22 magnum for self defense.

[CDW4ME]

I usually carry a 1911 CCO .45ACP, a Glock 19 or a Sig P365. When I do exercise hard aerobically along running trails or the local nearby cemetery... it's quiet there... I've carried for many years a NAA Mini Mag revolver, single action, .22 Magnum. Guess what? If any A Hole wants to get close and threaten me, I would not hesitate to think how he would feel if a .22 Magnum round hit him dead on! Carry what you want, enjoy, what protects you. I would rather carry a small .22 Magnum... than nothing! Stay safe, and healthy.

OP got a Shield 9mm now.

Yes, a 22 magnum is "better than nothing" - which fortunately is not a criteria I have to use.
People thinking logically "wouldn't want to get shot by it" - but someone taking action that justifies use of lethal force against them is not thinking logically.
Examples never matter and my expectation is they still won't, but here are two where 5 hits failed to quickly incapacitate:
This one is usually inapplicable because "I don't work in a liquor store" (typical response)

This one is nearly always deemed inapplicable because the shooter is a cop and LE examples don't matter, amiright
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/v...deputy-soaks-up-12-rounds-before-hes-stopped/

 

[MedWheeler]

From the article linked above:

Unlike the rest of us, the deputy couldn’t simply employ the Nike defense and run away.

I've used the term "rabbit run defense", but same idea.

This is part of the reason LE examples are sketchy when comparing our mission to theirs. In the scenario linked above, we also don't have any way of knowing if the attacker would have pressed on after being shot by a non-LE citizen rather than one he knows won't let him go. Even the most-crazed knows the difference between a cop and just another guy. BG knows that Cop won't stop (and will call in other cops that won't stop) until BG is in jail or in the morgue, neither of which BG is willing to accept. This makes BG far more desperate and frequently leads to increased potential for escalating violence, including prolonged shootouts. It's also why we hear of so many of these incidents, but virtually none in non-LE civilian DGU incidents; in the latter, one party or the other self-extracts as soon as a gun comes into play (frequently, both do) and the encounter ends.

 

[mikle76]

I'd use the he** out of it. Just having a weapon to fight back is half the battle. First choice, maybe not but I'd take it over some of the magnum calibers that will penetrate to the other end of the house all the while blowing through my kids bedroom walls.

 

[Climb14er]

OP got a Shield 9mm now.

Yes, a 22 magnum is "better than nothing" - which fortunately is not a criteria I have to use.
People thinking logically "wouldn't want to get shot by it" - but someone taking action that justifies use of lethal force against them is not thinking logically.
Examples never matter and my expectation is they still won't, but here are two where 5 hits failed to quickly incapacitate:
This one is usually inapplicable because "I don't work in a liquor store" (typical response)

This one is nearly always deemed inapplicable because the shooter is a cop and LE examples don't matter, amiright
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/v...deputy-soaks-up-12-rounds-before-hes-stopped/

Do you pound miles regularly...exercising? Do you carry a pistol for defense while doing so? Well I do, have for many years, and carrying a lightweight .22 Magnum NAA is better than nothing... As I keep my 1911 CCO .45ACP in Milt Sparks IWB and OWB holsters reserved for when I'm not moving fast, light and getting valuable aerobic exercise. Like I posted, carry what you enjoy but I highly doubt you will be doing what I'm doing, especially at my age, gonna be sixty nine in eleven days... carrying a 1911 or similar covering five to seven miles, at a fast pace... regularly.

 

[.308 Norma]

especially at my age, gonna be sixty nine in eleven days... carrying a 1911 or similar covering five to seven miles, at a fast pace... regularly.

Good for you! I hope you can keep it up for many years to come.
I used to do 7 miles a day, everyday, but my 73 year-old knees can't take that kind of pounding anymore. So nowadays, if the weather's okay, I try to do the 2-mile trek down to Marsh Creek and back in an hour. And while I'm on that trek, I carry a little Taurus "Ultralite" .32 H&R, a canister of pepper spray, and of course my big, honkin' hiking staff.
I've told the story before about how one time when I was on my exercise hike, a county sheriff's deputy slowed as he was going by me. He rolled down his window and asked, "Is that great big staff for hiking or dogs?"
"Yes." I said. And the deputy just laughed and drove on.
BTW, sometimes my little Taurus revolver is concealed if it's cool and I'm wearing a coat or jacket. Sometimes it's not.

 

[DarkswordDX]

Anything that gives a bad guy a sucking chest wound of any size is going to make him quickly and desperately re-prioritize his life choices regarding you and/or your wallet. I've sold and recommended many a Ruger LCR in .22mag as a ladies gun, and I carried a Single Six in magnum configuration on more than a few occasions years back. I'd even vote for .22LR as viable, but I'm sketchier on its ability to reliably penetrate the sternum from a center mass shot. .22 magnum gets there.

 

[CDW4ME]

Yes, a 22 magnum is "better than nothing" - which fortunately is not a criteria I have to use.
People thinking logically "wouldn't want to get shot by it" - but someone taking action that justifies use of lethal force against them is not thinking logically.
Examples never matter and my expectation is they still won't, but here are two where 5 hits failed to quickly incapacitate:

Do you pound miles regularly...exercising? Do you carry a pistol for defense while doing so? Well I do, have for many years, and carrying a lightweight .22 Magnum NAA is better than nothing... As I keep my 1911 CCO .45ACP in Milt Sparks IWB and OWB holsters reserved for when I'm not moving fast, light and getting valuable aerobic exercise. Like I posted, carry what you enjoy but I highly doubt you will be doing what I'm doing, especially at my age, gonna be sixty nine in eleven days... carrying a 1911 or similar covering five to seven miles, at a fast pace... regularly.

I agreed with you, a 22 mag is better than nothing, 1st thing I said.
My post was addressing this: If any A Hole wants to get close and threaten me, I would not hesitate to think how he would feel if a .22 Magnum round hit him dead on!
I provided examples that showed 5 hits may not provide the desired result.
It wasn't about what you are carrying, it was about what you said.

 

[Skylerbone]

I agreed with you, a 22 mag is better than nothing, 1st thing I said.
My post was addressing this: If any A Hole wants to get close and threaten me, I would not hesitate to think how he would feel if a .22 Magnum round hit him dead on!
I provided examples that showed 5 hits may not provide the desired result.
It wasn't about what you are carrying, it was about what you said.

While I can find little to disagree with in regards to what you’ve written, remember (everyone) that a firearm is meant to increase your odds of success by equalizing force. Some people can do that with martial arts or self-defense training, others with a “gun” or knife but with no caliber being a sure thing.

Whether 1 hit or 7, your goal is to reduce your attacker’s ability to harm you in hopes of ending the threat. Ideally you would always end the threat, but in lieu of immediate stoppage (again never guaranteed), any well placed hit will diminish your attacker.

 

[Climb14er]

I agreed with you, a 22 mag is better than nothing, 1st thing I said.
My post was addressing this: If any A Hole wants to get close and threaten me, I would not hesitate to think how he would feel if a .22 Magnum round hit him dead on!
I provided examples that showed 5 hits may not provide the desired result.
It wasn't about what you are carrying, it was about what you said.

Understood. After all these years of watching Denver, the state of Colorado and the country as a whole get more violent, I've advocated for folks to carry... something... And/or get training in self defense. When I'm out on the Highline Canal to pound miles, many times, even in the city, there's a remote feeling to it. Women have at times, got accosted there. There might come a time when I might have to rig a chest holster to carry my Glock 19 that I also carry. For now, I keep my wits aware and the .22 Mag NAA has that ok feeling to it. Stay safe!

 

[Skylerbone]

Well my intellectual curiosity got the better of me when PSA sent me an email that offered the Keltec PMR30 for $350 (sold out now), a pistol that has long been on my short list. I’ll add an RDS and put it through its paces before deciding on woods carry.

Again, sending rounds at snakes and dogs who are overly friendly is my purpose, NOT CC for bad guys with bad intent. I own multiple pistols from .380 to .45 in smaller form factor that are appropriately suited.

 

[Armybrat]

My primary carry is a Kahr CW9 in cold weather and a Ruger LCP Max for shorts & T-shirt Months.
But I might tote my new NAA Mini Ranger II as a backup if the situation warrants.

 

[chicharrones]

Well my intellectual curiosity got the better of me when PSA sent me an email that offered the Keltec PMR30 for $350 (sold out now), a pistol that has long been on my short list. I’ll add an RDS and put it through its paces before deciding on woods carry.

Again, sending rounds at snakes and dogs who are overly friendly is my purpose, NOT CC for bad guys with bad intent. I own multiple pistols from .380 to .45 in smaller form factor that are appropriately suited.

I've fired my shootin' buddy's PMR, it's a surprisingly good shooter. I've thought about getting the CMR. Both might make a great combo for .22 magnum fans.

 

[MedWheeler]

Armybrat writes:

But I might tote my new NAA Mini Ranger II as a backup if the situation warrants.

If you're gonna tote it, you probably shouldn't wait until "the situation warrants."

 

[CDW4ME]

If you're gonna tote it, you probably shouldn't wait until "the situation warrants."

My philosophy is always try to carry whatever the "bad area" or greater anticipated threat gun(s) are everywhere.
Criminals/psychos are mobile, not completely nocturnal, and may take a uninvited, unannounced, field trip to the "good area".
If ____ is desired to defend self in a "bad area" it seems that same _____ would be advantageous in a nice spot.

 

[CraigC]

In general, it's certainly not ideal and it's also certainly better than nothing at all. However, for some folks, it might be ideal. It is far more destructive than .22LR. I learned that the first time I shot a critter with it. The .22Mag that you can shoot well and are comfortable with is far better than the 9mm or .40 that makes you flinch.

The folks that talk about it being unreliable because it's a rimfire must not have shot much .22Mag. I got my first in 1986 and can never remember having a single misfire.

 

[JFrame]

In general, it's certainly not ideal and it's also certainly better than nothing at all. However, for some folks, it might be ideal. It is far more destructive than .22LR. I learned that the first time I shot a critter with it. The .22Mag that you can shoot well and are comfortable with is far better than the 9mm or .40 that makes you flinch.

The folks that talk about it being unreliable because it's a rimfire must not have shot much .22Mag. I got my first in 1986 and can never remember having a single misfire.

I agree... The only misfires I ever had with .22 mag were light primer strikes my NAA Black Widow developed after about 400 rounds. I sent it back to the NAA gunsmith, who installed a stouter mainspring. The fault was with the gun, not the ammo (used CCI Maxi-Mags throughout).

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The folks that talk about it being unreliable because it's a rimfire must not have shot much .22Mag.

Or maybe they have.

 

[chicharrones]

I'm another that has never had a misfire with .22 WMR, but have had many misfires with .22 LR.

I'd guess that's because I tend to shoot a much higher percentage of quality .22 WMR ammo when compared to .22 LR ammo.

Thinking on that, I don't recall ever finding .22 WMR offered in bulk packs either.

 

[trackskippy]

I agree... The only misfires I ever had with .22 mag were light primer strikes my NAA Black Widow developed after about 400 rounds. I sent it back to the NAA gunsmith, who installed a stouter mainspring. The fault was with the gun, not the ammo (used CCI Maxi-Mags throughout).

I can see where that might help with the problem, but I dont think it was probably the gun, or even the ammo that was the problem, but more likely, just a dirty gun.

At least thats been my experience with 22 revolvers anyway. Once they get dirty/fouled from shooting, you really have to make sure the rounds fully seat when dropping them in. They may look like they are seated, and the gun may close, but thats when Ive usually had light strikes and misfires with mine, and most all of them fired on the second strike.

I think that round not being fully seated deadens the hammer blow, and hence the light strikes. My revolvers all seem to shoot fine when starting out clean, but 3-400 rounds out, if Im not paying attention when I load them, and make sure the rounds are fully seated, I will start to see the light strikes.

I can see where a heavier spring might help with that, but I would think it would also increase the trigger weight, at least with the DA guns.

It also seems to be more of a revolver issue than an auto too. My autos rarely have a light strike issue.

In the past, rimfire ammo did seem to be a bit finicky, but these days, I dont think its as bad as it was, especially if youre not buying the cheaper bulk stuff.

The other thing too is, how much are or have you really shot to base things on? There seems to be a pretty big discrepancy sometimes as to what some think is "a lot". I know for a fact, my 22lr round counts are tens of thousands higher than my 22 magnum counts. I dont usually shoot 500-1000 22mags at an outing, where I usually do with the 22lr's. I think that could also have a lot to do with experiences.

 

[JFrame]

I can see where that might help with the problem, but I dont think it was probably the gun, or even the ammo that was the problem, but more likely, just a dirty gun.

At least thats been my experience with 22 revolvers anyway. Once they get dirty/fouled from shooting, you really have to make sure the rounds fully seat when dropping them in. They may look like they are seated, and the gun may close, but thats when Ive usually had light strikes and misfires with mine, and most all of them fired on the second strike.

I think that round not being fully seated deadens the hammer blow, and hence the light strikes. My revolvers all seem to shoot fine when starting out clean, but 3-400 rounds out, if Im not paying attention when I load them, and make sure the rounds are fully seated, I will start to see the light strikes.

I can see where a heavier spring might help with that, but I would think it would also increase the trigger weight, at least with the DA guns.

It also seems to be more of a revolver issue than an auto too. My autos rarely have a light strike issue.

In the past, rimfire ammo did seem to be a bit finicky, but these days, I dont think its as bad as it was, especially if youre not buying the cheaper bulk stuff.

The other thing too is, how much are or have you really shot to base things on? There seems to be a pretty big discrepancy sometimes as to what some think is "a lot". I know for a fact, my 22lr round counts are tens of thousands higher than my 22 magnum counts. I dont usually shoot 500-1000 22mags at an outing, where I usually do with the 22lr's. I think that could also have a lot to do with experiences.

I can see that happening, but in my case I'm pretty sure (let's say pretty positive) it wasn't a dirty gun. I cleaned it thoroughly after each range session, and I'm pretty meticulous.

The Black Widow started the misfires (after working flawlessly) after about 400 rounds -- not a glitch before then.

All the NAA mini-revolvers are SA only. Yes, it definitely increases the trigger pull... But I also definitely want a reliable ignition each time.

.

 

[trackskippy]

I can see that happening, but in my case I'm pretty sure (let's say pretty positive) it wasn't a dirty gun. I cleaned it thoroughly after each range session, and I'm pretty meticulous.

The Black Widow started the misfires (after working flawlessly) after about 400 rounds -- not a glitch before then.

All the NAA mini-revolvers are SA only. Yes, it definitely increases the trigger pull... But I also definitely want a reliable ignition each time.

.

What you describe is exactly what goes on with my 22lr's. I clean everything after every outing, and always start with a clean gun. As I said, 3-400 rounds out is about where it usually starts for me, if Im not making sure they are fully seated. They look like they are, but some will still go down a skosh when you push on them.

Im guessing that heavier spring is making it work for you.

I have three NAA mini's, and have never had the issue, but I dont usually shoot more than a box or two out of them at a time. I have had a couple of misfires, but that was with some Remington ammo I got with one of the guns, and it had some keyholing issues as well. Not a big fan of pretty much anything Remington anymore.

 

[Old Hobo]

I don't know about using a .22 mag for self defense. Maybe it would suffice ... except when facing a large felon doped out of his mind and having a bad day.

The .22 mag for assassination is a grim topic, yet this caliber has been used for that purpose.

Sirhan Bishara Sirhan used his brother's Iver Johnson Cadet short barrelled revolver chambered in .22 magnum to kill Bobby Kennedy.

For those interested in the background on this revolver, here is some information:

"FREEDOM OF INFORMATION AND PRIVACY ACT"
"SUBJECT: ROBERT F. KENNED ASSASSINATION"

https://archive.org/stream/RFKAssassination_201510/RFK-LA-56-156-SUB H-VOL.02_djvu.txt

The format of this file is all jumbled-up. There are all manner of random characters scattered throughout due to formatting mismatches. Nevertheless, one can catch the salient information therein.

The following are a series of excerpts from the above document:

M o n l e 11a no, nol icin g
-that Sirhan had one box of
bullets set aside from the
others he was using, asked
Sirhan if he were using *a
special type bullet,* Car-
reon said.

The bullets. Carrcon
said, are called 'the mini*
•magnum*

.......

M o n l e 11a no, nol icin g
-that Sirhan had one box of
bullets set aside from the
others he was using, asked
Sirhan if he were using *a
special type bullet,* Car-
reon said.

The bullets. Carrcon
said, are called 'the mini*
•magnum*

------------------

•1 doubt if the mini-mag is *
quarter more powerful/ he. said,
'hut it's the most powerful shell
chambered for the usual .22/
r.fj'o; ltd at Gun Club
Another witnerr fit the grand jury
healing told of iccirg Sii*h?n at the
San Gabriel Valley Gr.n Club range
in Duarte at noon Jur e 4, practicing
f ait-firing with a .2? caliber. Iver
Johnson icvolvcr Bnd mini-mag
ammunition.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
End of quotations
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CCI began manufacturing the "Mini-Mag" .22 magnum ammunition in 1963. Bobby Kennedy was shot in the summer of 1968.

https://military-history.fandom.com/wiki/CCI_(ammunition)

"CCI (Cascade Cartridge Inc.), based in Lewiston, Idaho, manufactures rimfire ammunition, centerfire handgun ammunition, and primers for reloaders and industrial power loads. CCI produced the first Mini-Mag rimfire ammunition in 1963, and in 1975 developed the Stinger, a hypervelocity .22 Long Rifle product."

-----------------------------------------------------------------

 

[Smaug]

I’m with the others. If it’s all you’ve got? Fine. No need to even think of it then.

It penetrates fine in gel, but is not clear how well it would do if it hits bone and clothing first. Like the sternum you’d be likely to hit. Or an arm held up.

Bottom line: keep it, but save up for at least a 38 or 380 when you can.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

As I have said before, when you study disasters, you find a lot of them occurred because someone PLANNED to have a disaster. If you find yourself facing a Grizzley bear with only a pocket knife, it's because you PLANNED to have only a pocket knife.

And if you find yourself in a life-threatening situation with only a .22 Magnum, it's because you PLANNED to have only a .22 Mag. You COULD have chosen a better weapon.

 

[joneb]

22mag handgun for SD? The right ammo may help.