When will Illinois be normal?

[bclark1]

Depends on what you're studying, but yes, Purdue is a good school. Can't really go wrong with much, though. UNLV will be a blast if you can keep money in your pocket - I just got back from Vegas, second time out this year. I went to high school and did my undergrad (at UIUC) with one of my best friends who lives out there now. He's just getting into shooting, looking to purchase his first handgun and start carrying. I'm certainly proud of my influence I'm moving to Ohio in two weeks for grad school, I need to get on top of my Florida permit so I'll be able to carry out there. Bye bye IL.

 

[Deanimator]

Chicago has one saving grace: the food there is incredible. There are foods you get in Chicago that you can't get anywhere else.

...of course it's now effectively impossible to eat a decent meal anywhere north of Pilsen, since virtually every square foot of every sidestreet on the North Side is PERMIT parking. I'm not terribly interested in paying as much or more to park as to eat. Once nearly ALL the sidestreets became permit only, Chicago lost ALL attraction for me. Without a gun, I wouldn't ride public transit there on a bet.

There's NO excuse for Chicago now.

 

[Templar223]

Illinois residents are not as smart

By and large, Illinois residents are not as smart as residents elsewhere in the U.S.A.

Sure there are exceptions (I like to think gun owners are among the creme de la creme in IL), but why else would Illinois voters keep putting people like Rod Blagojevich (you can call him "Blow Jo" if you can't pronounce Blagojevich), Mike Madigan and a host of other anti-gun politicians ... not just Democrats either. Our last two Republican governors were very anti-gun as well.

Yes, Illinois will be the last state with CCW.

It will probably happen sometime in the next ten years.

If they don't pass a ban on all semi-automatic weapons next year.

John

 

[Edmond]

Because IL is run by Chicago. And in Chicago, they have people who "help" you vote at the voting places...

I'm not in Chicago but when I went to vote, they asked me what ballot and when I said Republican, they gave me this look

 

[HC_Jack]

My last voting experience was slightly more encouraging. The guy in front of me in line used his FOID card as his ID. When I requested my Republican ballot, I didn't get a funny look, but was struck by how many races that the Republicans weren't even fielding a candidate.

 

[mongo]

Well, I'm doing small bits to help... in EVERY election that I have been able to vote in, I vote for the NRA recc'd choice every time. I hope to see Blago gone this election, and I guess we need to wait for Daley to die before *****cago has any chance.

 

[MidnightRambler]

I'll be up in Chicago for two days in October, seats on the field 26 rows from the stage to see the Rolling Stones. I'll feel naked not being able to carry however.

Can everyone imagine what we might be able to accomplish if all 60 million gun owners joined the NRA and other pro groups?

 

[hotpig]

Quote{ Yes, Illinois will be the last state with CCW.

It will probably happen sometime in the next ten years.

If they don't pass a ban on all semi-automatic weapons next year.

John Quote}

I doubt that we will ever see CCW in Illinois. The assault weapon ban will more than likely pass this year and almost unopposed by the pro gun groups.

Why would the pro gun folks let it pass? Smoke and mirrors, almost worked last year. Put out some CCW Bills to attract the pro gun groups. Since CCW is a priority with these groups all of their effort will be diverted there.

They can get the weapons ban passed and easily kill the CCW Bill because it was mean to die any way.

 

[Autolycus]

Just wanted to bring back this thread.

The AWB has passed in Cook county. I fear it will soon be spreading through our legislature.

I feel that with all the recent crap that has happened in Chicago we will experience a lot of anti-gun sentiments.

The man trying to get a handgun and grenades to use in the mall.

The shooting deaths of 3 people on the 38th floor of a building.

IS there anyway we could use these tragic events to further are cause? I know it sounds morbid but it worked in Texas. Texas gun rights groups used the Lubys massacre to get CCW laws passed. I doubt it will work out so positively but nonetheless I figure it is worth asking again...

"When will Illinois be normal?" The rest of the country seems to be taking the idea that guns protect us a lot further than we are here in IL.

So now what?

 

[Jeff White]

I don't think either incident is a good argument for CCW. It would be hard for someone to say they left their handgun in their vehicle because the law said they couldn't carry it in the building and they were unable to save a loved one's life in Chicago, because mere possession of the handgun would have been illegal there.

Whatever incident happens is going to have to happen somewhere besides Chicago.

A CCW would be useless in the kind of attack the homegrown extremeist was planning. You'd have to shoot everyone at the trash bins to stop him from planting his bombs. Not a very good public example.

An armed citizen would be extremely valuable in an active shooter scenario, but the presence of an armed citizen makes no differance at bombing. Suicide bombers in Israel routinely detonate themselves in the presence of Israeli military reservists who are openly armed with their M16s or Galils.

Then you get into the sticky situation of trying to stop a suicide bomber. If you let them know you are on to them, they can detonate their charge as soon as they think they are compromised, so confrontations by armed citizens or the police can be just as bad as them detonating it on their own. If you spot one or a suspected one, you have to take them by surprise and headshots are recommended. What if you're wrong and the person you just shot in the head from behind really isn't a suicide bomber?

It's going to take an active shooter situation, outside of Chicago, where someone had a gun available, but couldn't use it because it was locked in their trunk to be in compliance with the law. And it's not going to hurt if that person is an attractive woman with education who can make a good media presence.

Logic will not work. It's going to take a big tug at emotions to get public support behind the effort.

Jeff

 

[Autolycus]

I very much agree with you about the mall incident and the "Jihadist" but the truth is that I expect that it can be used as an example of why we need more gun control. I do understand the police/feds caught him but I doubt we will see a spark in the amount of people who want more regulation on grenades.

Yes the situation would have to be ideal but I dont think we will see one. As I said earlier I think that perhaps we can use the simple example of an out of stater with a CCW who carried at home but was disarmed? Do you think that an incident like this would work better?

 

[DKSuddeth]

It's going to take an active shooter situation, outside of Chicago, where someone had a gun available, but couldn't use it because it was locked in their trunk to be in compliance with the law. And it's not going to hurt if that person is an attractive woman with education who can make a good media presence.

adding on to this, the only way to get the fence sitters in the city to realize that carrying is the best way to keep their kids safe would be to have someone who is carrying, especially illegally, be the one to save the day at a school shooting or playground area. If something like that were to happen and the media didn't immediately pounce on the gun toting do gooder as another criminal who endangered the lives of children by whipping bullets at a psycho gunman, chicago MIGHT have a shot.

 

[Jeff White]

Maybe we could get one of our Illinois hating members to sacrfice themselves for our cause .

I'm not sure an out of state resident with a CCW would get much support or media time. Suzanna Gratia Hupp has been to Illinois and she was unable to generate much momentum.

John Birch once told me his ideal situation would have been an attractive nurse who used an illegally carried gun to thwart a robber/rapist in the hosptial parking lot. I don't think that would work. The states attorney would probably bow to public opinion and not charge her with anything and it would be out of the news in a couple of days. That's the problem, outside of anomilies like the Hale Demar situation, good people are often given a pass for any UUW violation if they are ever unfortunate enough to have to use a firearm in self defense. It even happens in Chicago. Sort of comforting if you ever have to defend yourself, but a guaranteed felony if you are caught carrying and you didn't use your weapon to defend yourself.

I think it's going to have to be something like Lubys. An active shooter is working through a restaurant, school, factory, office, and there is a survivior who was willing to stand up and stop the carnage, but couldn't because his/her gun was locked in a case in the car.

Say a mother who is a shooter and is in the school for a room mother's meeting or something and they have an active shooter situation. Her pistol, rifle, shotgun whatever is legally stored in her car, parked on the street so the evil gun isn't on school property and the next Dylan/Kleebold wannabee strolls in shooting. Get her on the news tearfully asking Rod why he didn't want her to be able to defend her children. We have to beat them at their own game....the emotional appeal.

Jeff

 

[wdlsguy]

Jeff, just for the record, I don't hate Illinois (I have extended family living there) but I do hate the gun laws there. And I don't consider myself a "hero CCWer" either.

If you could get the hostage, or a family member of one of the victims on camera to denounce the Chicago handgun ban and/or the Illinois CCW ban, you might be able to make some headway.

 

[SolaScriptura139]

Then again, 70-80 million gun onwers in the U.S., total six million members of national gun rights advocacy organizations

It makes you wonder how many of those owners are actually pro-RKBA. I'm sure there are many of the "you only need guns for hunting" type. I always hear from people that they support the right to own firearms, but can't understand why I need or want to conceal carry, so I'm sure that crowd is significant. Another group is the "reasonable gun control" group, which says I shouldn't be allowed to own a gun that can penetrate an engine block, or own fully-automatic weapons because I don't need them.

 

[Manedwolf]

Probably about a decade or so after a major Katrina-like disaster or terrorist attack either wakes up or weeds out the blissninnies.

Unfortunately, I think that's what it's going to take. A complete collapse of civilization with roaming, unopposed looters and brutality to make people realize "I wish I had a...gun?"

 

[DC3-CVN-72]

Rember the shooting at the Brown's Chicken years ago in Palatine IL. It was a robbery after closing. They took all 7 employes to the freezer and murdered them. I always wondered why nobody ever made the point that if just 1 employie had a firearm the whole incident could have prevented.

 

[Jeff White]

Because that would be a logical argument. It's a hypothetical situation. What we needed was someone who was in a position to help, but was unable to because of the law, to cry on TV....Over and over....Logic will not win this battle. If it would we'd have had CCW a long time ago.

We must counter their illogical emotional response with a more compelling logical emotional response.

Jeff

 

[denfoote]

Most posters are right.
The problem is Chicago.
Unfortunately, Chicago has not been "normal" since before Al Capone!!
The words "corruption" and "Chicago" have gone hand and glove for so long that people just accept it as being NORMAL!!
Until that changes, nothing else will!!
When criminals run the government, then they have a vested interest in keeping guns out of the hands of the people!!