Yet another Glock safety question

[Sinsaba]

I'm puzzled by 4thHorseman's post ...

A long post, it contains lots of unrelated bits of information (some of it wrong ... min number of feet a "glock bullet" travels 1148 I shoot subsonic 147 gr ... 990 fps ) ... uh... what's a "glock bullet"?

I guess the purpose of the post is to show that there have been many problems all over the US?

While I didn't read each and every example given in the post, none of the AD/ND stories seemed to indicate anything other than someone pulled the trigger with one in the chamber the gun went off!! Go figure!!

I hope that I can keep it together and keep my finger off the trigger unless the gun is pointed at something I intend to shoot. If I get careless and don't, I won't be blaming it on the Glock trigger.

Part of the post was about Glock setteling suits out of court and the plaintiffs not being able to talk about it. 1) Companies frequently do this (settle out of court) when they think either the mood of the public/court will be against them or the cost of defending themselves will be too high. 2) when they settle out of court they frequently have a gag on the plantiff. They don't want the rest of the world saying "oooh... free money!!"

Yes I have posted before about the trigger. About Glock's calling it a "safe trigger". That was more about semantics than anything else.

 

[Elmer]

Heavier triggers are installed on many PD Glocks because the average cop knows about as much about handling a firearm as I know about flying the space shuttle.

Most are poorly trained and not to bright to start with when it comes to firearms. Also a few are just morons to start with just like every other group of people. Just because they are "police officers" does not make them firearms experts and it also does not make them intelligent.

The few cops that are into guns such as the few that post on this board should not need a heavy trigger.

They have enough brains not to pull the trigger unless they intend to fire the pistol.

Idiots have no business with a Glock no matter what they do for a living so perhaps it is not wise to issue Glocks to PD's.

That does not mean that those of us that have over half a brain can not safely carry a Glock no matter if we wear a badge or not.

As usual, Bobby Lee's post contains the words "morons" and "idiots", his description for anyone who has a problem with Glock.

Most new cops these days have little experience in firearms when they are hired, but have to take many hours of firearms training before going in the field, and then qualify often, (sometimes monthly). But according to Bobby, and the other Kool....I mean Glock folks, they are apparently morons and idiots compared to Joe Sixpack that goes into a store and buys a Glock.

I'm not buying it... or drinking it.....

 

[jc2]

Glocks are not necessarily "unsafe." Firearms by nature are "unsafe." However, Glocks are definitely more prone to operator error than many (most?) designs.

People like to point out how easy Glocks are to use and to train new people to shoot well ("shoot" NOT "handle"). The very design characteristics that make Glocks easy to use and easy to shoot--a short, light trigger stroke--are also the same characteristics that make Glocks more prone to operator error than most designs.

Any weapon is a series of compromises. The Glock design is an easy to use, easy to shoot design. The result of that compromise is that is less tolerant of handling errors (i.e., more prone to operator error) than most designs.

 

[Elmer]

Well said...

 

[DT Guy]

I've yet to meet a Glock with a trigger so light it approaches a cocked, quality 1911.


And I've spent many hours trying to get mine into just such a state.


Larry

 

[Bobby Lee]

There are two BS statements that come from the anti Glock people and the majority of them make both claims.

"The Glock trigger pull is so short and light that the slightest touch will fire the pistol so they are extremly dangerous."

"The Glock trigger pull is so long and heavy and so full of creep that they are almost impossible to shoot well."

They need to make a choice and only stick to one line of BS.

The same pistol can't have it both ways.

 

[Bobby Lee]

"As usual, Bobby Lee's post contains the words "morons" and "idiots", his description for anyone who has a problem with Glock"

Yes it is my opinion that anyone that can't train himself to keep his finger off the trigger of a loaded firearm is an IDIOT and or a MORON and they have no business with a firearm.

Someone like this will have an AD with their carry gun sooner or later no matter what they carry.

 

[Bobby Lee]

Posted by JC2

" The Glock design is an easy to use, easy to shoot design. The result of that compromise is that is less tolerant of handling errors (i.e., more prone to operator error) than most designs."

That is true.

But people also manage to have AD's with much "safer" designs.

 

[jc2]

But people also manage to have AD's with much "safer" designs.

Nobody is suggesting otherwise. What was said was the Glock design is more prone to operator error than most other designs--NOT that other designs are foolproof.

I realize both of your statements about the Glock trigger pull are purposely exagerrated strawmen, but I would point out there is a difference between a GOOD trigger and a LIGHT trigger. Glocks definitely have light trigger pulls so I have no problem at all saying Glocks have a light trigger, BUT they also have have a sorry trigger. I can understand the difference between "good" and "light"--sometimes I forget others may not. ("Mushy" is the word I tend to use to describe the feel of the Glock trigger having grown-up with the "breaks like a glass rod" trigger pull of a good Government Model or the smooth, even trigger stroke of good N-frame.)

 

[popeye]

I don't understand why these posts keep comming up. Why not just do a search on Glock previous posts and you'll come up with plenty of info on Glock. If you've got an honest concern about Glock safety avoid buying one, because if you do you'll never trust it.

 

[medmo]

Bobby Lee,

Thanks again for the annoyance and passion. Feel free to do some web searches and find out why our Federal Gov't is contracting and purchasing Non-Glock firearms by the tens of thousand guns. Generally the state, county, munincipal and other local LE follow the trend of the Fed's. Only those idiots can understand the shortcomings of Glock. I think one of the top 10 rules of Firearm Safety is "keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot" and not "keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to field strip". Hey, I'm just another moron.

Thanks again,

Medmo

 

[Bobby Lee]

"I think one of the top 10 rules of Firearm Safety is "keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot" and not "keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to field strip". Hey, I'm just another moron."

The Glock design requires that you dry fire the pistol before it is possible to field strip it.

If you pull the trigger without checking the chamber YOU ARE A MORON.

It is the same with any firearm. You don't dry fire untill you are SURE the weapon is clear.

I really don't see the problem here and as long as you are not a MORON then it is safe to dry fire a Glock and field strip it.

 

[TexasTrigger]

New SA Gun wanted

Renewed my Texas concealed handgun license yesterday, qualifying on the range with my H & K. P7 M13. I am looking for another hand gun, either a Glock 27 or the Khar PM 4043, both 40 cal to easier carry as a concealed weapon. There is a huge difference in price between the two firearms; other than price, I would like to get your opinions of the pros and cons as to which would be the better selection, especial from those of you who have actually used both, or one or the other; those of you that only have opinions can weigh in a s well.

Regards,

Paul

 

[SpookyRCON]

My 2 cents

Hi, I jus wanted to add my two cents given that I carry two very different pistols while on duty. I switch depending on my mood between a Springfield Armory Loaded Stainless Steel 1911-A1 or a Glock 23. My Glock came factory with a 5.5 Lb trigger pull and the Springfield is factory at 4 Lbs. I use a Blackhawk SERPA Carbon Fiber Holster on my duty belt and a FOBUS paddle for off duty. I have personally never found a situation where my clothing would snag on the trigger. Nor have I found the trigger on the Glock to be mushy...I know when its going to break by feel (took a lot of practice)and I have been in situations where I was applying pressure on the trigger while pointed at Joe Dirtbag (thank God he backed down and surrendered...I hate Domestics). I do agree that you must be scrupulously conscious of where you place your trigger finger before you shoot, but I believe that should be the case with any Firearm. Lessons learned From Drill Sgt Garza (RIP) at Ft. Benning a long long time ago that I passed on when I was an Army NCO and that I still pass on to my partners. (I get stuck with rookies...a lot.) We issue Glock, but dept has given us discretion to use what we want within reason. I like Glock...I have never had a missfire or feed malfunction...same with my Springfield. Though I will concede the Springfield shoots much tighter groups! Glock takes immense abuse and make good duty sidearms...but as with all things it is just one tool on your belt. Your best weapon on the street is the gray matter between your ears. Stay safe everyone and God Bless!

 

[pablo45]

Regardless of what anyone has to say i love my glock's and would not trust any other gun with my life. Sorry all you people who do not like Glock i made up my mind when i first shot one. Never not even one mishap. Not one misfire. Not one accidental discharge. Not one safety issue and not one jam or stovepipe. I have almost 100,000 round's through my Glock 22. All my other gun's i would not dare shot as often as my Glock.

 

[Flopsy]

FACT:Glocks have zero margin for trigger error or snagging accident, whereas a weapon with a manual safety provides an extra margin for such an error or accident.

This is a fact, it is indisputable, and NOT WORTH ARGUING OVER. If you're comfortable with this FACT, great, then enjoy your Glock - it's a magnificent firearm. If you're not, then get something else. Do we really have to call each other morons with no training or discipline because they have different feelings about the FACT?

That said, this is not even beating a dead horse anymore - this dead horse now resembles a red pulp.


Edit: By the way, I love my Glock.

 

[Panthera Tigris]

......

 

[Guns_and_Labs]

Lately I've read a lot of posts regarding the safety of Glocks (e.g. no external safety, possibility of negligent discharge if anything finds it's way into the trigger guard, etc). Why doesn't this line of thinking also apply to Kahrs or any other pistol that lacks an external safety and or de-cocker that disengages the hammer?

As someone else said, Glocks are more fun to criticize.

But you raise a point that occurs to me occasionally at the range. I have both a Glock and a Kahr that I practice with. Both are customized, to include trigger jobs that make them as light and smooth as can be. Both are good, reliable handguns, both are susceptible to trigger snag mishaps (compared to something with a manual safety), but only Glock gets the bad press. You'd think that Kahr would, it doesn't even have the trigger dingus that the Glocks do.

I suppose I should be more concerned about the Kahr than the Glock -- one less safety feature -- but then, I worry about holstering technique with the 1911's too. Did I get that thumb safety fully on, etc.

I do think that the simplicity of the Glock, its price, and its ubiquity, tend to attract more than its fair share of people who really shouldn't be handling guns at all.

 

[JohnKSa]

This one's back from the dead... First clue was seeing names of folks who aren't at THR anymore.