VPC Says:'Pro-gun'States With "Weak"Gun Laws Have the Highest Homicide Rates

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No, all rates stated are in per 100,000 population. Which negates the density "problem."
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Not really. It makes the statistics per capita, but doesn't take into effect that MT is dealing with a little over 930,000 people in a total land area of 145,556 sq mi. This means that MT has a population density of about 5.5 people per sq mi, compared to a place like New York, which has a population density of about 402 people per sq mi.
 
Not really. It makes the statistics per capita, but doesn't take into effect that MT is dealing with a little over 930,000 people in a total land area of 145,556 sq mi. This means that MT has a population density of about 5.5 people per sq mi, compared to a place like New York, which has a population density of about 402 people per sq mi.
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And remarkably NYC homicide rate per 100,000 is 7.3.
New Orleans(pre- Katrina) was 57.4.
Atlanta,Baltimore and a few other U.S. cities come in over 30.0
New York City is a Rudy Guiliani anomaly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_New_York_City
 
The stats some of you guys trot out are excellent but are also overkill.

Anyone, anywhere, anytime could blow these VPC statements out of the water quite simply with what happened in Chicago last weekend.

30+ people shot in a city that bans handguns...

No matter what any anti rebutted would be absolutely moot at that point.
 
The assertions are not meaningful unless demographics are considered. If it were taken further and categorized into racial and income subgroups a clearer picture would probably emerge.

For example gun deaths per 100,000 population both above and below the median income (as defined by HUD) then in each income category, per 100,000 population by race.

A state with generally low incomes and high numbers of minorities will always come out on the wrong side of the CDC statistical method.

That doesn't say anything except poor minorities happen to shoot each other more than other groups.

Comparative gun laws are irrelevant.
 
All of this reminds me of the time a client came to me and said

" We need some statistical analysis performed for a marketing program ".

They then handed me the numbers and said: " we need your report to indicate a trend upward in sales ".

I massaged the numbers, handed them a report with the numbers they asked for and then sent them a bill. They smiled, cheered and paid their bill.

There are numerous ways to massage data to get the end result that you need to prove a point. The numbers this anti gun group came up with is nothing more then the term I started using a long time - " Voo Doo " analysis. I became very proficient at " cooking " numbers and handing off reports to my client that was bought and paid for and would make them happy and serve their purpose.

Give me the numbers, tell me what you need to see for an end result and I will cook the numbers and hand you back a report that accomplishes your goals.

This happens every single day in this country.

Chris
 
One should also note, that getting shot in a "rural" area is more dangerous than getting shot in an "urban" area. Why??? Hospital quality, my friend!!!

Rural hospitals are not as adept at dealing with trauma (nor are they as well staffed/equipped) as urban hospitals are. Thus, your chances of surviving something such as a gunshot wound are likely not as high. You'd be lucky to find a level 3 trauma center in a small town/city. Large urban centers are littered with Level 1 and 2 trauma centers.

It's common in the medical field field to advise against getting in a bad car wreck in a small town. The same holds true for getting shot in a small town.
 
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Correlation

A couple of years ago someone posted the Brady grades for states and I got ahold of the per capita firearm death rates.
Regressing one on the other revealed a nonsignificant trend in the direction of more deaths in higher graded states.
For an interesting article reklated to this Google Samara McPhedran.
Good luck.
 
I would thiink that rural hospitals would be very good at dealing with trauma, because rural areas are wehre the dangerous jobs are: farming, fishing, logging, etc.
 
I would thiink that rural hospitals would be very good at dealing with trauma, because rural areas are wehre the dangerous jobs are: farming, fishing, logging, etc.
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The major trauma centers are usually in larger cities.
Absent air transport, lots of the very seriously injured rural patients are DOA.
 
FBI Uniform Crime Report - 2006 - Washington, DC (listed as District of Columbia) - 29.6 - by far the highest number of homicides per 100K; next is Puerto Rico with 18.8 - also a place with lots of "gun control".

You can very well argue that states with the death penalty are safer than those that don't. Lots of data about that too!

John
Charlotte, NC
 


No, DC is high, but Baltimore MD far surpasses if with 43.3 per 100K for 2006. Yes, I know they show 13.3, but if you'll do the math, you'll find that's an error/lie. Baltimore had 276 homicides, population of 637,556 which is

[276 / 637,556 ] * 100,000 = 43.29​

They fudged it by using total population of the surrounding area.

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2006/data/table_06.html#b

​
 
One should also note, that getting shot in a "rural" area is more dangerous than getting shot in an "urban" area. Why??? Hospital quality, my friend!!!

Rural hospitals are not as adept at dealing with trauma (nor are they as well staffed/equipped) as urban hospitals are. Thus, your chances of surviving something such as a gunshot wound are likely not as high. You'd be lucky to find a level 3 trauma center in a small town/city. Large urban centers are littered with Level 1 and 2 trauma centers.

It's common in the medical field field to advise against getting in a bad car wreck in a small town. The same holds true for getting shot in a small town.
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I can't say for sure, but I would guess that most people who get shot in rural areas, like MT, are shot with something a lot more potent than a 9mm or .40. Lots of hunting rifles, large bore revolvers and such here.

My brother had a bad bicycle accident once--broke his collar bone and had a severe concussion--they had to life flight him 100 miles away to Kalispell. First question he asked when he regained consciousness was "will I be okay for hunting season?"

My mom and dad were involved in a head on collision with a snow plow outside Trout Creek Dec 06. My mom was killed instantly. My dad suffered a brain aneurysm, a shattered elbow, and a broken bone in his foot. He had to be life flighted to Couer d' Alene, ID for treatment.

Hospitals here do their best, but they are limited.
 
The Brady bunch cares.

Better check the New York stats to see if they include the NYC police shooting unarmed civilians.
 
Violence Policy Center was set up by Josh Sugarmann after the National Coalition to Ban Handguns fell apart (Sugarmann was a top honcho there too). Sugarmann popularised the term "assault weapon", VPC's Tom Diaz accused Ronnie Barrett of making sales of .50 caliber rifles to Ossam Bin Laden, and is best known for this quote:

"Assault weapons--just like armor-piercing bullets, machine guns, and plastic firearms--are a new topic. The weapons' menacing looks, coupled with the public's confusion over fully automatic machine guns versus semi-automatic assault weapons--anything that looks like a machine gun is assumed to be a machine gun--can only increase the chance of public support for restrictions on these weapons. In addition, few people can envision a practical use for these weapons."
-Josh Sugarmann, Assault Weapons and Accessories in America, 1988

Everytime the Big Media showed machineguns blazing away and talked about banning semi-sutos, that was Sugarmann's propaganda technique in action.

Remember when when the Marlin M60 .22 had a magazine out to the end of its 22 inch barrel? Remember when the Marlins started showing up with short, 19 inch magazine tubes hanging on the 22 inch barrel? That was the result of the New Jersey Assault Weapon Ban, one of VPCs great victories. Reducing the magazine capacity of a .22 plinker and hunting rifle--excuse me, killer assaullt weapon--from 18 shots to 14 shots.

VPC is should be bagged and sold at Tractor Supply as composted manure.
 
George Will made an excellent,prescient point in his Washington Post column Thursday which bears on this discussion.
Describing the sad decline of our nations school system since teacher unionization began in 1962 ,Will says:
"No reform can enable schools to cope with the 36.9 percent of all children and 69.9 percent of black children born out of wedlock,which means,among many other things,A CONTINUALLY RENEWED COHORT OF UNRULY ADOLESCENT MALES.
Which brings us to 34 homicides in Chicago over the past few days, among other things.
Seems like he's nailed it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/23/AR2008042302983.html?sub=AR
 
Comparing population density per square mile between Montana MT (5.5 people per sq mi) and New York (402 people per sq mi.) is a little off.
Even in places like Montana, most people live in medium- or small-size cities with a population density greater than 5.5 per sq. mi. (the Rocky Mountains probably have stretches of square miles with 0 population).

Since there does appear to be a correlation between population density and crime rates, though, the answer is obvious: a federal law mandating that people spread out to a uniform population density.
 
VPC is not really interested in preventing violent crime. They are more interested in oppressing the citizens. That is their true agenda. When gun control is imposed as an intention to cut down violent crime, it would have been repealed quickly, since they do not work very well against those who have no regard for the law, and more effective measures such as Right To Carry would have been put in place.
HOWEVER, when gun control laws have been proven ineffective, and politicians refuse to repeal them, and instead, use crime as an excuse to pass MORE gun control laws, and to top that, when their propaganda agencies use lies and distortions to cover the truth, something really grave is happening, and our freedoms is probably at risk.
 
As politically incorrect as it is to say, I don't believe the low population density has as much to do with it as other factors. Most of MT is relatively poor. Parts of some counties look like 3rd world countries, in fact. But MT continues to have relatively low crime rates based on other factors. Among these is our demography. We are 90.8% white, only .4% black. It's not politically correct, but it's the truth.

But yes, population density is a big factor. The lower your population density, the less contact you have with others, and naturally from this, the less confrontation.
 
We are 90.8% white, only .4% black. It's not politically correct, but it's the truth.
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Wow, I admire your courage to say that in today's severely politically-correct atmosphere run by Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, who are so quick to call anyone racist, simply because they looked at someone a certain way.

Here in NYC, when the Columbia Graduate student from China was struck and killed by a vehicle as he ran across the street to flee from two young muggers, these two(Sharpton and Jackson) did not even come out to chastise members of their own social class. I figure, here in NYC, if a white or Asian person as much as look at a black person the wrong way, or refuse to serve them in a store or resturaunt because they are being rude and disrespectful, it is racist. However, when black person, especially if some "poor" kid from the ghetto commits a crime, it is not racist, it's because of poverty and we should help them:barf::barf: When several thugs beat up a Jewish couple on the subway several months ago, the word "hate crime" was not even mentioned in the media.

I don't mean to be racist either, but I just want to clarify some things. There are many honorable black folks out there, it is just some who ruin it for everybody, and some who are under the guise of "civil rights activists" and sticking up for the negative actions of their own fellow people.
 
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