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Are there any modern service pistols in 7.62x25 Tokarev?

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by dcarch, Dec 16, 2010.

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  1. dcarch

    dcarch Member

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    I am a proud owner of a Kimber Custom II .45, and I love all things .45, but I got to shoot a CZ 52 in 7.62x25 Tokarev the other day, and I was very, VERY impressed by the laser-like accuracy and penetration of the 7.62x25 round. That got me thinking, what with the dirt-cheap costs of 7.62x25 Tokarev ammo, has any firearms manufacturer announced plans to build a modern pistol in 7.62x25? I personally wouldn't mind seeing a Glock in that caliber, but I guess I'll just have to wait... :( Does anyone else here share my love for the 7.62x25?
     
  2. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    I do, and a lot of people who know and understand surplus do as well.

    I am not aware of anything currently being produced in Tok but would be delighted to see something come out and more modern ammo production.

    It will be a sad day when the surplus Tok ammo runs out, I suspect the current ammo prices will rise sharply when they no longer have to compete with spam-cans of corrosive surplus.

    Correction on modern production:
    There is at least one guy making AK variants in Tok (I think he has a source of demilled PPS43 parts he adapts to cheap AK receivers) Video
    The Sterlings available through some online dealers are either new production or cobbled together form surplus parts, I don't know, and I've never seen one in person. They're homely, but might be fun range toys.
     
  3. Quiet

    Quiet Member

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    The only "new" 7.62x25mm pistols currently being made are pistol versions of the PPS43 and Sterling Mk 7. They are put together using used surplus subgun kits with US made recievers & US made non-chrome lined barrels.

    Because the overall length of the 7.62x25mm is longer than the majority pistol cartridges it can not be readily adpatable to currently available handguns.

    Since, the overall length of the 7.62x25mm is shorter than the 5.7x28mm cartridge, it could be adapted to the FN Five-seveN pistol.
     
  4. kludge

    kludge Member

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    I want a Tok carbine, make it operate like a .30 Carbine, 14" barrel (16.2" for non SBR), 4 to 4.5 lbs, double stack 30 round mags.
     
  5. PTK

    PTK Member

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    Then build one - it would be more straightforward to just use the PPSh 43 mags, magwell and a converted bolt, though. Doesn't need to be a locked system of operation, but if you want to go that way I'd recommend going with an AK bolt, carrier, and FCG instead of making it work like a M1 Carbine. Shouldn't cost too much to make, nor take too much effort. :)
     
  6. kludge

    kludge Member

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    I probably used the wrong word "operate". I should have said manual of arms.
     
  7. Snowdog

    Snowdog Member

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    About 6 months ago I stumbled upon a YouTube video of a fellow with both a Glock 20 and 1911 converted to 7.62x25. I haven't seen anything on the subject since.
     
  8. wally

    wally Member

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    Nah, the brass cased non-corrosive is readily available now for ~$20/50 in the same ballpark as any other centerfire pistol ammo other than 9mm or .40S&W.


    CNC Gunparts makes a 7.62x25 AR upper. I've got one and it works great! Uses PPSh 43 mags with a simple modification to engage the AR mag catch.
     
  9. otomik

    otomik Member

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    i don't think so. that's a thin barrel and the five-seven pistol uses a form of blowback that probably can't handle such hot rod cartridge.
    [​IMG]

    a modern pistol in 7.62mm tok would be a better than a five seven. modernize a c96 with a extending shoulder stock and you have a great pdw.
     
  10. otomik

    otomik Member

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    ***. a regular tokarev round will penetrate IIA. IIA ain't that tough at all.
     
  11. Quiet

    Quiet Member

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    Chatter on another forum, indicated he could get 6 rounds into the modified 15 round 10mm Glock magazine. Only six rounds because the 7.62x25mm cartridges had to be seated at an angle in order to fit in the magazine.
    Chatter also said their were numerous FTF issues.

    The FN Five-seveN magazine well and magazines are long enough to accomodate the 7.62x25mm cartridge, however you would need to fabricate a new slide/barrel/lock-up system to accomodate the 7.62x25mm.

    I agree.
     
  12. otomik

    otomik Member

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    coming soon: The New FN Seven-Five pistol!
     
  13. otomik

    otomik Member

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    there has to be some misunderstanding because any regular tokarev can do that, can bust through a 55-gallon barrel and still come out and kill a guy to quote a john woo film.
     
  14. mongo4567

    mongo4567 Member

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    Provide a link to that "law" please
     
  15. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    Really?

    So then everybody with a Remington XP100 is a felon?

    How about every long range handgun silhouette shooter with an XP100 converted to .308 or .358, or even .458 Winchester?

    How about the Thompson-Center Contenders converted to the dozen or more high velocity handgun hunting and silhouette cartridges from JDJ and others?

    Don't confuse what Diane Feinstein WANTS with actual LAW.
     
  16. PTK

    PTK Member

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    Quote the precise law or, respectfully, stop spreading misinformation.

    Also, yes, it's in 18 USC, along with a few thousand other laws. Sort of like telling someone what you think a word means, but they changed it, but it's in the dictionary, so... :scrutiny:

    The actual law you're trying to quote, by the way, is 18 USC Section 921, 17, B.

    So, as you can see, you're incorrect. The law hasn't changed, hasn't been modified, and no handgun ammo is banned except by those standards - which are actually quite specific and only truly restricted a few novelty rounds.

    A careful reading of the law shows that if you wanted AP handgun ammo, you simply have to add lead and use a relatively lightweight jacket. A steel, tungsten, or even DU rod for penetration are all legal if you have lead or other non-banned material and a 24% jacket weight or less. They wanted to specifically ban THV and "donut cutter" ammo in handguns.
     
  17. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    Horsehockey.....

    Dang you PTK! You beat me!:D

    Fail. Fail. Fail.
    No Federal law bans possession or use of armor piercing handgun ammunition by civilians. The sale of such ammunition (for handguns) by a licensed dealer or manufacturer IS regulated.

    A Google search DOES NOT tell you that pretty quick, it tells you just the opposite.

    The law CONTINUES to define "armor piercing ammunition" as follows:
    There is no need to Google when you can get this information easily directly from the ATF website:
    http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf
     
  18. PTK

    PTK Member

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    I'd take you up on that, but internet gambling is illegal in my state. :(

    Hell, I'd be willing to bet a nice, round, figure, like... your gun collection against mine. That'd be big bucks. ;)

    You're 100%, entirely, wrong. It's my job to know things like this off the top of my head and keep up-to-date.

    To make it clear, you believe that any ammo that can penetrate IIa armor, fired from a handgun, is clearly illegal, and that you believe the 1986 FOPA introduced this, and that the relevant information is clearly in USC 18... somewhere.
     
  19. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    katad:... I'll be back with the quote...

    55 posts in twelve hours.
    Dude you don't have time to do research.:D
     
  20. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    The online access only sucks when you don't know where to look.

    All you need to do is open this link to the Federal Firearms Regulation Guide:
    http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

    Then go to the Index at the very end. On page 228 is "Armor Piercing Ammunition" and every reference to AP is shown with citations to the applicable law, regulation, as well as rulings, procedures and industry circulars.
     
  21. dcarch

    dcarch Member

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    Could anyone else see a company like Taurus coming out with a modern 7.62x25 pistol?
     
  22. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    No, but I could see Norinco doing it. You just won't be able to buy one.

    Of course the Chinese could probably lean on Obama hard enough to make him remove the import ban if they chose to, not by itself but as an overall strongarm move regarding trade and our growing debt to them.
     
  23. Spec ops Grunt

    Spec ops Grunt Member

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    I would be so fine with that. Now if only Russia could bully us into allowing non-sporting config Saigas.
     
  24. Col. Plink

    Col. Plink Member

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    why not just buy a dang CZ-52?
     
  25. macadore

    macadore Member

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