Which Milsurp to start with?

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juk

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I'm looking into buying an older milsurp gun to make noise at the range. I'm mostly torn as to what I want to start with though. I am looking for recommendations. I want a rifle that isn't very expensive to feed, easy to operate, and is fairly simple and reliable. I've been around long enough to know most of the major players. I would like to have a rifle that is at least 3MOA, and I do realize that that can be a crap-shoot with some of these old rifles. I would also like for it to be under the 400$ mark.

The one's I am particularly interested in are the Enfields, Finnish Mosins, Swedish Mausers, Swiss K31s, and your garden variety 98Ks. I am thinking that the Finnish Mosin is going to be my best bet. What are the pros and cons of these rifles. I'm just trying to gather as much info as possible before I really start looking.
 
ive been gassing for a k31 lately

(gas = gun aquisition syndrome)

(or as i also commonly am infected with, guitar aquisition syndrome)
 
The only thing I don't like about the K31 is the ammo availability...or lack thereof.
 
Um, I would say a Mosin, just cause, they are EVERYwhere, but then it really depends on what you want, a shooter, a mosin, a Springfield, hell, any gun will do...

if it's history, pick a time/place, event, and go from there.
if it's an interest, well, that's easy
 
My favorite is the M1, followed by the M1903A3, M1917, and No.4 Enfield. I like all of these because they have great adjustable aperture sights. The Garand has the best iron sights ever put on a rifle, is semi auto, and can actually be had for less than the average price of an '03A3 or 1917, so it is clearly the king of the mil-surps if you ask me.
 
You've got a pretty good list there. GP11 isn't that rare, and when you have some laid in and actually go out and make some noise with it, you'll see that that rifle and ammo combo is top-shelf.

The Mosin will definitely cost you less to run, per round, though. But the GP11 is match-grade, all of it, every round. Heck why not get one of each? :D
 
I'm with henschman.

Not too long ago, I swapped a few rounds in my M1 for a few in a 98 Mauser. Now I will admit to aging eyes, but I was shocked at the design of the Mauser's sights. The shootability of the M1's peep and post is, to me, far greater. That experience would heavily influence my choice of a plinker. Of course, special circumstances and pricing could override that consideration pretty easily.
 
Mosin-Nagant! Everyone needs one in there collection. If you splurge and get a Finnish M39 you will have a rifle that will be unmatched by most milsurps. And ammo is CHEAP.
 
The Good news; M-39 , 'cause the goal of shooting is to place the bullet and if you use good ammo and do your part, it will all the Do Da Day, and that aint bad :D
 
where are you guys finding most of these rifles for $400 or less? maybe it's a regional thing, but the k31 is well within the budget, the mauser is pushing it, and the others are a good bit above. at least that's what i've been seeing the last few years. i mention maybe regional because friends of mine in texas are happy to see a marlin 336, or a winchester model 94 for $500 when i see them mostly in the $300-$350 range.

with the budget, you could get a few mosin nagants and a couple hundred rounds of milsurp. my p-series mosin has served me well, and a pawn shop local to me gets mosins in regularly and sells them for $90 regardless of model, but i see the p-series for more like $120 in other places.
 
Ya cant beat a Mosin for the price...Get 1, and you'll probably get another, and another....ect
 
where are you guys finding most of these rifles for $400 or less? maybe it's a regional thing, but the k31 is well within the budget, the mauser is pushing it, and the others are a good bit above.
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I have three Kar 98Ks, which I paid $200, $200, and $250 for. I have three Mosin-Nagants, two M91/59s, which cost me $99 and $160, and a Finnish M39 that cost me $300. I also have an obscure SMLE Jungle Carbine that cost me $350. Local prices for a Swiss K-31 were hovering around $350. The only thing more expensive I hve seen are the 1903s, collectible Enfields, and collectible/rare Mausers.

The point is, there are PLENTY of decent milsurps to be found within a 400-dollar budget. Of all the ones I have shot a Finnish M39 will be the best shooter, accuracy is very consistant, 2-3 MOA on almost all M39s, some will do better, especially with handloads, and the ammo is cheap enough that you will get your money's worth (if you buy the spam cans online for plinking).
 
An inexpensive Mosin Nagant is going to be the cheapest to buy, easiest to find, and (considerably) the cheapest to shoot. It is also the most primative/clunky of these choices. It is fine for getting your foot in the door of mil-surp collecting, but it is possible that it might turn you off from that path by virtue of lacking any of the refinements you may be used to.

You can still get Czech and Yugoslav Mausers (v24, 48, etc.) for well under that budget, and they'll be a big step up in terms of feel and refinement. Ammo will be a little harder to find, cheap, but is out there.

Buying a K-31 is kind of stepping up to the Rolls-Royce of military surplus bolt-actions, and at $250-350 is an incredible steal for the pure quality of the firearm you're getting. It is almost an unfair comparison with other mil-surps as on close inspection you'll find that the parts have a fit and finish that exceeds that of some commercial rifles available today. The ammo is a bit pricier, at ~$50/shot, but it is incredible stuff -- all match grade. Again, almost an unfair comparison as these are rifles which will often shoot 1" iron-sighted groups off the bench (if you're up to it).

There are some Enfields that are still under that price tag. They were made in a bunch of places, with several different levels of fit & finish, some a bit rough. Some shoot really well. Some shoot better with oversized bullets because their bores are inconsistent. The design is really cool and they are a "must-have" for any collector, but might be frustrating for someone starting out.
 
Sorry, I was having fun; I think you left out a decimal point... I shoot new production Norma in the 7.5 swiss; it's around $1.85 / rd delivered. Good ammo and all modern (noncorrosive) components.

As far as mil-surps, I have a mosin, Swede Mauser and a Swiss K31. The Mauser is my favorite with the Swiss being a close second and the mosin being a mosin. I sold every commie-block weapon I had back in Nov / Dec of ’08, with the exception of the mosin. The numbers on it don’t match and it would not bring $149 on gunbroker, so I just kept it.

The only complaint I have about the Mauser is that it shoots about 5” high at 100 yds with the sight on the lowest setting (+/- 300m). I’m not sure if they all do this or just mine.

The Rubin is a great shooter, but I don’t really care for the bolt operation (guess I just find it odd). The two stage trigger is great! The second stage is easy to find and crisp from there. This rifle is a little more accurate than the Mauser.

I would really like to have a Garand and a 1903 Springfield. The Garand will likely be my next mil-surp purchase. I’m not shopping for one, but I’ll gladly take advantage of a good opportunity if I come across a deal.

Hope this helps you in your search for a mil-surp.
 
Pretty much ALL the Mauser type rifles shoot high at 100 yards, because they were designed for a 300 yard/meter battle sight. Higher front sight blades are available to lower the point of impact, though some people just build up the blade with some epoxy or JB Weld and file it down to the necessary height for a 100 yard zero.
 
juk, I would highly recommend picking up a nice Yugo M98. You can buy them for around $300-350 easily, and at that price, you can get a pristine shooter, and have money left over for ammo. I have had all sorts of Mausers, including K98s. None of them would outshoot my M98. They don't all shoot high at 100 yards, mine doesn't. The ammo you're using will have some effect on that. Plus, as mentioned, replacing the front sight blade with a tall one is cheap and easy.

I used to have a Russian Capture K98. Beautiful piece of history. Shot between 18"-36" high at 50 yards!! Not good. :) When you could hit paper, you'd end up with a nice shotgun pattern. I sold that rifle. :)

Keep in mind also, 100 yards is not what the "100" setting on the 98 elevation is for. It's for 100 meters. 100 meters is just over 109 yards. And we complain about them shooting high. :) Good luck on the quest!!
 
For quality and cheapness, the yugo 24/47 for 160 to about 200 is a fine short mauser. Accurate, and you have a real good chance of getting an almost pristine rifle. The mosins are wonderful, too, and still pretty inexpensive. Ammo is still cheap. Shop around, Classic is selling hexes for 78.00 Above all, get a c+r 03 license. If you want to buy old guns you need one. The swiss rifles are supposed to be fantastic but I never bought one because the ammo is expensive, both calibers.
 
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personally I like the lee enfield I have several now and most of times I've strayed from them I am disapointed. That being said If I were buying my first these would be my choices in order of likability.

1. M1 Garand (can be had for $400-$600)

2. SMLE No. 1 MK III* (I payed $180 for my first but $250-$300 is the norm)---this would be my choice if i were you

3. SMLE No. 4 MK I (I just bought one for $275, $300-$400 is the norm)

4. French MAS 1936 ( I paid $300, $200-$300 is the nom)

5. Finnish mosin (If your going to go mosin this is the one you want $350-$400 is the norm)

I personally don't like Axis weapons so I don't know much about mausers I've had a couple, and just didn't like to shoot them.
 
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1. M1 Garand (can be had for $400-$600)
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Wow. Maybe $600, but I'd be looking that one over REAL close. I'd expect to pay a bit more.

2. SMLE No. 1 MK III* (I payed $180 for my first but $250-$300 is the norm)---this would be my choice if i were you
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I think that sounds right, but there are some variants (Ishapores maybe?) that come in a bit lower sometimes.

3. SMLE No. 4 MK I (I just bought one for $275, $300-$400 is the norm)
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Agree. Great rifle!

4. French MAS 1936 ( I paid $300, $200-$300 is the nom)
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Ammo definitely becomes a concern. 7.5 French isn't something most dealers have ever even heard of.

5. Finnish mosin (If your going to go mosin this is the one you want $350-$400 is the norm)
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Yeah... for a Mosin, that's the good one. But... it's still a Mosin, with some of the quirks and brute simplicity that you either love, or hate ... or are just o.k. with. (Covering all the options there, eh? :))

I personally don't like Axis weapons so I don't know much about mausers I've had a couple, and just didn't like to shoot them, not to mention that creepy feeling of possibly holding a murder weapon.
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:scrutiny: EVERY military surplus rifle might have been used to take a life by someone or another. That's not (necessarily) murder. And no weapon kills anyone. Murder is an act committed by a person, not a tool.
 
How about the Ishapore 2a1 in plentiful 7.62 NATO?

(The Chilean Mauser in .308 is listed on a popular site for $169. Add a battle pack of .308 for $70-80 and you're in.)
 
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My favorites are the Swedish 96, Swiss K31, and Czech 98/22 for fit, finish, and accuracy. Most any k31 or 96 will shoot an moa at 100 yards, the 98/22 is almost there too. The Finn 39s will usually really shoot too. If I could only have one it would be a Swede.
 
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