsibility...literally life and death over yourself and those around you.
We preach responsibility when drinking throughout the rest of our mundane lives...why should we not also preach commensurate responsibility whenever we assume the power of life and death when we carry?
I like to have a drink once in a while, myself. But I DON'T drink whenever there is a chance I might be driving and I DON'T drink whenever I carry.
For me, it's that simple.
Others may disagree, for a variety of reasons. But I say that to deliberately compromise your own physical and cognitive abilities whenever you carry is folly.
Make your own bed, knowing the risks you must take when you lie in it. Because you are the one who will suffer the potential consequences for any action you might take thereafter.
We preach responsibility when drinking throughout the rest of our mundane lives...why should we not also preach commensurate responsibility whenever we assume the power of life and death when we carry?
I like to have a drink once in a while, myself. But I DON'T drink whenever there is a chance I might be driving and I DON'T drink whenever I carry.
For me, it's that simple.
Others may disagree, for a variety of reasons. But I say that to deliberately compromise your own physical and cognitive abilities whenever you carry is folly.
Make your own bed, knowing the risks you must take when you lie in it. Because you are the one who will suffer the potential consequences for any action you might take thereafter.
Salmoneye
Member
More Nanny State rules...
No law against that here...
I am a firm believer in that if you treat adults like adults, more often than not, they behave like adults...
No law against that here...
I am a firm believer in that if you treat adults like adults, more often than not, they behave like adults...
Ranger Roberts
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I don't mind knocking a few back with friends here and there but for the most part I have all but stopped going out to bars. If I'm gonna sit back and watch a game or a MMA fight, 99.9% of the time I'm at home. For the once in a while I go out to the bar for a few I make sure of a few things: I disarm, I have a designated driver. If I don't have a designated driver, I won't drink and I will still carry. Totally my opinion, but I'm not willing to mix the 2.
Alcohol and firearms mix as well as alcohol and driving a vehicle.
smalls
Member
There are just certain things in life you take chances on. If you enjoy heading to the bar now and then, you take a chance of being attacked unarmed. Is going out every once in a while and having fun drinking worth the small chance if being attacked? That's a choice only you can make. I go out probably once a month (I work at a bar, and the discount is just too good to never take advantage of). Kinda the same as going to the post office, or other no gun zones. There's a risk to gain ratio that you need to study, and make your decision.
This is also a good reason to train in some martial arts. It may not save you from an armed attacker, but it could save your skin from most rowdies at the bar.
Working at a bar, I get offered enough free shots every night to kill me. I've had to come up with some funny reasons as to why I can't take a customers, or other employees offers.
This is also a good reason to train in some martial arts. It may not save you from an armed attacker, but it could save your skin from most rowdies at the bar.
Working at a bar, I get offered enough free shots every night to kill me. I've had to come up with some funny reasons as to why I can't take a customers, or other employees offers.
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mcdonl
Member
Alcohol and firearms mix as well as alcohol and driving a vehicle.
My point exactly. If you are under the legal limit AND SAFE to drive, you are fine to carry.
Stevie-Ray
Member
Correct. In my state it is illegal to carry while drinking-at all. Consequently, I generally don't drink anything alcoholic when out and carrying. Difference is when on private property. I do not "put my gun away" when drinking a beer or two at home, unless I have to suddenly go out. When my next door neighbor asks me over to his man-cave for a get together with the guys, neither one of us disarms. We don't give up our right to self-defense in our own homes and property. Nobody gets crazy or stinking drunk, though the beers are flowing. And neither of us is going to disarm or is even expected to. I go through the gate and not on city property, so I'm never breaking the law.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
First, you follow the laws of the state you are in, religiously! (No, I don't mean, "just on Sundays, Easter, and Christmas.)
Second, as others have said, when is going out in public to get drunk EVER a good idea? For heaven's sake, you carry a GUN (a, to some eyes, extreme measure taken to protect yourself) and yet you'll place yourself in a slowed and impaired state wherein you're far more vulnerable to both physical attack and poor judgement? And do so out in public where you've lost even the comparative static defenses of being on your own property and within your own home? This does not compute.
No. If you're carrying, you have to keep it within the limits of what a) the law allows (if any) and b) your own threshold of impairment. Even when a state (like mine) does not mandate such, I'd use the DWI limit as a good rule of thumb.
I won't disarm just to have a glass of wine with dinner or a couple of beers out with friends. That's taking things far beyond reasonable care. But I will NOT become intoxicated while carrying -- and when I'm out in public ... I'm carrying.
Second, as others have said, when is going out in public to get drunk EVER a good idea? For heaven's sake, you carry a GUN (a, to some eyes, extreme measure taken to protect yourself) and yet you'll place yourself in a slowed and impaired state wherein you're far more vulnerable to both physical attack and poor judgement? And do so out in public where you've lost even the comparative static defenses of being on your own property and within your own home? This does not compute.
No. If you're carrying, you have to keep it within the limits of what a) the law allows (if any) and b) your own threshold of impairment. Even when a state (like mine) does not mandate such, I'd use the DWI limit as a good rule of thumb.
I won't disarm just to have a glass of wine with dinner or a couple of beers out with friends. That's taking things far beyond reasonable care. But I will NOT become intoxicated while carrying -- and when I'm out in public ... I'm carrying.
You cannot adequately defend yourself when drunk. I don't know how many drunk people with brandished guns you have been around, but I've had my fair share.
You are less able to properly employ defense tactics, armed or unarmed, so the inclusion of a force multiplier does nothing to offset the intoxicated state. All it does is exacerbate the problems in reduced judgment and/or heightened aggression in some.
You are almost saying that having a gun offsets being drunk, that effective self defense can still be performed when you cannot by legal definition make decisions, or clearly identify targets, or use fine motor skills.
Some people take the personal rule to the extreme of absolutely no alcohol consumption. You present as having an issue with anyone thinking fall-down drunks maybe shouldn't have a gun on them.
X-JaVeN-X
Member
In my opinion Drinking responsibly while carrying is an oxymoron. Don't do it...no exceptions.
mcdonl
Member
You can drink, without being drunk.
sleepyone
Member
Sounds like one of those "no brainers" to me meaning a smart person is never going to put himself in a situation where you have to use your weapon after having even just one drink. Now you are the one having to defend your actions even if you were 100% stone cold sober and 100% fully justified in the shooting. Even the act of simply drawing your weapon after having a drink puts you in dangerous legal territory. Aggravated assault is a felony in many cases and I would think mixing alcohol and a gun is one of those; even if you are sober.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Yikes! Yet another reason to be glad NOT to be from Texas.
They'll prosecute you NOT for some harm you've DONE, but for some harm you maybe COULD HAVE done. Scary stuff, there.
r1derbike
Member
I don't drink. So I don't carry when I'm drinking.
What gets me are the numbers here who say I drink and still carry.
Really? Maybe you can. But that's not the point.
Drinking and carrying. I may hear the cries of the antis now, "Yee-Haw"!
What gets me are the numbers here who say I drink and still carry.
Really? Maybe you can. But that's not the point.
Drinking and carrying. I may hear the cries of the antis now, "Yee-Haw"!
Old Dog
Member
Along with all the other valid points raised, one should also consider the issue of credibility. Regardless of whether one is legally carrying (or not), if one is routinely seen out in public in an intoxicated state, one must be prepared to have one's credibility as an armed citizen questioned ... "Oh yeah, he's a real hard-partyer, but he only packs when he's not drinking ..." I don't want to be that guy. I've been known to imbibe a time or two, but I restrict it to the house or small, private affairs with only friends around, and the guns should remain holstered or locked up if I plan to have more than one drink.
Someone earlier said
Someone earlier said
Yes, that may be true in Colorado or Washington states, but per federal law, it's still illegal to buy, possess or carry firearms if one likes to get high.
Arkansas Paul
Member
DWI is the same way. You don't have to cause an accident or injury. They prosecute you because drinking and driving escalates the risk of it. Same principle IMO.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Pretty frightening, isn't it?
I comport myself the same way, no matter who's looking. The "antis" can "yee-haw" all they want, but in places like PA it has been legal to carry in bars, and while drinking, for generations and we've given the antis NO fuel for their bonfires over this. Go figure.
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