What if you need high capacity but worry about 9mm?

[eurohacker]

If you need, say, 15 rounds, but you're doubting the stopping power of the 9mm, what are your options?

I just get so confused. One guy says 9mm sucks, another says it doesn't.

 

[Smoke]

Para Ordnance P14. .45
Para Ordnance P16. .40

Others that are similar...SVI, STI, Kimber, Wilson makes a High Cap.

Other Polymer pistols are available in bigger hole - higher capacity offerings.

Smoke

 

[1 old 0311]

The 9mm has killed Millions in wars all over the earth for the last 90 years. The .40 crowd screams GO .40, the .45 crowd screams GO .45, I am sure there are even a few who won't carry anything less than the new S&W 500.
Find something you can afford to practice with and ignore the "gunshop commando's"

Kevin

 

[eurohacker]

What about the SOCOM mk23?

 

[thatguy]

You seem obsessed with combat guns and shooting people. This continued fixation on such things will lead people to question your motives or at the least, your maturity.

 

[GregGry]

Para Ordnance P14. .45

Ahh yes, I am buying one of thoes soon

Seriously though Eurohacker, you ask some really werid questions. In terms of double the stopping power of a 9mm, I really doubt a .45 would be double. In a lot of the tests I have seen, penetration between the 9mm and .45acp are very similar. The .45 typically punches a bigger hole though. If your worried about stopping power, just get a s&w 500 revolver. If you hit center mass with it, you wont have to worry about the target still walking.

If a shot is placed well, you can take a target down with a .22. Caliber and power is one thing, but if you can't hit the side of a barn from inside of it, it doesn't matter if you have a 50 round extended magazine in a 1911 (being sarcastic of course), you still wont be able to hit a target. I personally decided on the PO p14 because I like its features, and the extra capacity magazine will make my plinking more fun, because I wont have to reload as often.

You seem obsessed with combat guns and shooting people. This continued fixation on such things will lead people to question your motives or at the least, your maturity.

Yes I know what you mean. Personally I am a bit disturbed by some of the questions he asks, but since I imagine he is 14, I figure he doesn't know any better.

 

[GregGry]

What about the SOCOM mk23?

The HK mark 23 is a very great pistol, I had the chance to hold one at the local gun shop. I will have one some day, right now I can't justify the 2,200 price tag.

 

[eurohacker]

thatguy: hell yes, I am obsessed. But, unlike some people, I can separate my fantasies from reality If you lived in a restrictive country, you would fantasize about guns all day long too...

 

[eurohacker]

I am thinking it would be a choice between Para Ordnance P14 and HK USP. Both hold 12 rounds of .45ACP, right? Or .13 rounds of .40.

What say you, experts?

 

[Velocity229]

If you need, say, 15 rounds, but you're doubting the stopping power of the 9mm, what are your options?

I just get so confused. One guy says 9mm sucks, another says it doesn't.

You are doubting the stopping power in 15 rounds of 9mm?!

I'm just going to stop here.

 

[geekWithA.45]

I just get so confused. One guy says 9mm sucks, another says it doesn't.

It depends on whether the guy using 9mm has befriended the rounds and has made the appropriate burnt offerings.

9mm is moody, and must be wined and dined before it'll perform.

 

[GregGry]

I am thinking it would be a choice between Para Ordnance P14 and HK USP. Both hold 12 rounds of .45ACP, right? Or .13 rounds of .40.

The P14 holds 14+1, the USP holds 12 rounds. The Usp is cheaper then the P14 that I am going to buy, but I wanted the higher capacity of the p14, I liked the finish/look of it more, and I like the feel of the metal Vs the plastic of the hk. Don't get me wrong, the USP is a fine gun, and I wouldn't mind having one any day (especially compared to a glock). I just decided if I was going to blow my budget for a firearm, I might as well get what I really wanted. I would personally recommend that you actually go out to a shop, and fire any handgun that your interested in. You can talk about them all day, and keep dreaming about which one is better, but at a certain point you have to find out for yourself

One thing I have found, is the handgun world is much like the car audio world. Since car audio is a big hobby of mine I deal with it day in and day out. There are people that wont settle for anything less then 4 15" sub woofers, and there are people who only want one 8 inch sub. People always ask me what I like for speakers, and I do have my preferred brands of course. What I like and what other people like are often two different things. That's why I use the mentality, get recommendation on good brands, listen to said brands, buy what you like.

The same can be said about a handgun. Get information on good companies, go to the gun shop and try out said pistols, and buy what fits your needs. You can buy a firearm without trying it, I don't recommend that, unless you have a good experience with the same or similar model. Take other peoples recommendations as that, recommendations. What works for one person doesn't for others. Kind of like how I would love to have a desert eagle, because it fits my hand very well, and fires magnum calibers very well. For someone with small hands, the desert eagle is often to big, and not comfortable.

 

[thebucket]

The Taurus PT 24/7 in 45 ACP holds 12 rounds and the grip is very comfortable. Or a Tanfoglio Witness in 10mm Auto gives you 15 rounds and the ability to hunt deer (at least in Minnesota).

 

[Candiru]

The most powerful bullet in the world is useless if it doesn't hit the target. Accuracy trumps power in every case, every time. Therefore, the largest component of the almost mythical "stopping power" (I think I saw stopping power hanging out at a chimaera bar with a yeti and a unicorn) is the skill of the shooter. Since 9mm is the least expensive centerfire round, I chose that as my defensive caliber so that I could afford to practice more. If .45ACP were cheaper or I could shoot it better, I'd be using that. The only reason I don't use .22 is because I don't trust rimfire reliability and it is genuinely teensy-tiny, as opposed to 9mm, which is only small in the hyperbolic hand-wringing of suburban commandos.

As to the issue of capacity, it's a solution to the wrong problem. All but the tiniest fraction of civilian defense scenarios could have been resolved with the capacity of a five-shot revolver. In documented cases where a reload was necessary, it was because the shooter ran dry due to missing; after the reload, he usually continued to miss. I think the availability of too many rounds encourages sloppy shooting.

Prudence, placement, power. In that order.

 

[mete]

Need 15 rounds ? That's why you carry extra magazines ,you can reload quickly or carry an extra gun for a "NY reload".

 

[ewb45acp]

EAA Witness double stack in 10MM

I keep thinking I need to get one of those.

 

[mattw]

G21 holds 13+1
Para Ord P14 holds 14+1
USP holds 12+1
Springfield Armory and Kimber and Wilson Combat all make wide body 1911 frames that accept Para Ord Mags.

you could always get a .45GAP....

 

[Colonel Klink]

Euro, and everyone else who hasn't thought about it: 15 rounds is not "high capacity". A lot of guns held that many rounds before the Clinton Gun BAN. The anti's started calling 15 rounds high capacity. Please call it standard capacity especially in front of anti's. High capacity is the 100 round magazine for an AR-15 or even the 50 round or how about a belt fed.

Most gun fights end without a shoot being fired. Just presenting a gun can cause the BG to turn and run. I carry five rounds of .38 caliber with no backup rounds or gun. I practice weekly so if I ever need to use it in self defense I can make effective shots.

My experience has been that having a gun allows me to walk away from situtations knowing I have it to protect myself. The very last thing I want to do is shoot someone. They are going to work very hard to make them shoot them.

 

[eurohacker]

It's more fun to blast cans with 15 rounds in the mag

 

[mattw]

get a mac-10

 

[thebucket]

Colonel, I think he was meaning high capacity in a more relative sense, as in a 15 round 9mm mag has high capacity when compared to a 7 round 45 ACP mag.

 

[Jayb]

Just my opinion, but if one "needs" 15 rounds in a carry weapon, perhaps one would be better served to concentrate on proficiency and accuracy, regardless of caliber. In a country where use of firearms is severly restricted, I wouldn't consider the "high capacity" concern relevant in the first place.

 

[pezo]

If you feel you need more than 15 rounds out of a handgun you would be best served carrying a 12 gauge shotgun or ar15 or the like. In all honesty every caliber or platform has it's puprose. NO the 9mm does not suck or else it wouldnt be the popular round it is today. Its just what's your expectation or purpose you'r trying to acheive. SHoot the 9mm and other calibers then decide before buying.

 

[Baba Louie]

Speaking for myself, I bought a couple of the +2 magazine extensions for 2 of my Glock 21 magazines... which now hold 15. With one normal 13 rd. magazine in the weapon, one round in the chamber and the 2 modified magazines on the belt... I hope I don't fall into a deep stream or lake...

Since I practice shot placement on a regular basis and I'm not limited to 9mm ball ammo, I have no worries with the Glock 17 (even tho I also bought a couple of +2's for some of my 17's magazines) shooting 124 gr. JHP.

Soda cans tremble in our presence. (It's MORE fun to blast cans with 17 rounds in the magazine)

eurohacker... dude, with all respect, spend a week or two with the search function and in the THR Library (upper right hand corner) reading + learning and soon you'll be almost as knowledgable as our own C.R. Sam... well, that + 50 some years of lifetime experience.

Keep the questions coming as there's no such thing as a stupid question... well, there are, actually, but, you know what I mean... that's why I say do the search thing, read THR Library

 

[MTMilitiaman]

I love how people seem to automatically assume that desiring any more capacity than a 1911 or revolver automatically subscribes someone to the method of spray and pray. You don't usually carry a weapon intending on using it. Most of us carry for defensive purposes in the event of a worse case scenerio when no other realistic option exists. With that in mind, you'd think that people would be more open to actually planning for a worst case scenerio and if the technology existed to put 7 more rounds in your magazine, people be more open to using it instead of automatically assuming that those who want more magazine capacity than our grandfathers simply want to shoot up an entire magazine and spray lead in a general direction.
Yes most defensive shootouts don't involve shots and those that do usually involve relatively few shots. When your life and the life of your family is on the line, are you going to plan for the average or worst case?
I know that I own a USP 45 and a Glock 20. I considered magazine capacity when considering each. Yes, a long gun is better, but having 15 rounds in the magazine is not a bad thing to me, and it sure as hell doesn't mean I hold my gun sideways or any of that such crap. Common sense dictates that 15 well placed rounds before a reload is still better than 7 well placed rounds.