Red Flag Confiscation

Red Flag laws, and their enforcement, vary from state to state, so it is impossible to answer your question generically.

But without a gun registry, there would be no practical way for the police to know that they have received all of the guns an individual owned.

Which is why the Left always push so hard for such a registry, and why the Right says that registration always leads to confiscation.

The family members that typically initiate a "red flag" procedure presumably know what guns the person has. So this is not as difficult as it seems.

If the person receiving a red flag confiscation order decides to fight the law with lethal force - what does that mean about their stability in the first place?

DustyGmt said:

And the police essentially have a legal pathway to not only take your property but to enter your home..... that is messed. To quote some idiot "people will die over this".

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I hesitate to point this out, and hopefully this isn't taken as an offence but kind of a big portion of policing relies on exactly that. They already have legal pathways to take your property and enter your home.

GEM said:

If the person receiving a red flag confiscation order decides to fight the law with lethal force - what does that mean about their stability in the first place?

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This happens. The unfortunate gun owner usually ends up dead. That's doubly tragic because the family members who contacted the authorities in the first place often thought they were saving the person from self-harm (suicide, etc.).

The moral of this story is that you should think twice before bringing The Man into your life, for whatever reason.

GEM said:

If the person receiving a red flag confiscation order decides to fight the law with lethal force - what does that mean about their stability in the first place?

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I always wonder when castle doctrine leads police to decide, you know - we can just pick the guy up when he's getting coffee, or ask him to come in, vs. raiding someone's home in the middle of the night. I don't think everyone is going to play nice at that game, and yea - usually that is a death sentence, but - that seems like the highest risk, most prone way to do much of anything that is just destined to go wrong. I don't really know why they go about it that way, but it seems like it would be as dangerous as a 100 mph car chase through town, and a lot of places now frown on that because it is so dangerous. They're just going to let the person out in a few days seems the growing trend, so -raids seem like a recipe for disaster. Maybe they just feel obligated to put all the money for equipment and training to good use? If they don't use it maybe it will get cut from their budget, and that just isn't something that can happen ...

GEM said:

If the person receiving a red flag confiscation order decides to fight the law with lethal force - what does that mean about their stability in the first place?

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Police should fear for their lives when they warrantlessly invade a law abiding person's home.

Imagine, if it's used a la H.R. by peers who don't like you for whatever reason at work.

Can it be employed as such?

There is a difference between a no-knock assault into your house vs. contacting you appropriately, court proceedings, knocking on the door and clearly announcing they are the law with cars and flashing lights. I was clearly indicating resisting the latter with lethal force.

If you do resist a no-knock raid, that usually doesn't work out well for anyone - as we have seen in recent cases. No-knock assaults were not what I was discussing. I think most of the red flag laws do tell the target about the decision.

I'm beginning to suspect that doorbell cams and other security systems may save many lives - on both sides of the door... .

GEM said:

If the person receiving a red flag confiscation order decides to fight the law with lethal force - what does that mean about their stability in the first place?

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How about if the person has no idea and they only know it is the dead of night and their door is getting broken down?

Sorry, if I wasn't clear. NYS has a defined procedure for such. It doesn't seem to indicate a wave of no-knock raids. https://law.justia.com/codes/new-york/2020/cvp/article-63-a/
https://law.justia.com/codes/new-york/2020/cvp/article-63-a/6344/

Since some states already have such laws - are there cases of late night no-knock raids such as the one that killed Breonna Taylor?

Let's hope if it's no knock they're at the right house, it isn't like mistakes have never happened before.

I have done my share of raids overseas during the late unpleasantness. They are dangerous for everyone involved. In fact, realistic training for them is about the most dangerous training I have ever did in the military (live fire, all aspects of breaching to include explosives, use of flash bangs and other similar devices)- more so than jumping, diving, etc. Later on in the conflict, we actually moved away from such dynamic approaches and started to call everyone out of the objective area with megaphones after it had been cordoned off, then after everyone (supposedly) came out and was secured, we would send in a multipurpose canine, THEN deliberately clear the area with the assault force. Not near as sexy as simultaneous breaches and flash banging every room at MACH 5, but safer for everyone. That being said, I seriously question the execution of such dynamic raid tactics in policing, unless there is a real danger to the life or of serious injury to a third party (hostages, kidnap victims, etc.). It would make so much more sense to me to take a breath and catch the guy walking out to his car, or in line at the store, or mowing his lawn with a set of ear buds in.

Don’t keep all your eggs in one basket.

If I had the slightest inkling that I might be "red-flagged," so to speak, I would put most of my guns in secure off-site storage. But, one of the characteristics of people who might be "red-flagged" is that they are not so self-aware. That is, rational judgement is not one of their strong points.

There is a LOT of speculation and misinformation about this. Too much watching TV. 4th amendment is clear about search and seizure. The police are not coming to take your guns unless they have a very specific warrant SIGNED by a judge to do so. If they have information that this will be a high-risk warrant to serve, then the SRT team may be involved. Police have to have reasonable cause to enter your home without a warrant and that usually means to save a life in immediate danger. The police usually don’t just take a report and act on their own.

The thing I don’t like about red flag laws is that someone can make a false report and I would have to prove my innocence, which is a complete violation of the constitution and “presumed innocence .” That being said, there are those that have NO business with firearms. What’s the right thing to do?????

Don't worry, police will take every gun they can find, but they'll leave behind every knife, crowbar, screwdriver, hacksaw, bow & arrow, power tool, poisonous/corrosive chemical, baseball bat and gardening tool that you own. That way it'll be impossible for any harm to be done by said person who just got legally burglarized.

The Glockodile said:

Imagine, if it's used a la H.R. by peers who don't like you for whatever reason at work.

Can it be employed as such?

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Not sure about everywhere but I have read that some proposed red flag laws include a penalty for malicious misuse.

That would be cold comfort after absorbing a mag dump from some skittish deputy after he kicks in your door at 3am.

Bazoo said:

Don’t keep all your eggs in one basket.

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I need to hide a privately-purchased handgun just for emergencies.

"Family members" are the scariest part of red flag laws. Anyone here have family members that hate other family members and will do anything to ruin their lives? I do, and I know I'm not alone. Sibling rivalries, jealousy, envy. The green-eyed monster! Remember, according to the Biblical record the first murder was a brother killing his own brother. I predict the kind of red flag laws that are being proposed in some states will involve a lot of meddling family members... anti-gun family members. Nothing good will come of it.