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Slight Perp run-in...[long winded but you might find it interesting]

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TMM

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Feb 23, 2005
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Ok, background.:
So my friend and i are in a graveyard taking some B&W photographs in a pretty good town. it's kind of a richie-rich town, so there is a decent amount of drug deals, i believe. it's approaching dark, and we're about to finish up since you can't take pictures in the dark.

Throughout the entire time, we both heard some noisy kids in some far corner of the cemetary. we both attributed it to stupid desprespectful teenagers, etc. [no offence to other teens, of course. i am one myself.] so, as we're finishing up, we are walking down a road/path that happens to lead to where these teens are. [i should say at this moment i am not sure they were teens but i am sure that they are approximately that age.]. not thinking, we walk up kind of close, but are concealed by a rather large tree. i see a good picture, and step into the road to take it, but my friend keeps mentioning how we probably shouldn't make ourselves seen. at this point i decided the flash from the camera would be a bad idea.

One thing i noticed but did not connect until later was that they were all [about 8-12 people... it was dark.] using very small lights, casting no beam but just a small signature dot. didn't think anything of it then but now they were probably using them so they wouldn't be seen.

my friend and i were talking a little "loudly" [enough to be heard probably] about how we shoudl stay/go/take a pic/etc. i didn't really take my buddy seriously when he said we should go, because the whole time we were there he was joking about how he was nervous being there [like because zombies might crawl out of the graves, etc - he was just joking around]. this, however, desensitized me to his warnings. we were discussing stay/go when we heard footsteps coming toward our spot. in my mind i was thinking basically "OH *DELETED*!!".

My friend and i started walking through the gravestones [not on the road - the road is open and all, no cover, etc]. two guys [i think - they were siloughettes[sp?]] came up to the edge of the road and said somthing. i was about 20 feet away, so i turned around and said, "what?" they asked me again "Did you guys get any good pictures?" "Yea, we got a few good ones" i replied. "Can we see them?" :what: warning bells, already ringing, rang even louder. i replied in a firm tone, "No, they're on film!" we turned and walked at an even but fast pace away, and i heard some voices, somthing along the lines of "...going to the corner..." that was the only bit i heard.

They may have been adressing me, but i did not turn around to ask if they were talking to me. i was sure they were up to no good, and then it was proven. i didn't want anything to do with them and wanted to get out as fast as possible without seeming like we were fleeing[and possibly give them chase? dunno.].

as we got to the road, we crossed it quickly [mainly to get to the sidewalk but it proved to have another use]. as we passed the entrance to the graveyard, a man in a white t-shirt [probably one of the group - we saw no one else there] came out of the entrance and followed for a few yards on the opposite side of the road. we were walking faster and i couldn't see out of the side of my eye anymore, and risked a glance or two back. [if he did pursue for some reason there was a restaurant with people dining on the sidewalk about 100 yards away].

as we walked our slight adrenaline twitches off back to the hangout at a coffeeshop, we reflected on what happened.:
- I am almost sure they were stalking/watching us when we were taking pictures, since they asked about them.
- I could clearly see did not want to see the pictures, but wanted easy prey, a free camera, and a few bucks.
- if they did advance on us, we'd be screwed. we're outnumbered, outmuscled, and outsmarted [because we're not familier with the graveyard]. This is why we both hauled ass out of there.
- I had my Benchmade 732BK Ares. that gave me a slight "edge" :D , mainly suprise, but i would in NO way rely on it. i could easily be overpowered. best bet, like always said, is to try to get OUT before anything happens.

Ideas for next time [we plan on taking more photos]:
- watch more carefully for people
- keep distance from any large groups
- don't think nothing of somthing. [the small lights, big group, they stayed there the whole time, etc]
- I may be in the market for a good cane. No matter how fast or sharp, my Benchmade is a last resort. I trust it, but not me.
- Listen to your friend carefully and separate joking fom serious concern.

things we did right:
- we got the hell out of there, fast.
- kept conversation to a minimum, and spoke firmly to them.
- kept awareness up when leaving to make sure they didn't follow.

...Well, wow. that's long. but i felt like sharing and i hope the story didn't bore you. This incident, however minor, made me realize that bad stuff dosn't just happen to other people, or in other places. i've read about this and that, and how you should do this and that when "X" happens, but it lacked the connection to me. i am grateful for how i got interested in all this stuff [self defence, guns, situational awareness, etc] , otherwise i might have thought they meant no harm and started talking with them.

We might have been a statistic like others.

stay safe,
~TMM
 
Well done, and all's well that ends well. I'm glad you're alright, and wiser for the experience. What more can a man want?
 
One thing i noticed but did not connect until later was that they were all [about 8-12 people... it was dark.] using very small lights, casting no beam but just a small signature dot. didn't think anything of it then but now they were probably using them so they wouldn't be seen.

Sure they weren't smoking dope from one hitter boxes? Was working a surveillance one night and had a heck of a time figuring out what the tiny glow was in the AN/PVS-4 we were using. It turned out the people we were watching had slipped into the back yard to smoke some weed fromone hitter boxes. Sure had a strange signature in the night vision device.

Jeff
 
Rio shooter: you are completely correct but i am only 16... 5 more years and a [probably] HK USP45 will be by my side.

wayne: you are definately correct. in a way it was almost good that this happened, to serve as a wake-up call.

Jeff: good point, but the lights were both colored [red, blue, etc] like those Inova Photon lights, and they moved around too much. i also did not smell any smoke, and the kids seemed prety coherent. both my buddy and i, however, agreed that they were probably dealing, and possibly they planned to smoke some stuff later. and oh, how a night vision device would have been useful that night.

~tmm
 
You got your pictures, avoided a knife-fight and got out with all your possessions, body parts and sexual integrity intact. What more could a person ask for?
 
You did well to keep moving when they tried to engage you in conversation.

There are certain "red flag" requests perps often use:

"Yo do you have a cigarette?" (this is the classic)

"Yo can I have some change?"


The question is simply designed to get you to stop, pause, and let them size you up or jump you. "Can we see them?" falls into this category. You might want to consider a CCW.
 
Sounds like adolescent paranoia

But you followed your spidey senses and left. Learn to trust your gut, it's usually smarter than your brain in these circumstances. Particularly being out manned, good work.

jeepmor
 
Would you mind posting or PMing me the location of the cemetary in question? I would like to test a theory as to what they may have been doing.
 
A camera flash in the eyes at dusk could buy a moment or two- instant night blindness for the flashee.
 
Sounds like all you really know for sure is that you probably should go there
after dark.

what? perhaps you mean "shouldn't go there after dark"?

And i did have my Inova X1 flashlight with me, and my friend had the camera, but neither of us would have thought to use the flash. However that is a good idea and i will tell my friend that.

~tmm
 
My only suggestion would be next time leave prior to dusk. Make sure you are leaving in daylight.

Sounds like you handled it well not stopping for anything.
 
Peg 'im in the face with the flash and as long as you have film (or card space) you're not only going to blind him but have a good mugshot to give to the police if you have to.
 
yup, the advantage to flashing them in the eyes is that you get some good shots of them. I will definately remember that next time.

I do have a flashlight, an Inova X1. not the brightest thing in the world [37 lumens IIRC] but it's good.

~tmm
 
Would OC spray be an option for you as you are not of age for CCW?

Good job listening to your gut. Every time I've not listened to my gut, I've regretted it.

Every time.
 
as far as i know it is town property. there are small paved roads through the cemetary and, IIRC, a parking spot. There are usually a few cops walking around the streets, and we could have told one of them, but we didn't. perhaps we should next time?

~tmm
 
Since you are not of age to own/possess/carry a gun, I would get some pepper spray and a 4D cell Mag Light. Do your research on the pepper spray, as there are a billion types to choose from - get the best/most potent spray you are allowed by law (if it is regulated in your area).

As far as the Mag Light, the 4D cell model makes a fearsome weapon. I read of a police officer who had to apprehend a biker who was about the size of Hulk Hogan. The biker took a swing at the cop, who ducked and bashed him in the kneecap, shattering it. "Mr. Tough Guy" collapsed, crying like a virgin on prom night.:D

Ever since I read that story, I keep my 4D Mag Light close by - with my 1911.

I'm a photographer too, and I am VERY aware of my surroundings and what's going on when I'm out photographing. Cameras and lenses are the #2 target of thieves, guns being #1 from what I have read. When I am out photographing, my Glock 30 is always within reach.

Good luck and good imagemaking!
 
For anyone interested, there's a great book that is entirely about these type of situations and others. It's called "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin DeBecker. This guy has trained governments, CIA, FBI, celebrities, etc. etc. about the subtelties and risks of violence. It is very informative about the subconscious signals or instinct that occurs prior to logical or conscious thought. All animals have "instinctual" reactions (fight or flight)that are used to protect them from harm/death. Because humans can rationalize we often allow conscious thoughts to override our initial instincts and the ability to recognize and act on those appropriate instincts can be the difference between life/death, health/injury.
 
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