Conceal carry etiquette in someone's home

[george burns]

I have never taken a gun out in a social atmosphere to show it to someone who asked to see it. I think that doing so is just asking for trouble on several levels. If it came up that you were outed some how, perhaps by a friend who had too much to drink. The best way to handle it is to make a date with the person at some future time to take them shooting. Usually that will deflect the situation and the person will only call you if they had a real interest, but as far as handling a gun at a social event that is a big mistake that can only end badly.
You should never hand a gun over to anyone when you are out in public, unless you are in a gunfight and need to arm them, which will hopefully never happen.
Anything can happen anyware, just remember that an you will be fine.
This morning a 60 year old gentleman was awoken or disturbed by 2 young ladies who pulled up to his home in a stolen car, banged on his door several times and assuming no one was home they broke the glass beside the door knob and walked in to rob the place, they were met by a slug in the chest by the senior who I believe from the news report I heard, killed them both.
http://www.inquisitr.com/1573211/retired-homeowner-shoots-two-female-intruders-video/

 

[Zach S]

I have a very good female friend whose mother does not like guns. She makes it clear that she is scared of them and doesn't want them around her. She actually has a very valid reason, for herself, because her brother killed himself with a gun. She has never stated that she did not want me to bring a gun into her house and I have never told her that I have a gun when I enter the house. I always have a gun on me (at least every time I have entered her home) and I have spent several range sessions working with her daughter as she contemplates buying her first gun for HD (at age 53 might I add).
Would I walk in carrying my AR-15 and a 1911 on my hip? No, because I know the homeowner isn't comfortable around guns. In a pocket holster or IWB I have absolutely zero issue with it.

I know a woman who has had a few family members commit suicide. Her father(?), and her son.

I got made one day when she gave me a hug. Caught her off guard, but nothing has ever been said about it, and she never seemed uncomfortable around me.

 

[Red Wind]

This morning a 60 year old gentleman was awoken or disturbed by 2 young ladies who pulled up to his home in a stolen car, banged on his door several times and assuming no one was home they broke the glass beside the door knob and walked in to rob the place, they were met by a slug in the chest by the senior who I believe from the news report I heard, killed them both.

Incredible. 2 more Darwin Award Candidates, probably out of action for good. Being Texas, no bills should come down on the homeowner.

 

[Warp]

scaatylobo I have a question for you

Business access to homes !!!

I see going into a strangers house armed is "possibly" violating that persons RIGHT to a gun free zone !.

They might have religious cause,or just be deathly afraid of guns [ that is sad,but possible ].

If you do not ASK for permission to enter,then I see your more in violation of that persons RIGHTS --- than you are when visiting a friend that actually might [ should ? ] know your armed.

Carry that to the next step = do you need to announce that wherever you go,you need a town crier to walk ahead and announce your walking that way ----- and are armed ?.

After all , you "could" be violating anothers gun free zone.

My rule is ALWAYS the same,if there is no magnetometer at the door ----- I am not armed !.

Do you ask before entering if you possess a pocket knife?

.

 

[Warp]

I have never taken a gun out in a social atmosphere to show it to someone who asked to see it. I think that doing so is just asking for trouble on several levels. If it came up that you were outed some how, perhaps by a friend who had too much to drink. The best way to handle it is to make a date with the person at some future time to take them shooting. Usually that will deflect the situation and the person will only call you if they had a real interest, but as far as handling a gun at a social event that is a big mistake that can only end badly.
You should never hand a gun over to anyone when you are out in public, unless you are in a gunfight and need to arm them, which will hopefully never happen.
Anything can happen anyware, just remember that an you will be fine.
This morning a 60 year old gentleman was awoken or disturbed by 2 young ladies who pulled up to his home in a stolen car, banged on his door several times and assuming no one was home they broke the glass beside the door knob and walked in to rob the place, they were met by a slug in the chest by the senior who I believe from the news report I heard, killed them both.
http://www.inquisitr.com/1573211/retired-homeowner-shoots-two-female-intruders-video/

Small detail...they cannot rob the place if nobody is home. If they thought nobody was home, their intention was to burglarize. Robbery requires the threat or use of force, IOW, robbery requires that a person be present.

On the other side of the coin, as a host, I want to know who's carrying and who isn't. While I feel safe around most of my friends when they have firearms, there are acquaintances of mine and friends of friends that I do not. If my wife's girlfriend brings some guy I never met to our home, how do I know he is not a ticking time bomb waiting to go off? I don't trust folks I don't know with firearms as I do not know their proficiency nor their safe handling techniques. That's reality. Just cause someone owns a firearm does not mean they are safe and to be trusted with it. I need to know. Giving someone I don't know a free pass ain't gonna happen. The risk from someone with unknown character and gun handling is just as much of a risk as a bad guy kickin' in my door. Especially where I live. Goes for you folks here too. Don't matter how much you pound your chest and brag about how well you shoot. You ain't comin' in my house with a loaded gun till I can trust you and your gun handling.

WHOA there...who said anything about gun handling?! We're talking about carrying. Ostensibly we're talking about handguns in a holster.

 

[buck460XVR]

To be quite clear, though -- there should be NO gun handling going on. There's a difference between gun carrying and gun handling.

So long as it stays in the holster, I don't care WHO's carrying a gun or how lousy their proficiency might be.

The primary word there is Should. How do you guarantee that if you do not know the person. How do guarantee your other guests safety if you allow folks you don't know, don't know their mindset or their mental state into your home with loaded weapons? I'm sorry, I'm all for the 2nd A, but I'm not that naive to believe that just cause someone has a gun that they are responsible and safe with it. How many times have we read here of a Darwin Award winner that takes his CWC out and it goes off? How many times have we read of folks puttin' their finger on the boomstick with the gun in their pocket and it going boom? Funny how folks claim every random person on the street outside their home is a possible threat but would allow folks they don't know at all into their homes with a loaded gun because they are somehow automatically safe.

WHOA there...who said anything about gun handling?! We're talking about carrying. Ostensibly we're talking about handguns in a holster.

Your big word tells the tale.....

os·ten·si·bly
äˈstensiblē,əˈstensiblē/
adverb
adverb: ostensibly

apparently or purportedly, but perhaps not actually.

Read the words....."but perhaps not actually". I don't assume everyone with a gun is safe. I don't assume everyone with a CWC is going to act responsibly. I trust those I know. I don't trust those I don't know. Pretty simple. Same reason I no longer readily agree to hunt with folks I don't know Others are most certainly free to do differently.

 

[jrdolall]

How do you guarantee that if you do not know the person. How do guarantee your other guests safety if you allow folks you don't know, don't know their mindset or their mental state into your home with loaded weapons?

I have probably never read a quote that was more anti gun.

 

[Sam1911]

The primary word there is Should. How do you guarantee that if you do not know the person. How do guarantee your other guests safety if you allow folks you don't know, don't know their mindset or their mental state into your home with loaded weapons?

Hey, how do you know whether they're even carrying or not unless you've got metal detectors and are patting them down? You let in someone like me, who isn't going to tell you that I have a gun regardless, and you've got to trust me that I'm not going to draw a gun and wave it around or fire it.

So your prohibition here is really to limit the folks who are "nice" enough to actually TELL you. As I've said before, that pretty much is a restriction on the "good" folks, and won't have an impact on the bad ones. (Or me. )

"Hey, you're kind enough to tell me you have a lawfully carried concealed weapon? Thank you so much! What an upstanding guy! ... What? No, no, you can't bring it in."

(Guess I'll keep on keeping my mouth shut, thanks!)

I'm sorry, I'm all for the 2nd A, but I'm not that naive to believe that just cause someone has a gun that they are responsible and safe with it. How many times have we read here of a Darwin Award winner that takes his CWC out and it goes off? How many times have we read of folks puttin' their finger on the boomstick with the gun in their pocket and it going boom? Funny how folks claim every random person on the street outside their home is a possible threat but would allow folks they don't know at all into their homes with a loaded gun because they are somehow automatically safe.

Not automatically safe -- just no better or worse than they are standing just outside your door.

No, I'm sure it isn't a DELIBERATELY anti-RKBA sentiment, but it is such a one in fact, because of the horrible attitude it reveals about your fellow gun-owners. This is one of those moments of peeking under the rock to see what lurks underneath...

Probably not a line of reasoning you've thought about deeply before, but the sort of introspection we all really need to engage in. Plumbing the depths of our own convictions -- facing our own beliefs and prejudices as honestly as we are able. Sometimes we do need a "head check" no matter how uncomfortable that can be...

 

[cowtownup]

This a great topic for discussion... I certainly would like to know if someone is carrying in my home, therefore I typically don't carry in other peoples homes. I live out in the country and feel pretty good I'm not going to be involved in a gun fight at my friend and families homes when I visit... LOL... So I guess this topic might mean something different for a person living in suburbs of Chicago or somewhere more prone to a home invasion.

 

[jrdolall]

This a great topic for discussion... I certainly would like to know if someone is carrying in my home, therefore I typically don't carry in other peoples homes. I live out in the country and feel pretty good I'm not going to be involved in a gun fight at my friend and families homes when I visit... LOL... So I guess this topic might mean something different for a person living in suburbs of Chicago or somewhere more prone to a home invasion.

I live in the same environment. After 50 years of visiting, being visited, dinner on the grounds, picnics, and a million trips in and around town I have never been in or witnessed a gunfight or even an "almost" gunfight.
I carry just in case there is a need and not because I anticipate ever needing it as the odds of my ever actually drawing my gun are infinitesimally small. I understand that, in Alabama, a pretty large percentage of people carry a firearm legally. This doesn't bother me in the least because virtually EVERY shooting that I read about in the local area involves a person that was not legally allowed to possess a handgun. 17 year olds or convicted felons are usually the culprits and I can pretty much guarantee that those guys are not going to announce that they are carrying nor disarm if you ask them.

 

[chicharrones]

How do guarantee your other guests safety if you allow folks you don't know, don't know their mindset or their mental state into your home with loaded weapons?

I gotta say that I can't guarantee any of my guests safety if they come in my house or in my yard. Don't run on the wet concrete by the pool. Don't lean up against my 550*F grill. Don't fall down my stairs. Don't stick your hand into the alligator pit.

If I'm worried enough that my daughter's boyfriend is a threat to the people in my household, he isn't coming in. If a repairman comes in my house to get into my attic, it is upon me to keep an eye on him as reasonable as possible.

I wouldn't think a repairman having a concealed carry gun while in my home would be any different than a guest in my home having a concealed carry gun. If a repairman or guest wants to start a killing rampage in my home they could start with a big knife or a long screwdriver. I think about getting a screwdriver in the back when I repair machines at one of our state's prisons when working alongside the "offenders". So, why not a repairman or guest in a home that has had a bad day? (BTW, I'm a traveling repairman and I haven't had a go with any customer.)

Seriously though, if a person doesn't want people carrying in their home and they want a guarantee of that, they are going to have to put up metal detectors and have pat downs. Hell, make 'em get strip searched like at the prison every time they move to different areas.

A homeowner does have the right to ask people to not carry into their home. That homeowner just has to believe that the guest isn't carrying after the guest says they aren't carrying. So, it's still a trust issue whether they are armed or not. You trust that the guests are not lying to you that they are disarmed, otherwise you still need metal detectors and pat downs. Whether the guests are your friends and family or not.

 

[chicharrones]

This a great topic for discussion... I certainly would like to know if someone is carrying in my home, therefore I typically don't carry in other peoples homes. I live out in the country and feel pretty good I'm not going to be involved in a gun fight at my friend and families homes when I visit... LOL... So I guess this topic might mean something different for a person living in suburbs of Chicago or somewhere more prone to a home invasion.

I'm one of those people that do live in a huge metropolitan area in S.E. Texas. Anything can happen anywhere and anytime.

Same thing when I travel out of town to other towns and make stops in small towns. Anything can happen anywhere and anytime.

I'm am lucky that in the large cities, I've only been the victim of theft on several (7?) occasions. Yet, the one time I was robbed at gun point was in a small city in Texas by people I didn't know but I felt that I could trust them to be in my personal space. Up until the point they robbed me.

Did I mention anything can happen anywhere and anytime?

 

[Warp]

The primary word there is Should. How do you guarantee that if you do not know the person. How do guarantee your other guests safety if you allow folks you don't know, don't know their mindset or their mental state into your home with loaded weapons? I'm sorry, I'm all for the 2nd A, but I'm not that naive to believe that just cause someone has a gun that they are responsible and safe with it. How many times have we read here of a Darwin Award winner that takes his CWC out and it goes off? How many times have we read of folks puttin' their finger on the boomstick with the gun in their pocket and it going boom? Funny how folks claim every random person on the street outside their home is a possible threat but would allow folks they don't know at all into their homes with a loaded gun because they are somehow automatically safe.





Your big word tells the tale.....




Read the words....."but perhaps not actually". I don't assume everyone with a gun is safe. I don't assume everyone with a CWC is going to act responsibly. I trust those I know. I don't trust those I don't know. Pretty simple. Same reason I no longer readily agree to hunt with folks I don't know Others are most certainly free to do differently.

I am well aware of the definition to that word.

The only reason that definition applies is because you decided to start talking about handling the gun. You were part of the "we" I referenced.

If the "we" were to NOT include you, then we would, actually, in point of fact, be talking about a holstered handgun, no gun handling.


If you don't assume the person is going to act responsibly don't invite them into your home, simple as that.

 

[scaatylobo]

"gun handling" = what ???

I have NEVER had to "handle" my CCW in a home of any I visited NEVER !.

If that came about,then I doubt I would ever return to that home.

I drive a VERY safe and solid vehicle [ yes ,I did think about that too ].

And yes,I am 67 years old and a gun has saved my bacon both as an LEO,and prior when it was VERY questionable as to the legality of my being armed.

It was THE GUN,and not my pretty face [ Tongue firmly in place ] that saved me a few times,and no I wont bore y'all with war / street storys.

I am of the VERY FIRM belief that if you feel perfectly safe with not EVER being armed,then good for you !.

BUT do not expect me to disarm so you can feel safe around me,AND if your thinking about inviting me over ----- PLEASE tell me in advance that you do not allow CCW in your home.

We just saved us both a waste of time and energy.

You don't have to clean house,as I wont be coming over or be forced to leave prior to entering as I am challenged at the door [ or frisked ]

 

[Spats McGee]

In Arkansas, it's not just about etiquette. By state law, if I CC into a private residence, I am required to notify the occupant that I am CCing. I have handled this simply by having a conversation with the occupants whose homes I frequently enter. I tell them that I carry everywhere legally permissible, and that I'll continue to carry when at their homes, if that's OK with them. Thus far, not one person has objected.

If it's someone whose home I don't frequently enter, or someone who doesn't know that I carry, I disarm before entering the house, but I don't stay long. If I don't know them well enough to have the aforementioned conversation, I don't know them well enough to tell them that I carry.

 

[Armor Snail]

I've hemmed and hawed about replying to this for a while now.

So here it goes.

Lose the stigma folks. In my mind there is no stigma.
It's just like my shoes or phone. I have them with me. Just because it's a gun doesn't make it any different. Y'all that with about such frivolous things need to get it right because you are just perpetuating the issue of "oooh scary gun".

It's not a kilo of cocaine. It's a legal item like a ballcap. Zero difference.

The one poster earlier had it right. It's like a pack of cigarettes. Sure you would ask before lighting up but not to have them with you. It's one thing to enter someone's house and engage in target practice. Carry is altogether different.

I freely carry everywhere. I've carried into strangers houses before and either had no issue, asked to cover, or please put it in truck. With the latter we just leave. At least I know then where I'm welcome or not.

Being asked to cover or leave has each only ever happened once.

Usually it's a great conversation starter and ends with a nice talk about what they have/carry/shoot. Other times its an educational experience for the other party as they want to buy/carry/ or learn to shoot.

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

What do you thing about conceal carrying into someone else's home? Would you do it? Should you tell them you are carrying? What about someone who you know has an issue with guns - would you carry unless asked not to, or leave it locked in the car outside?

In SC this is a non-issue. It is illegal to carry a firearm into someone else's house without their express permission.

Would I do it anyway? No. It's the law in SC and one of the quickest ways to alienate someone else is to violate both the law and their own rights on the subject.

Should I tell them I am carrying? If I wish to enter their home legally while carrying, then yes. Otherwise I leave the weapon out of their house or do not visit.

Whether someone else has an issue with whether I'm carrying or not is beside the point in SC. And most certainly, if they DID have an issue and did not wish me to carry on their property, then I'm obligated to respect their rights, regardless of what SC law says about having to obtain their express permission. Their home is THEIR castle, not mine.

What about other states? Well, it depends on the laws in those other states. If I'm not obliged to obtain express permission to carry into someone else's house, then I'll carry concealed UNLESS it's posted or I'm informed otherwise by the owner.


Again...if it's that sensitive of an issue, then perhaps I don't need to be there in the first place.


SECTION 23-31-225. Carrying concealed weapons into residences or dwellings.

No person who holds a permit issued pursuant to Article 4, Chapter 31, Title 23 may carry a concealable weapon into the residence or dwelling place of another person without the express permission of the owner or person in legal control or possession, as appropriate. A person who violates this provision is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined not less than one thousand dollars or imprisoned for not more than one year, or both, at the discretion of the court and have his permit revoked for five years.

Source: http://scstatehouse.gov/code/t23c031.php

 

[Spats McGee]

. . . .It's just like my shoes or phone. I have them with me. Just because it's a gun doesn't make it any different. Y'all that with about such frivolous things need to get it right because you are just perpetuating the issue of "oooh scary gun".

It's not a kilo of cocaine. It's a legal item like a ballcap. Zero difference.

The one poster earlier had it right. It's like a pack of cigarettes. . . . .

With all due respect, I disagree. Firearms are not like shoes, phone or ballcaps. While all are legal, the similarities end there. I have never met anyone who had a deeply-held belief in opposition to ballcaps.

If you're going to make such a comparison, stick with cigarettes or alcohol. All (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms ) are legal, but also both objectionable to some groups of people. Here in Arkansas, we have a lot of folks who simply do not want alcohol in their homes. Sure, it's legal for me to possess, but it would be disrespectful of me to try to sneak it into their homes.

 

[Armor Snail]

I don't sneak anything. Its plain when the door is opened. Like I said, if they complain I'm gone so what's the issue?

 

[Spats McGee]

TBH, I didn't even think about OC, so that's fair enough.

 

[Armor Snail]

Yup. If their anti gun sentiment is strong I don't want to be there anyways. Best way to find out lol.

 

[Zach S]

If you're going to make such a comparison, stick with cigarettes or alcohol. All (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms ) are legal, but also both objectionable to some groups of people. Here in Arkansas, we have a lot of folks who simply do not want alcohol in their homes. Sure, it's legal for me to possess, but it would be disrespectful of me to try to sneak it into their homes.

Maybe just stick with tobacco...

I have never taken an alcoholic drink anywhere if I didn't intend on drinking it there.

However, I always have my cigarettes - and I yet have to be asked to take them back out to my car.

 

[george burns]

As Sam mentioned, what makes you think that someone is going to respect your wishes? Just because you don't want people to carry a gun in your home, doesn't meant they are going to honor your wish, they may feel their life is more important than your personal rules.
I would think that especially someone who was up to no good would not inform you of the fact that they had a gun on them.
So back to patting down your guests. And please don't tell me that they all take the high road, because we wouldn't be having this discussion if they did.
At some point you have to acknowledge that you give up a certain amount of control when allowing people into you home. You should be prepared to deal with that if it happens. When someone brings a friend with them, and you don't know that friend, you need to decide right there if you are letting them in or not. Chances are that you would, especially if it's a girlfriend. Meanwhile she could just as easily be casing out your house while enjoying a piece of cake and waiting for her crew to come.
Guns have little to do with violence, it's the person who decided that they were going to commit an illegal act.
When you start out committing a robbery, you better be aware that it can lead to a lot more than just a robbery. It's like a girl asking you to threaten some guy who was bothering her, "like in high school". Only now kids have a 15 shot semi auto in their trunk or glove box.
They may not tolerate you telling them anything and before you know it someone is dead.
This happens every day. people are far less tolerant than they used to be, we live in an angry world now.

 

[buck460XVR]

You let in someone like me, who isn't going to tell you that I have a gun regardless, and you've got to trust me that I'm not going to draw a gun and wave it around or fire it.

So your prohibition here is really to limit the folks who are "nice" enough to actually TELL you. As I've said before, that pretty much is a restriction on the "good" folks, and won't have an impact on the bad ones. (Or me. )

The minute I ask and you lie and refuse, it is no longer about etiquette, but about a criminal offense. Not "High Road", nor the image most think a Mod on a gun forum should advocate.

No, I'm sure it isn't a DELIBERATELY anti-RKBA sentiment, but it is such a one in fact, because of the horrible attitude it reveals about your fellow gun-owners. This is one of those moments of peeking under the rock to see what lurks underneath...

So being concerned about my safety and not assuming all gun owners are repsonsible is anti-RKBA, but bragging about illegal actions while CWCing is pro RKBA? Yep, that's the image most responsible gun owners want to promote. Talk about plumbing the depths of our own convictions.....

And yes,I am 67 years old and a gun has saved my bacon both as an LEO,and prior when it was VERY questionable as to the legality of my being armed.

So then the advocating of illegal actions by a ex-cop makes it right? Things like this is why folks have negative feelings toward those in blue. Apparently laws only apply to others or when you get caught.

No where have I ever said I feel safe everyplace when unarmed. I only stated that being unarmed does not always make me automatically at risk. This thread was about etiquette and now has turned to the avocation of breaking the law. This thread has now turned to lunacy. Time to leave.

 

[Sam1911]

The minute I ask and you lie and refuse, it is no longer about etiquette, but about a criminal offense. Not "High Road", nor the image most think a Mod on a gun forum should advocate.

Hey, now, if it is a criminal offense in your state, then no, I wouldn't be breaking the law.

The other part of your question presupposed you've asked me (the visitor) specifically "are you carrying a gun?" Which I've never heard come up in any front-door greeting of a visitor I've ever heard of. Again, unless you're interrogating and patting down your guests, this is all rather a moot point. You aren't going to know if they've got a gun concealed or not.

No, I'm sure it isn't a DELIBERATELY anti-RKBA sentiment, but it is such a one in fact, because of the horrible attitude it reveals about your fellow gun-owners. This is one of those moments of peeking under the rock to see what lurks underneath...

So being concerned about my safety and not assuming all gun owners are repsonsible is anti-RKBA, but bragging about illegal actions while CWCing is pro RKBA? Yep, that's the image most responsible gun owners want to promote. Talk about plumbing the depths of our own convictions.....

Interesting "red herring" about the "illegal activity" I DIDN'T say I'd engage in. But yeah ... everyone's "concerned about [their] safety." That's what the whole gun control thing is about, at least on the face of it.

My point was that your concerns about your safety are an excuse here to attempt to control OTHERS' possessions and right to carry a defensive weapon.

And all I did was point out that unless you are going to institute physical controls, your policy is merely an illusion of safety -- just like the rest of gun control policy. You'll "catch" the good folks who are nice enough to tell you they're carrying. So you'll be "safe" from those folks who wouldn't have harmed you anyway. But you won't do a darned thing to protect yourself from the folks who might actually harm you.