Wonder what 12ga breaching ammo looks like?

[Milkmaster]

A friend of mine bought a box of 12ga "breaching" loads to play with, and he agreed to give me one for examination. After my assessment, it is my opinion that this ammo is highly over priced for what it is. His box of ten rounds cost him $50. Basically it is rat shot inside the cup with a polymer cap over the end. What say you?

 

[Odd Job]

Thanks for showing it, I have never seen that before!

 

[Mizar]

Isn't the whole idea behind "breaching rounds" are to be (relatively) harmless once they achieve their intended purpose? As for the cost - I doubt that Fiocchi sells them at that price to law enforcement agencies.

 

[edwardware]

You should repack that, and shoot it.

Through a 2x4, into a piece of drywall 5 ft behind the 2x4. That should illustrate the working principle well.

 

[12Bravo20]

I have used breaching rounds while in the Army and I would not want to use those Fiocchi rounds or any round with shot in it.

The breaching rounds we used were frangible sintered steel (compressed powder) slugs. With the sintered slugs, there is less chance of anything coming back towards you. And no matter what type of breaching load you use, you definitely want a stand off muzzle device designed for breaching operations.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

I believe some breaching rounds use ceramic balls too, the idea being they transfer energy, but basically turn to powder in the process.

 

[tmd16556]

Looks like misfit birdshot and a load of 800X in a thick, unslit wad.

 

[PWC]

A frangible "slug"

 

[lemaymiami]

I figure that any close contact 12ga round would work as a "breaching round"... Ones designed for breaching though are supposed to open the door without doing harm to anyone inside (who might not be "bad guys"..). I've never seen an issued breaching round so this one although not "G.I" is of interest. Shotgun rounds can be had for any purpose - from relatively benign to seriously harmful, so choose your rounds accordingly.. Once you've become proficient, to reach the "next level" find someone to teach you skip-shooting (how to use ricochet impacts for lethal purposes...).

 

[Riomouse911]

We used them in training a time or two. I never cut one open though but I believe it was a solid mass of steel powder like described above. We also had a couple of guys went to an “explosive breaching class” to learn that art, but our team never needed to use either of them for a door. (Other higher level SWAT/SRT teams probably do use them.)

For us a Halligan Bar



And/or a ram (We called it the doorbell)



Were all we ever needed.

Stay safe.

 

[Gordon]

Seen and used breeching rounds mid 80 s thru 2012 and all were zinc or a mixture of ceramic and iron .

 

[tmd16556]

What is the shot weight?

 

[Milkmaster]

What is the shot weight?

It says 11/4 oz on the box.

 

[JAshley73]

Leads me to think that some wax slugs made from Winchester AA's in #9 would do the trick...

 

[WestKentucky]

I cut open a GI dud a while back. Was exactly as described above. Compressed steel powder. Seemed to have some stickiness to it though, some additive that served almost as an epoxy. It came out as a single piece, but it did come apart pretty easily. Much easier than frangible 9mm bullets do. Seemed to me at the time that a choked shotgun would likely cause that slug to fail. I believe that I would have more faith in the GI type breacher than a load of #9 in a thimble.

 

[12Bravo20]

I cut open a GI dud a while back. Was exactly as described above. Compressed steel powder. Seemed to have some stickiness to it though, some additive that served almost as an epoxy. It came out as a single piece, but it did come apart pretty easily. Much easier than frangible 9mm bullets do. Seemed to me at the time that a choked shotgun would likely cause that slug to fail. I believe that I would have more faith in the GI type breacher than a load of #9 in a thimble.

Like I have mentioned earlier, I have used the frangible sintered metal breeching rounds I would not want any lead pellets bouncing off the door and flying back at my support hand or any other body part. The military rounds instantly disintegrate upon impact while still busting the door, handle, and/or hinge. And yes wearing good gloves is a must since that powder does come back and hit your support hand.

 

[22250Rem]

Thanks to all who provided input on 12 ga. breaching ammo. I have an empty 12 ga. hull that is so marked around here but can't find it right now. Always wondered what was in it. About 10 years ago I was reading gas & electric meters as my "semi-retirement" job. Had to go into a couple old commercial / residential buildings that were vacant and slated for demolition to get one last reading before the meters were removed. Saw several of those empty hulls on the floor in different areas. I'm guessing that the local police or county sheriff's departments were in there doing some training and/or practice using door breaching rounds. Didn't see the doors anywhere; just empty door frames that I walked through. They probably hauled them out after they were done.

 

[FL-NC]

We used a round called a Hatten. Powdered lead bound with some type of glue.

 

[kBob]

Ummm, a fireman’s billed Axe will open a lot of doors very fast…..

-kBob

 

[12Bravo20]

Ummm, a fireman’s billed Axe will open a lot of doors very fast…..

-kBob

That will work just fine for most wood or thin metal doors for state side law enforcement. It's kind of hard to have a fireman's axe strapped to your ruck. And that is why we used the short birds head gripped shotguns or full size 590's loaded with breeching rounds. Those are easier to strap to your ruck of carry across your back.

 

[entropy]

And they can be used for more than a melee weapon if needed. A sintered slug isn't the best anti personnel round, but it beats trying to throw a fireman's axe across a room....

 

[lemaymiami]

Close quarters are what a combat shotgun was meant for (also home defense, etc)... With almost any round it's one shot fight ender - if you do your part.

All I ever wanted in the way of ammo was either basic 00buck or a rifled slug for barricaded opponents -and either one will breach a door if you're not worried about casualties on the other side. I'm betting in action you'd load a breaching round - only when needed for a specific situation (but all the rounds behind would be something more substantial...).

 

[12Bravo20]

In some cases it was easier to shoot the hinges with a breeching round than it was to shoot the handle/locking mechanism. So in this case one would need more than just one round. This is where the short smoothbores such as the 'witness protection' type of shotguns come in handy. You can breech the door then swing the shotgun out of the way and go to your primary weapon.

We didn't even bother to breech the doors in some cases, we would just make our own door opening in a wall

 

[entropy]

Pre framed charges or ad hoc?

 

[Milkmaster]

My Marine son tells me the training they experienced with the breeching rounds was to shoot right above or below the door latch at ~45 degree angle. The you were able to kick the door in. My guess is that may or not be possible if it is a metal industrial type door. Wooden or light metal clad domestic doors would be easier to breech.