10mm vs .45 ACP in a Glock

[MTMilitiaman]

I just tend to prefer to error on the safe side in favor of penetration. My experience hunting tells me that animals rarely tell the difference in a little lost energy, and I have seen animals absorb a lot more energy than any handgun can hang with, so I think the effects of shock are over rated. In my experience, unless you take out the CNS, then animals bleed to death, and they bleed better with exit wounds. Your experience may vary, but I very much prefer exit wounds, even at the risk of so called "over penetration."

That's why I prefer the 180 gr Gold Dots in my 10mm. Excellent expansion (some would say too much for the bullet design) and from what I have seen, around 16 inches of penetration in gelatin.

 

[glock21detroit]

rtfm and the woodsman listen, every time i read a post about the 45 vs the 10, bears always come into the conversation. so if the 10mm is stopping bears and the 45 acp can't, then why is the 45 acp always being compared to large game calibers. as i said before i'm in the city, which you do have people on drugs with guns and i feel thats comparable to a bear comming at you and i'm not trying to shooting zombies, just trying to make bad guys one and if my 45 acp isn't good enough, i just wanted to know, is that so bad?

 

[roscoe]

why is the 45 acp always being compared to large game calibers

I don't think it is. It is a good round, but slow and low-pressure.

 

[The Tourist]

I was settled on the .45, but I keep seeing everyone talk up the 10mm as being such a powerful round.

If you are a reloader, then I would pick the 10mm. There are some great commercial hunting and SD loads for the 10mm, and as a reloader, you can load it down to duplicate any .45 ACP load.

If you are not a reloader, I would go with the .45 ACP. Right over the counter you can buy traditional ball ammo, and yet modern defense loads offer a number of +P loads that should cover any emergency.

I do not believe the 10mm is that "flexible." To obtain the same wide range of loads, I think you still have to load them yourself. I also believe the value of the 10mm is in loading it down, not up.

 

[jlh26oo]

F.Y.I. .357mag by B.B.

Item No. 19A/20 180 gr. 1400 fps, 783 ft. lbs.
Item No. 19C/20 158 gr. 1475 fps, 763 ft. lbs.
Item No. 19D/20 125 gr. 1700 fps, 802 ft. lbs.





But regarding the topic of this thread (R.O.F.L. at herding cats)- since I'm a .45 guy (like how it handles, high performance at low pressure, ammo and platforms available, and relative performance if it fails to expand), I'd take the GLOCK 21.

I also understand this choice leaves me unprepared if I'm ever robbed, by a grizzly.

 

[Northalius]

jih, going by those numbers, you quoted the fps stats from BB's 6" barrel revolver tests:

6 inch Ruger GP 100

a. Item 19D/20-125gr. Speer Uni Core = 1707 fps

LINK: http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#357

Scroll down a little when the page loads; look at number 4 on the list. There it is.

And remember, as MT said: They count semi-auto barrels with the chamber included; whereas the revolver barrel is the whole barrel, no chamber included. So, with EQUAL rifling barrel length, the 10mm is more powerful than a .357 Magnum.

If the DT 10mm 135 gr. can hit 1600 fps out of a 4.6 SEMI AUTO barrel, then it can easily hit over 1700 fps with a 6" SEMI AUTO barrel. If the semi auto barrel was LITERALLY 6" long in rifling, then we'd probably be looking at 1800+ fps from DoubleTaps' 10mm 135 gr. rounds.

I'll look for the link later (gotta go to work soon) where I saw a guy loading his own 10mm to hit 1830 fps (tops). Within SAAMI specs? Probably not D); but it's still capable of much more than what others think is all I'm saying. And the guy shooting his seemed to have no problems; maybe he used strong brass, and had a well supported barrel?

 

[jlh26oo]

F.Y.I.

The B.B. velocities for .357mag were using a 6" revolver, and 5" 1911 for 10mm. O.T.O.H., the D.T. 10mm velocities listed were using a 4.6" polygonally rifled barrel (I.E. the GLOCK 20), while those listed for .357mag D.T. were only through a 4.0" conventionally rifled barrel.

While both offer exceptional performance and versatility, if I were between .357mag and 10mm, I would make the decision based on personal platform preference. However, between the choices in the O.P., I would probably take the GLOCK 21!

Hope this helps.

 

[mag]

Ultima-Ratio said....
Look a bit harder boomer, the Hodgedon manual lists a 135gn load using 800x that I've clocked at over 1700fps and somewhere on their website as data for Longshot that get high numbers also.

I've used that 800-X load in my Glock with KKM 6" barrel and got over 1800 fps with a 135 gr bullet. Another 800-X load yields over 1600 fps with a 155 gr bullet.

Mike G.

 

[jrswanson1]

I just looked on Hodgdon's web site for that 800-X load, but they are not listing it for the 135gr bullets. Also, they are not showing the full power loads for 800-X on the other bullets . In fact, they are not showing max loads for any of the IMR powders. Anyone have the data for these powders?

Jim

 

[glock21detroit]

just traded in my glock 21 for a glock 20, i don't really regret the trade, becaues i was buying winchester rangers at $50 a box. the 10mm is more for practice loads, but the power your getting with double tap or handloads, i couldn't resist.

 

[ndh87]

I like the 45 better personally, ammo is half the price (31 bucks for 100 rounds of WWB at walmart vs. 25 for 50rounds of 10mm at a gun shop)

Also, the .357 sig comes very close to 10mm power levels
.357 sig115 gr JHP 1,550 ft/s 614 ft·lbf

10mm 180 gr XTP HP 1,350 ft/s 728 ft·lbf

.45 ACP 230 gr FMJ-FP 1,010 ft/s 521 ft·lbf

personally I like a round that leaves a bigger hole. And a 1911 in .45 is what i shoot best. the +p loadings arent far off of .357 sig too.

 

[Ivy Mike]

ndh, I don't think I'd call the .357Sig load you posted close to a 10mm.
a bullet 65 grains heavier and delivering more than 100 lb-ft more energy is quite a step up.

 

[KBintheSLC]

The .45 is great for humans, but in the woods I would take the 10mm Auto over the .45 any day. With 200 FMJ-FP moving at 1200+ FPS and 700+ FPE, you will get the penetration you need to stop large thick skinned beasts quickly. The penetration of the .45 with FMJ will only be about 70% of that of the 10mm.

 

[BlindJustice]

Blackcat - what part of the country ar you in, thinking about
a Griz encounter? THey're only in the High North Cascades and
Rockies, and north into Canada and ALaska N. Calif and north
into ORegon and Wash. STate Cascades it's Black Bear

I'm at Pullman, home of Wash. State University - School's got an
enclosure and shed for 3 or 4 Grizzilies on the E. SIde of
Campus....on the way to the airport THey are BIG
the Vet school is studying diseases they catch in the wild.

I've heard the Glock 21 has a different shape grip among the
Glocks. ? Dunnoh, my carry piece is a full size 1911 .45 ACP

oh, here....
These are ALL Speer Gold Dot JHP
CUrrent offerings
$32.95/50 $29.95/50 $33.95/50
.45 ACP ----- .40 S&W -- 10MM Auto
185 gr 155 gr. 155 gr.
1225 fps 1,275 fps 1,475 fps
616 ft lbs 60 ft. lbs 750 ft lbs
200 gr. 165 gr. 165 gr.
1125 fps 1,200 fps 1,400 fps
562 Ft lbs 528 fl lbs 718 ft lbs
230 gr. 180 gr. 180 gr.
1,010 fps 1,100 fps 1,300 fps
521 ft lbs 484 ft lbs 676 ft lbs

FYI - Speed of SOUnd = approx. 1,120 FPS
It makes a difference to your ears inside for HD

Randall
-

 

[BlindJustice]

SOme of y'all are boasting about the lightest weight bullets for a
calilber/cartridge combo. Problem, is the makers of the hollowpoints
make them for the most popular cartridges, and the velocity envelope
for those same cartridges..... when you put the same hollowpoints in the
higher capacity cases and go MAX. the bullets don't penetrate much
but blow up - Mike at DT just came out with a .40 Super at 1750 fps, and
states great HD because it won't over penetrate, heck if it hit sheet rock i
it would probably fragment.

I like the Hornady XTPs in the mid to heavier bullet weights going toward
fairly warm but not max. for controllabiltiy, as well as penetration

To each thier own,

FWIW I like my Bar Sto in .400 CorBon for my 1911 with 155 & 165 gr.
at 1,350 and 1275 fps respectively if I want a flatter shooting load, but the Hornady +P is hard to find, so ordering DT Gold DOts is a great
HD/SD option. 200 rds is only $11 S&H.from Utah for .45 ACP - last
non - COrBOn .400 CorBon went T.U. I guess so I'll have to have
some loaded up..

Randall

 

[glock21detroit]

ndh87, the 10mm can shoot a 200gr bullet at 1250 +. the 357 sig can't and is not engineered to shoot a bullet that big or hit velocities that fast. i like the sig but the 10mm just kicks the sig out of the disscussion.

 

[ChCx2744]

to all of you who are comparing 10mm to .357 magnum, .357 sig, .41 magnum and .44 magnum...the title is "10mm vs .45 ACP." the guy asked a question so lets answer it for him, not go off into our own little schematics of prooving who's "inquired ballistic opinions" are correct or not.

back on subject:

i'd prefer the 10mm's SPECS over the .45ACP's SPECS, but from what i know, .45ACP ammo seems cheaper and more availible than 10mm. if you have the patience and money for 10mm, get the 10mm hands down; if you dont, you wont be disappointed with a .45ACP. the way things are going nowadays with ammo and such, i'd opt to get the .45ACP, just to save yourself some trouble. the 10mm is still the superior choice when it comes to ballistics and power though.

 

[Judah Ben-Hur]

This picture puts it all in perspective (you knew it was coming) ...

... but the .45 ACP rounds are more easily obtainable over the counter and any 10mm stuff you do find will be downloaded crap, I mean the stuff around these parts. :banghead:

 

[Damon555]

The worst part is the fact that you guys are answering a post that is 4 1/2 years old.......

 

[Judah Ben-Hur]

Its late, cut us some slack. ;-)

 

[alaskanativeson]

Not sure if true, but a poster on a forum who lives in Alaska said the Glock 20 is pretty popular in Alaska. Guess that says a lot, huh?

It does. I don't think it was me who posted that, though I'm quite pleased with my Glock 20. If it's popular up here it's likely because it's a good reliable weapon that has the power to go though the layers a two legged attacker is likely to be wearing up here. When it comes to defense against four-legged ones, especially those with big claws and teeth, few people up here would willingly depend solely on a handgun for defense, and if it's absolutely necessary it's almost certainly going to be a wheelgun. The minmum caliber that's going to be considered is 44. My Super Redhawk in .454 Casull is as light as I'd like to carry, and that's only if my wife has the Mossy 590 with Brenneke slugs.

 

[ChCx2744]

10mm > .45ACP o <- (big period)

 

[s0nspark]

Sorry to be so late to the party here but I have a question that relates...

Wouldn't 10 rounds of 180gr 10mm be lighter to carry in a G29 than 10 rounds of 230gr +P .45 in a similar G30? Would it be a noticeable difference (i.e. several ounces)?

Just curious...

 

[PO2Hammer]

Not enough of a difference to choose a caliber over.

 

[thorazine]

Isn't double tap claiming expansion of a little over one inch?!

For the 10MM -- 165GR GDHP?


Is so that's some AMAZING expansion.