what sense would that make?? there are a gazillion deer rounds out there alreadyBecause they didn't market it correctly. They should have called it the 30 Remington Deerslayer and put it in a M700 and the Model Seven.
what sense would that make?? there are a gazillion deer rounds out there alreadyBecause they didn't market it correctly. They should have called it the 30 Remington Deerslayer and put it in a M700 and the Model Seven.
The BO had heavy backing from Remington (owner of AAC). New bullets and lots of cheap ammo at rollout. Maybe this was Remington's prefered .30 bore and caused their shift in focus.But yet the grendel survives and the blackout comes out and thrives. Neither of them had the backing of a company as big as Remington as far as I know. They both just did things that people wanted. Let's face it....an AR in something other than 223/556 is a niche product....it's going to be bought by people that are going to do their research(competition/ballistics/hunting/etc) and are looking for something specific with the proof to back it up. They didn't really change the game with it. Nothing wrong with it...but it didn't exactly blow anyone's mind either.
You answered your own question. Everyone is pretty satisfied with 7.62x39 performance in an AR package. .300 BO pretty much gets you there and the only thing you need is a barrel.The holy grail of a hunting AR-15 should be near .308 performance out of a compact AR-15 weight rifle. I have tried .300BLK, 6.8SPC and 7.62 X 39 AR-15s and the .300 Remington AR trumps them all by a significant margin for energy and flat shooting. It certainly seems that Remington gave up on the project and they dumped the last remaining rifles on clearance to CDNN last year. I currently hunt with a Remington R25 and would consider it on the very upper end of acceptable weight and size but for older or smaller hunters it would certainly be too much mass. If I go back to an AR-15 platform I will have to go back to the 7.62X39 and try and build a free float accurate rig to shoot brass cased precision ammo. Its a real shame because the .30 Rem AR would be perfect if it had become a commercial success.
Pretty sure the government had nothing to do with Rem pulling the plug. Nothing magical about 7.62 either. Common M855 can get through some level 3 armor that 7.62 can't.It's pretty simple why it didn't fly...the government didn't want it to. With all the black rifles out there, do you think the government really wants most of those rifles converted to a capability that approaches .308/7.62 NATO performance. It's much easier to defend against 5.56 NATO rounds. My opinion would be that the govt. quietly approached them and said, "Kill this thing in the crib"...thus it quietly went away before it could gain popularity in the civilian market.
It's much easier to defend against 5.56 NATO rounds.
It is moot when the question is
Remington developed it...Remington introduced it, Remington marketed it.
Nope. Totally doubt it.It's pretty simple why it didn't fly...the government didn't want it to. With all the black rifles out there, do you think the government really wants most of those rifles converted to a capability that approaches .308/7.62 NATO performance. It's much easier to defend against 5.56 NATO rounds. My opinion would be that the govt. quietly approached them and said, "Kill this thing in the crib"...thus it quietly went away before it could gain popularity in the civilian market.
Maybe you are just asking the wrong questions.Firstly the .30 Rem isn't even close to a .308. It also isn't even close to the 6.5 Grendel in being flat shooting.
It was basically the answer to a question that no one had ever asked.
Amen and I think it is done on purposeRegardless of how people view Remington's participations and/or leadership in the intro and success of the .223/5.56, IT WAS 50 YEARS AGO!
I'm in the high tech business in the silicon valley, running divisions of some big companies out here and that means marketing as well as product development, sales, et al and I am stunned how meager and conservative is the focus and execution on marketing by most every of the U.S. firearms companies.
Remington, Winchester and Colt seem to be living in another era counting on a reputation earned twenty-five, fifty, or a hundred years ago. The worst web sites, the worst distribution and reseller strategies, terrible production planning, and a proliferation of unexplainable (or at least unexplained) models coupled with irregular product quality and mixed grades in customer support.
There is so much low-hanging fruit here in this industry and it just seems a pity that someone doesn't step in and really try to turn these companies in to a modern consumer goods-type company. Some firearms veterans might be turned off by modern air and ground marketing techniques, but no one would balk at financially healthier companies with products that many of us would enjoy buying and using.
B
Exactly right it is very close to the full power .308 the 300 AR is an excellent round. But then again the 5.56 is a do it all round. Close range ,long range, hunting grizzly, sinking aircraft carriers sniping etc hard to beatMaybe you are just asking the wrong questions.
Isn't even close to a .308??? It seems to me that you are passing on information without actually looking at the reality of what the 30 RAR is capable of. Run the numbers on 150gr bullets for the 30RAR and the .308win. If you compare bullet to bullet, powder to powder and max load to max load you will find that the 30RAR is between 90% and 96% of a .308win for every powder/bullet. I would say that is pretty darn close to a .308win.
Maybe we have a different idea of "not even close" though.
Also... why does it need to mimic the .308? Why can't it just succeed on it's own merits? I've shot a bunch of deer (mule deer in CO and whitetail in GA), and pigs with my 30RAR and every one of them haven't taken a single step using 130gr Speer HotCore and 125gr/150gr Nosler Ballistic Tips. The pigs I have shot haven't even squealed... bang -> dead. So I ask... does it really need to mimic the .308win? Will a deer be anymore dead hit with a 150gr Nosler BT with a muzzle velocity of 2870fps instead of 2692fps? (a 6.2% difference) Can a deer really be 6.2% more dead?
Granted, the .308 can obviously shoot heavier bullets than the .30RAR but that only matters if you NEED/WANT to shoot heavier bullets.
The 30rar is an OUTSTANDING hunting cartridge whether certain people want to admit it or not. The statement " It was basically the answer to a question that no one had ever asked." always gets my goat. It is such a close minded way of looking at just about any subject. Sorry if I offend you. We clearly have different views... and there is nothing wrong with that. Cheers.