What Is It About the 10mm??

[The_Shootist]

Everytime I read some post about the 10mm it ends up being a post saying
the 10mm is just a bit short of this:




I mean - 40 cal on steriods makes it have that much of a cult following? Or is it because it may be that rare pistol calibre that can easily cross between urban self-defense rationale and a reasonable woods gun?

It sounds like an interesting cartridge, its just that when I walk into a WalMart or Academy I know I can always get one of 9mm/.38/.357/.45 - with 10mm I'm not so sure.

 

[MachIVshooter]

delete

 

[Full Metal Jacket]

i just bought a glock 29 the other day. what blast to shoot! only a couple bucks more than .45acp in my area (i don't reload). real fun to shoot

 

[The_Shootist]

RE: Glock 29

Funny you should mention that - I've been looking hard at that pistol and pretty much the only issue giving me pause is ammo availability. I know, these days of Internet ordering make that less critical (ie Ammo-To-Go has some good SD 10mm loads in a variety of flavours) and I guess I'd just have to stock up.

How was the G29 as a shooter? I mean 10mm puts out some pretty stout figures so I imagine it would be on par with my SP 101 firing full house .357 ammo - with 5 extra shots of course . Looks to be a pretty good piece for CCW - I have a G19 and luv it.

As an aside - seems like Glock are the main company with a 10mm offering - except for S&W maybe. But CZ or HK don't seem to have an offering.

 

[Full Metal Jacket]

i actually seem to shoot the g29 better than my g19, despite my small hands. i didn't get the SF either (that one doesn't feel right to me). very accurate little blaster.

my local shop has the cci aluminum blazer for $23, so it's about the same as .45acp.

recoil is not unpleasant at all. i wouldn't recommend it for someone's first time firing a gun though lol

 

[Justin Holder]

A 10mm is not a "40 cal on steroids"!

A 40 cal is a watered down 10mm

 

[agtman]

Why the 10mm AUTO?

'Cause it carries well in hot weather, and you only need one shot.




Seriously, though, given what's currently chambered in 10mm, the Glock 29, with 10+1 capacity, is one heck of a powerhouse in a relatively compact package.

Love mine.

 

[W L Johnson]

Looks like the blast effects of a 45 to me.

 

[Full Metal Jacket]

i'm thinking 10mm interest will peak when the bren ten comes back out (although, personally, i was never a fan of it).

 

[wow6599]

What is it?
Well, I fell in love with my SF G20 the first time I ran 16 rds of 180 gr BB through it in about 4 seconds.
180 gr. Jacketed Hollow Point @ 1,350fps/728 ft. lbs
Not a 40S&W on.......

 

[Peter M. Eick]

Go out and shoot one. I find them accurate, reliable, and more power then any of my other autoloaders. They are just fun and accurate. I have been shooting the 10 about 20 years now and still get a grin on my face when I cut loose with one.

 

[9mmepiphany]

A 10mm is not a "40 cal on steroids"!

A 40 cal is a watered down 10mm

...and this is the truth

unlike the relationship of the .38Spl and the .357Mag or the .44Spl and the .44Mag...which were over loads of the smaller cases, that were than standardized in longer cases to prevent inadvertent loading in the wrong gun, the 10mm was a fully developed (some will say over-developed) cartridge.

the .40 was an attempt to duplicate a downloaded 10mm loading in a more compact case.

The concept of a Fighting 10mm was popularized by Jeff Cooper (yes I'm aware to the earlier development of the Centimeter round) as a replacement for his beloved .45ACP...throwing a 200gr, 10mm bullet @ 1000fps for improved penetration of hardcover, better accuracy and increased capacity out of an up-sized CZ-75.

The 10mm is the pistol equivalent to the .41 Mag for revlovers

 

[Zak Smith]

I really like shooting my 10mm - I find that the big Glock 20 frame (like the 21 frame) soaks up the recoil. Shooting a 21 and a 20 back to back with similar spec ammo, the 20 recoils faster, but the overall recoil feels about the same to me.

 

[420Stainless]

My local Walmart doesn't stock it. I do have an LGS that stocks several varieties at reasonable prices and a BPS not too far off as well. However, I do reload.

Its fun to shoot, certainly not nuclear, but it does have the power to make it a decent deer hunting round if so desired.

 

[surjimmy]

Besides it being a great round, I don't know.

 

[Kingofthehill]

I chose a 10mm because it was somewhat unique. I have a Dan Wesson 10mm that is being turned into my "BBQ Gun". I looked for as unique of a cartridge that i could still buy at a big chain gun store. 38 super and 10mm were the ones that caught my eye.

When people see my DW it turns heads and when they see its 10mm they get real interested.

10mm is fun to shoot and you can also convert it to .40 to shoot cheaper and more often. I like it for that reason and for when you really want some power, the 10 is there.

Full house 10 loads are a freaking BLAST!... Im going to get a Glock 20 soon and i plan on using that for my side arm during hog hunting trips and the often carry gun. My DW 10mm 1911 has taken down a couple hogs already and I don't think i could kill an animal that size humanely with anything less... And since im not a revolver fan, the 10mm fits well in my mind.

JOe

 

[Charles S]

9mmepiphany,

The 10mm is the pistol equivalent to the .41 Mag for revlovers

really???

The 10 mm at is best is the equivalent of a hot 357 and does not even come close to what the 41 Remington magnum is capable of. You might want to re-check your numbers... at is best the hottest 10mm loads do not even come close to the hottest 41 Remington magnum loads.

Here is a really hot 10 mm load.

Double Tap:

Ballistics : 180gr. @ 1350fps/ 728 ft/lbs- Glock 20
1136fps / 516 ft lbs 100yds Glock 20

Here is a really hot 41 Remington magnum load.

Buffalo Bore: Heavy .41 Magnum Ammo - 230 gr. Keith (1,450 fps/M.E. 1,074 ft. lbs.) - 20 Round Box

Check these velocities taken from real guns.

1. 6.5 inch Ruger 1379 fps

2. 4" S&W Mountain Gun 1310 fps

Only 25% more energy, yea, they are exactly alike... I get so tired of this analogy.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Perhaps I was mis-understood. I was referring to the 10mm and the .41Mag...in the paragraph just above the one you quoted...in their original intended design as fighting/service cartridges.

My personal opinion is that the overloaded versions of each cartridge, for marketing reasons, did more to hurt than help with their penetration into the handgun market.

 

[Charles S]

The 41 Remington was never loaded as it was originally intended by it's inventors. From the beginning the factory loads of the 41 Remington magnum were only marginally less than the 44 Remington magnum loads of that time. Over time they actually eclipsed most 44 magnum loads for a time.

While I will agree with you on intent.. real life has not proven otherwise... So I was speaking in real life.. not in cartridge intent.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

Check out the energy levels of the 10mm/vs. .45acp in full loads. The 10mm penetrates better, and still kicks butt, and depth of penetration is a serious issue with handgun rounds. Most other rounds fall short in penetrating barricades & car doors, window/windshield glass, large people in heavy clothing, etc. The 10mm is a nice compromise.

 

[surjimmy]

This keeps coming up 10mm = 41 mag, is the hottest 10mm = to the hottest 41 mag? NO, but a hot 10mm round is in the same class as a reg 41 mag. You don't need to tell me I'm wrong and post stats. Call Les Baer and tell him, these are his words not mine. I am inclined to believe the man that makes one of the finest weapons on the market. I am now at piece

 

[9mmepiphany]

The 41 Remington was never loaded as it was originally intended by it's inventors

Does that mean you haven't seen the 200gr LSWC loaded by Remington to 900fps? I still have the original green and yellow box out in my garage somewhere.

This load shot perfectly in my fixed sight 4" S&W M-58 M&P for which it was developed. It actually shot very close to POA for my 6" M-57 also

 

[Charles S]

Does that mean you haven't seen the 200gr LSWC loaded by Remington to 900fps?

I believe Jordon and Keith, according to Masad Ayoob, both specified a non-expanding 210 grain semi waddcutter between 950 and 1000 feet per second.

I do not believe your loading meets those specifications... please correct me if I am wrong. Further, the load you have is quite rare.. on the other hand the 210 grain jacket soft points and jacket hollow points loaded to 1350 fps were quite abundant...

Please feel free to split hairs at your leisure, but I stand by the assertion that the original loads suggested by the people who originally developed and lobbied for the 41 Remington magnum cartridge was never loaded.

Further... the load you mention was quite rare and not the mainstream loading. Again, I am speaking real life not theoretical loadings..

In real life the 10 mm and the 41 magnum are not equal in their actual loadings.

 

[9mmepiphany]

perhaps I was wrong in my memory of specs of the factory ammo

Guns & Ammo had this to say:

The choice for Keith was simple a big-bore lead semi-wadcutter at around 1,000 fps. In fact, he wanted to name it the .41 Police. Problem was, this was the 1960s and the marketing buzzword of the day was "magnum."

In retrospect, that nomenclature might have alleviated some of the confusion that arose when Remington introduced two loads simultaneously for the new cartridge. The first was specifically tailored to the Model 58 and featured a 210-grain lead semi-wadcutter at around 1,000 fps. It was (and still is) an optimum service revolver load, boasting considerably more throw weight than today's hugely popular 180-grain .40 S&W loading--at roughly the same velocity.

...with American Handgunner adding

Remington was swayed by its influence and instead of following Keith's blueprint chose to emphasize the performance of the new cartridge. As a result, the .41 "Magnum" load was released at an advertised 1500 ft/s, and even the "light" police loading was introduced with a 210 grain lead semiwadcutter "warmed up" to about 1,150 ft/s

So i was a bit light in quoting 900 fps, compared to your recollection of 950-1000fps, the factory spec of 210gr LSWC@1150fps out of a 6" barrel should be close enough out of a 4" M-58. I know that John Taffin favors reloading to that spec in his converted SAAs

While I have never had problems finding the Police loading, produced by Remington, Winchester and Federal, at my local Oshman's or other discount sporting goods stores like Best Products, here on the West Coast, perhaps availability was regional. After all we are close a LE agency (SFPD) that adopted the M-58 and the Police load as an issue combo

 

[W.E.G.]

I'd rather have a 38-40.