LGS's that fear gouge. Would or will you go back?

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7thCavScout said:
Yesterday I went into an LGS that I have done pretty steady business with over the years. I asked if they had any Glock 19 fifteen round mags. I was was shocked when they said "We sure do!" I was even more shocked when he laid a couple on the counter and said, "$53.00 each." I passed and walked out.
I understand it's his store,...supply and demand...etc, etc. Just curious if you guys would or will avoid doing business with a store like this in future. I really liked the store and the owner (up until now that is).
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I would much rather they have them available for $53 than be sold out.

If they are sold out they may as well have them with a $1,00,000 price tag, as they are unattainable.

I sold three of my like-new 17 round 9mm Glock magazines on an equipment exchange a few weeks ago. I got $150 for the three, shipped, and they sold the day I posted them, if I recall correctly.

Based on that I'd say his asking price is pretty in line with the market.
 
Birch Knoll said:
Oh. My. God.

My question ("how much would you ask for an M&P15 today") is too grossly oversimplified? The whole question seemed very simple when you were excoriating the dealer for asking $3k. You didn't seem to allow that there might be all sorts of factors that go into his pricing. You seemed to think that what sold for $700 last month ought to sell for not a lot more than $700 today. But now you say that the price would vary depending on the identity of the buyer (!), the political situation (isn't that what the dealer is doing?), as well as "other factors". Phase of the moon, I suppose, or maybe what you had for breakfast.

Sorry, weasel answer. You lose.
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Well said. I was going to post a similar response but you beat me to the punch and did a better job of it. His weasel answer (post #62) made me throw up in my mouth a little bit.
 
If you had a Glock mag on your yard sale table and two guys walked up at exactly the same moment and wanted to buy it, which guy would you sell to? Would it be the one with $10 in his hand or the one with $60?
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Trick question!!


The correct response would be...

[X] The hot college chick wearing a bikini. :D
 
Went into a local gun/ammo store and was sickened by the price gouging going on.

PMC .223 Rem 20 round box, normally $7 - $9 per box, now? $20!

Some of the 9MM and .45 ACP defense loads were 40% - 75% higher than anywhere else

Bulk ammo, ie: russian/chinese stuff was between $80 and $120 higher than another local gun shop that sells what they have at reasonable prices.

Talked to another guy shopping at this expensive place and commented that i hope they use "protection" when they bend their customers over (i cleaned that quote up for being here on THR.org.) I will not go back to this place, even if the price comes down but i may go in and throw comments to the other shoppers about who this company is.
 
borrowedtime69 said:
Went into a local gun/ammo store and was sickened by the price gouging going on.

PMC .223 Rem 20 round box, normally $7 - $9 per box, now? $20!

Some of the 9MM and .45 ACP defense loads were 40% - 75% higher than anywhere else

Bulk ammo, ie: russian/chinese stuff was between $80 and $120 higher than another local gun shop that sells what they have at reasonable prices.
Click to expand...

Was and is it in stock at the other place?
 
I'm on both sides of the fence on this issue. I've recently had enough post secondary level business courses to (sort of) agree with the capitalist way of raising prices per current demand even though I'm not comfortable with it. But since I'm still in that post-secondary learning phase I'm absolutely broke and wish it weren't true. ;)

I can see where some of the posters that do have some scruples are coming from though as I too roam around on that side of the fence. I refuse to make as much money from a sale as the market will bear. Yeah, I'll be the first one to say I'm stupid due to that but I have a conscience that I have to live with. A very powerful conscience. I simply can not take advantage of someone for money. Life is too short to screw people for something that transitory. I'm not against making a profit so don't misconstrue what I'm saying; a healthy profit is why folks go into business, the question isn't what the market will bear in all cases however. Things like Pmags are manufactured daily. The MSRP has probably not changed more than what happens for a normal year-end increase (maybe a few %). This alone makes any price more than MSRP price gouging regardless of how you want to classify a free market.

I've noticed that the majority of folks here that espouse a healthy free market system are the ones with an apparently healthy supply of disposable income (one gentleman said he spent $1500 every couple of months on firearms supplies! :what:). The other thing I've noticed is the ones that are ridiculing the 'unprepared' have been in the sport (extremely heavily) for many, many years. I've only been enjoying the sport for about two years now. I'm 56 years old. So I'm not all that familiar with the happenings of 2004, 2008 or any other time of firearm famine. So how was I to know to be 'prepared'?
Gouging really is in the eye of the beholder. But price increases affect the less-wealthy first. If you are well off, being snobbish about it is just as childish as complaining about it.

It is a fact of life here in our free country that we are not all created equal, especially with our ability to earn money. So the wealthy or well-off need to gain a small bit of compassion. And us poor folk need to gain a small bit of understanding. Maybe we can agree to disagree?

:confused::what:
 
I ask, who is gouging? I doubt the manufacturer is raising prices much, if any. The LGS is marking his prices according to replacement cost but there are many who are abusing the system to cash in on the mood of the moment. I'm guessing that the distributors are the most guilty here. Unless you are a big dog in the retail world, you are probably buying from a middleman. I'm guessing these are the whores who are driving up the retail prices. These guys don't have their name on the mag (or whatever) and they don't deal with the customer who feels he is getting jobbed. They are the unseen greedy guys who rip off the retailer. It's not fair to blame the LGS except in the cases mentioned here where they clearly decided to stick it to their customers.
 
There's a place I've been doing business for over 20 years----every time there is a panic the prices go up.

I simply stay away and DON'T PLAY THEIR GAME.

When prices come back to the real world--I glady buy from them because usually they are the only ones who have what I want in stock.

You really can't blame a small business for trying to maximize profit--times are tough---I just let someone else pay it.
 
greybeard57 said:
I'm on both sides of the fence on this issue. I've recently had enough post secondary level business courses to (sort of) agree with the capitalist way of raising prices per current demand even though I'm not comfortable with it. But since I'm still in that post-secondary learning phase I'm absolutely broke and wish it weren't true. ;)

I can see where some of the posters that do have some scruples are coming from though as I too roam around on that side of the fence. I refuse to make as much money from a sale as the market will bear. Yeah, I'll be the first one to say I'm stupid due to that but I have a conscience that I have to live with. A very powerful conscience. I simply can not take advantage of someone for money. Life is too short to screw people for something that transitory. I'm not against making a profit so don't misconstrue what I'm saying; a healthy profit is why folks go into business, the question isn't what the market will bear in all cases however. Things like Pmags are manufactured daily. The MSRP has probably not changed more than what happens for a normal year-end increase (maybe a few %). This alone makes any price more than MSRP price gouging regardless of how you want to classify a free market.

I've noticed that the majority of folks here that espouse a healthy free market system are the ones with an apparently healthy supply of disposable income (one gentleman said he spent $1500 every couple of months on firearms supplies! :what:). The other thing I've noticed is the ones that are ridiculing the 'unprepared' have been in the sport (extremely heavily) for many, many years. I've only been enjoying the sport for about two years now. I'm 56 years old. So I'm not all that familiar with the happenings of 2004, 2008 or any other time of firearm famine. So how was I to know to be 'prepared'?
Gouging really is in the eye of the beholder. But price increases affect the less-wealthy first. If you are well off, being snobbish about it is just as childish as complaining about it.

It is a fact of life here in our free country that we are not all created equal, especially with our ability to earn money. So the wealthy or well-off need to gain a small bit of compassion. And us poor folk need to gain a small bit of understanding. Maybe we can agree to disagree?

:confused::what:
Click to expand...

Since when is it screwing people to offer anybody in the open market a chance to buy something at the going rate?
 
Two of the LGS I go to aren't "price gouging". I can still order Colt 6920s for $1100. Show your support or lack of support for businesses by patronizing them or not.
 
And remember, this is a market and there are many points of sale. If one guy prices an item at $3,000 and sells a few, his neighbor will price the same item at $2,990 and sell LOTS. Buying at the lowest price you can find is still following the market.

And so is waiting a few months because you're convinced the price will come down due to changes in supply and demand.
 
There are primarily three annoyed demographics with the panic buying:
  1. People who had their normal purchase routines disrupted without sufficient reserves, such as myself (hard to get the ammo I need for some training courses this year. My own fault)
  2. People who are new to these firearms and don't have much of anything accumulated (unfortunate timing)
  3. People who wanted to jump on the bandwagon panic buying but were too late (whiners)

The market is much better off that firearms are still being offered at an elevated price than not offered at all. I bet plenty of folks would scream "there ought to be a law" if all these price gougers simply stopped selling, period.
 
Cesiumsponge said:
There are primarily three annoyed demographics with the panic buying:
  1. People who had their normal purchase routines disrupted without sufficient reserves, such as myself (hard to get the ammo I need for some training courses this year. My own fault)
  2. People who are new to these firearms and don't have much of anything accumulated (unfortunate timing)
  3. People who wanted to jump on the bandwagon panic buying but were too late (whiners)

The market is much better off that firearms are still being offered at an elevated price than not offered at all. I bet plenty of folks would scream "there ought to be a law" if all these price gougers simply stopped selling, period.
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EXACTLY!

I can't believe how many people don't realize this, and I can't believe how many people praise their local store that has nothing in stock or available at all while cursing the guy that has $53 magazines right there on the counter, if you want them.
 
greybeard57 said:
I'm on both sides of the fence on this issue. I've recently had enough post secondary level business courses to (sort of) agree with the capitalist way of raising prices per current demand even though I'm not comfortable with it. But since I'm still in that post-secondary learning phase I'm absolutely broke and wish it weren't true. ;)

I can see where some of the posters that do have some scruples are coming from though as I too roam around on that side of the fence. I refuse to make as much money from a sale as the market will bear. Yeah, I'll be the first one to say I'm stupid due to that but I have a conscience that I have to live with. A very powerful conscience. I simply can not take advantage of someone for money. Life is too short to screw people for something that transitory. I'm not against making a profit so don't misconstrue what I'm saying; a healthy profit is why folks go into business, the question isn't what the market will bear in all cases however. Things like Pmags are manufactured daily. The MSRP has probably not changed more than what happens for a normal year-end increase (maybe a few %). This alone makes any price more than MSRP price gouging regardless of how you want to classify a free market.

I've noticed that the majority of folks here that espouse a healthy free market system are the ones with an apparently healthy supply of disposable income (one gentleman said he spent $1500 every couple of months on firearms supplies! :what:). The other thing I've noticed is the ones that are ridiculing the 'unprepared' have been in the sport (extremely heavily) for many, many years. I've only been enjoying the sport for about two years now. I'm 56 years old. So I'm not all that familiar with the happenings of 2004, 2008 or any other time of firearm famine. So how was I to know to be 'prepared'?
Gouging really is in the eye of the beholder. But price increases affect the less-wealthy first. If you are well off, being snobbish about it is just as childish as complaining about it.

It is a fact of life here in our free country that we are not all created equal, especially with our ability to earn money. So the wealthy or well-off need to gain a small bit of compassion. And us poor folk need to gain a small bit of understanding. Maybe we can agree to disagree?

:confused::what:
Click to expand...
I'm not being snobbish but I don't believe it's our place to push some moral code of selling conduct on a private business.

That is just plain creepy.
 
warp said:
Since when is it screwing people to offer anybody in the open market a chance to buy something at the going rate?
Click to expand...

If it was simply offering a product on the free market for an adequate profit that's what it's all about. If it was a one of kind thing, go for it, the skies the limit, if it's a run of the mill something that is simply back ordered then it's taking advantage of somebody. I, for one, refuse to take advantage of people because I'm pretty comfortable with who I am. It may be morally acceptable, but it's not ethical in my book.
 
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had a conversation with a a shop owner a couple weeks ago. some of the highlights of that conversation...

"I'm not selling anything in bulk to singular buyers, I want to put as many guns into the hands of as many different people as I can"

"ammo is not for sale unless you are buying a firearm. I have 2 boxes of 5.56 for each EBR on my shelf that are only for sale with the rifle. I want to make sure new gun owners can at least have some amount of ammo"

"I don't want to sell my entire inventory to 3 people so they can gouge the <deleted[i/]> out of perspective gun owners"

as a side note, he's the only shop around that hasn't been stripped bare. And his prices, while inflated a little, aren't outrageous.
 
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greybeard57 said:
If it was simply offering a product on the free market for an adequate profit that's what it's all about. If it was a one of kind thing, go for it, the skies the limit, if it's a run of the mill something that is simply back ordered then it's taking advantage of somebody. I, for one, refuse to take advantage of people because I'm pretty comfortable with who I am. It my be morally acceptable, but it's not ethical in my book.
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"Adequate profit"? What the heck is that?

It isn't taking advantage of somebody to charge what the market will bear as a result of supply and demand.

What ammunition will you sell me? At what price? I want ammo but I don't want to pay the market price right now. Can you put your money where your mouth is and sell to me at below market price, pretty please?

I'll take quality .22lr, .223, 5.56x45, M2 ball, 12 gauge buck or slugs, 9x19, or .45 ACP
 
"if it's a run of the mill something that is simply back ordered then it's taking advantage of somebody"

How does setting a price 10x the MSRP take advantage of anyone at all? The shopper isn't forced to buy it. Right? Now if the shopper does buy it, then the shopper must think the price is right. Right?

I just don't see how anyone can make an issue out of this.
 
At a some point, you've made enough money. Right?
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Lol, good one. Let me know when you've made enough money. I'll gladly take some off your hands for you. We want you to sleep at night!
 
If they are gouging and would not budge even for a loyal customer, no I'd walk out too. Maybe you could've tried talking to the manager and see if you can at least get a small discount. A business is a business, so they will still try to make money even to the loyal locals.

There are quite a few good LGS's in my area that are not gouging, and those are the places I keep coming back to even if they are out of stock on some guns and ammo. One shop (pawn) sold me a Draco AK for ~$700 when they sell for at least $1500 elsewhere. Another lgs sells new AR's for around $1k. Those are the places I will keep coming back to.
 
How does setting a price 10x the MSRP take advantage of anyone at all? The shopper isn't forced to buy it. Right? Now if the shopper does buy it, then the shopper must think the price is right. Right?

I just don't see how anyone can make an issue out of this.
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Because its bad business.

You are not forced to buy it, but some people do not know any better unfortunately and would pay that inflated price because they "feel the need" to buy it, or have extra money to afford it.

Just look at whats going on with CTD
 
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