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A home defense .223 rifle?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by PaisteMage, May 7, 2013.

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  1. PaisteMage

    PaisteMage Member

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    So I am considering int he next year or so getting a compact rifle that shoots .223 for something to maneuver around the house with, in a home defense scenario.

    Thinking something compact, similar in size maybe to the shorter shotguns that have an 18 inch barrel.

    It would be nice to have a rifle that is small, has 30 rounds in the magazine, and isn't as awkward as a long shotgun.

    I also want to get into the AR type platform.

    I have never shot a .223 rifle, but that will be changing soon. I haven't shot the 5.56 or whatever the other common variant is.

    I have shot Mosin, 30 ought 6, 30/30 so I know what high powered rifles are like.

    I would like suggestions and want to be under 2,000. Please give me your opinions about the topic and PICTURES really help to determine size, and also inform of the options you have added tot he rifle so I know what is out there.

    This could be an amazingly long thread, since I have been told that these rifles are very modular and options are kind of endless.

    THank you for your time and patience with all my questions. The "G36" looks like a good size from what I have seen in my minimal research.
     
  2. TrickyDick

    TrickyDick Member

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    for cost efficiency, i would look at Mini-14's, possibly some AR's (prices are starting to come down). but there are a few that are a bit pricey; SCAR, ACR and the SIG556 for just a few, the G36 is nice, but pricey as well, and i'm sure some will mention other rifles as well
     
  3. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    You won't get a G36 here in the US.

    If I were in your boat I would take an AR any day. The Mini 14s are overpriced right now, and ARs are rapidly decreasing in price. Find yourself a Colt 6920 and be happy.
     
  4. PaisteMage

    PaisteMage Member

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    Thanks for your replies thus far.

    Do people reload .223?

    I will look into those...I assumed that the G36 wouldn't be available , since it might be German only, no exportation.

    I googled "popular .223 rifle," and it was one of the first that came up!
     
  5. justice06rr

    justice06rr Member

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    Yes people reload 223.

    You can easily get a quality AR15 Carbine for around $1k. shop around and do your research. Smith and Wesson sells their M&P15 Sport for around $800. That is the best AR to start with IMO. Lightweight and reliable, shoots both 5.56/223.

    If you really had $2k to spend, then get a Colt 6920 or Sig556.
     
  6. C-grunt

    C-grunt Member

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    Colt 6920 is the Gold Standard. They run about 1100 bucks. Then invest in a good red dot like an Aimpoint or EOTech, a sling and a flashlight. Then buy some ammo and get some professional training.
     
  7. Warp

    Warp Member

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    Search this forum. Search www.m4carbine.net .

    A AR/M4 type rifle chambered in 5.56 can be a great defensive rifle.

    Start with a quality rifle. Personally I would start with a:

    KAC
    LMT
    Noveske
    LaRue
    BCM
    Colt
    Spikes
    S&W

    Or something like that.

    Use GOOD magazines. Personally I'd go with:

    Magpul PMAG
    Good/legit USGI (NHMTG, OKay, Colt, maybe D&H)
    Lancer L5 AWM
    Troy Battlemag
    HK


    Use good ammo. Brass case factory 5.56x45, or a good brass case .223 Remington for plinking/general training. Federal, PMC, Prvi Partizan (PPU), IMI, etc are the most common here.

    And lube it properly/enough. When in doubt, use more lube on the BCG (bolt carrier group)
    http://www.ar15.com/content/swat/keepitrunning.pdf

    The generally accepted "basic" add-ons or accessories for a defensive rifle are:

    1. Sling
    2. Light
    3. (optional) Optic

    And doing anything else is best put off until you have some trigger and and, preferably, some training.


    Do you research before buying a rifle so that you know what's what. If somebody says a part meets "mil spec", you should be able to look at the specifications and tell whether or not it actually does meet mil spec.

    Know what barrel twist rate you want. You probably want a 1:7, but you should make your own decision based on the facts, after you do your research.





    -----------
    Your budget of $2,000 can buy...oh let's say...

    1 quality rifle for ~$1,000-$1,300
    6 good magazines for ~$90
    1,000 round case of 5.56 for, oh well here is where it gets messy in this market...say $650 :(
    And then grab a sling which will put you a little over budget.


    Ammo is the bottleneck right now
     
  8. Edarnold

    Edarnold Member

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    If you are planning on using this gun indoors, and you want to use the .223 round AND keep your hearing, part of your investment will have to be in a suppressor. In a home defense situation you can't count on wearing hearing protection, and from a short handy 16" barrel the muzzle blast indoors will cause immediate hearing loss.

    Given your intended purpose, an AR-type rifle in .300 Blackout using sub-sonic loads will give you all the power you need and work very well with a suppressor, or be less ear-damaging if used without.

    IMHO
     
  9. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    .223, 9mm, 12 gauge, all are about 150 dB. You won't notice the difference if you have to fire in the confines of your home. While I live my hearing, I will put it second on the priority list. Adding a 5" long suppressor will defeat the purpose of having a carbine with a shorter barrel. I keep a set of electronic muffs next to my AR in my gun safe for if u have time to grab them. If I don't, it's really not a huge deal to me. Live to breathe another day, and then worry about my hearing.
     
  10. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    And don't forget it will peel all the paint off your walls and shoot into the next county.:rolleyes:
    And with that short barrel I hope you don't have any chrome bumpers laying around the hallway cause it will peel that off too.:rolleyes:
     
  11. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    You'll do well with an AR, if you let a round or two off in tight quarters you will do some damage but you likely won't cause immediate hearing loss, nor will you be blinded by the flash.:rolleyes:
    We hope that discharging a gun under these circumstances doesn't happen frequently.:rolleyes:
    Sorry none of the sarcasm smileys showed up before.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2013
  12. Hummer70

    Hummer70 Member

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    I was just going to add a short barrel will really ring your gord.
     
  13. henschman

    henschman Member

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    I would go with a 16" pencil profile barreled AR-15 carbine with a mid-length gas system that has all the mil spec features like chrome lined barrel, high pressure tested and magnetic particle inspected barrel and bolt, staked gas key and castle nut, carpenter 158 shot peened bolt, and M4 feed ramps.

    Palmetto State Armory sells an upper in this configuration, and currently has it in stock. You would need to find a lower receiver to go with it. If you went with that, you could have a very solid rifle for less than $1000, leaving plenty of money in your budget for an Aimpoint red dot, a good light+mount, and a 2 point quick adjust sling.
     
  14. C-grunt

    C-grunt Member

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    While shooting a rifle off indoors is bad for your hearing it wont make you deaf. I have been around a good bit of rifle and cannon fire without hearing protection and I can still hear okay. I have definite hearing loss but that is more due to the fact I had to have my right eardrum replaced after I lost 95 percent of it doing breaching training with the 75th Ranger Batt.
     
  15. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

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  16. Warp

    Warp Member

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    Just about any legitimate home defense firearm will be LOUD.

    But if you have to fire in self defense/home defense, hearing loss is an acceptable side effect.

    A niche cartridge and a suppressor would be fine, but are far from required, and not what I would recommend somebody start out with, especially when they have a budget. 5.56/.223 availability and pricing is too good...and like it or not NFA items like suppressors and short barrels change things, from a legal standpoint.
     
  17. bigdaa

    bigdaa member

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    AR with collapsible stock and 16 inch barrel.
    Short, maneuverable and too much firepower.
     
  18. Warp

    Warp Member

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    What?
     
  19. bigdaa

    bigdaa member

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    I'm just making the tongue in cheek point that he will be punching through all kinds of barriers.
     
  20. Warp

    Warp Member

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    You are ill informed on this topic.

    A 5.56/.223 round will not "punch through all kinds of barriers". In fact, it will penetrate as much, if not less than, a typical handgun round, when talking about interior walls and such. It is a lightweight, fast bullet, that tends to destabilize/tumble/fragment and lose momentum quickly once it strikes something.

    There is no more of a barrier penetration concern with 5.56/.223 than there would be with a 9mm pistol.

    You may want to educate yourself a little bit on this topic before making more comments like that.

    Here is a great place to start.

    http://www.theboxotruth.com/
     
  21. stumpers

    stumpers Member

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    Here's my main carbine. BCM, 14.5 lightweight barrel, Aimpoint M3, and light. I typically use 20 round mags. Without the M3 it's very light. If my only use was indoors or less than 30 feet or so, I'd remove the red dot and use the iron sights only.

    I don't have the exact measurements, but with the flashhider the barrel is 16.1 inches. For whatever it is worth, I am glad I didn't get a 16 inch barrel plus a flashhider...

    BCM is a Wisconsin company out of Hartland. I've heard nothing but good things about them and have no complaints about either of mine. They are very easy to order from - I bought my BCM lowers locally and then ordered the uppers/BCGs directly from BCM.


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     

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  22. MtnCreek

    MtnCreek Member

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    The db rates being the same may be true; I don't know one way or the other, but they sure don't sound the same. 18.5" 12ga vs 18" .223 (bare muzzle or flash hider), the .223 seems like a much sharper sound than the 12ga and rings my ears much worse. YMMV.

    I'm with you on your comment about hearing loss in the event that I need to use a weapon defensively. While I don't want (more) hearing loss, I'll worry about that later, assuming I'm successful in my defense.
     
  23. PaisteMage

    PaisteMage Member

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    No one can ever say the gun community isn't helpful and responsive in a timely manner!

    The Colt several spoke of is great for the price range.

    You guys have given me lots of starting points and aspects for research. Now I know the questions I want answered and have some good pictures to boot.

    MY Army reserve friend has one he is going to let me shoot that is basically a lot like some you all have described. This should be happening a few weeks.

    Gratzi!
     
  24. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    Electronic muffs take 2 seconds to apply and turn on. Also, repeated studies have shown 5.56 with most rounds penetrate less than almost all handgun rounds in both tissue and structural materials.

    John
     
  25. PaisteMage

    PaisteMage Member

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    Thanks for the informative article "jmr40"
     
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