CCW weight and Program Compliance

[labnoti]

Looking at the results of the last EDC caliber poll, it appears evident that 9mm is popular for every day carry. I know there are people that carry "full-size" handguns concealed every day. Nevertheless, I've often heard that "program compliance" is higher with smaller, lighter guns. I've read some people claim they carry their N frame concealed without any problems, but I wonder how often or for how long. In 9mm, there is so great a variety of guns. I could have made the poll with weight categories ranging everywhere from 9 ounces to more than 60. But I want to survey more than just gun weights. So my poll choices include another criterion.

The poll is only about concealed carry. If you carry openly, only answer with respect to your concealed carry.

Consider the weight of the loaded firearm and affixed magazine and accessories only, not including the weight of extra magazines, speedloaders, additional ammo not loaded in the firearm, the weight of the holster or any other accessory not fixed to the firearm.

 

[Nuclear]

Since I now live someplace where open carry is legal, I don't carry concealed as much as when I lived in a "no open carry" state. I do own heavier guns that I don't carry much because of weight.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

My first handgun was a Keltec PF9. I got it as at the time it was the smallest 9mm at the time.

It’s a horrible gun to shoot, and a terrible gun for a beginner. Like many though I bought if because of its size. Unlike many I learned to shoot it well and still carry it when I need something small.

I’ve since got a few full size pistols and a Springfield XDs 45. Yhe XDs has become my EDC and I mostly like the gun. That said, with all of the insanity going on, I’m thinking that an M&P 9C might be worth getting as it has 15 round mags standard and will accept the 17 round full size mags.

My thought is that when I go into more populated areas where the risk of trouble is growing that the extra rounds may be really nice to have. So this is really a long way of saying that what I carry depends on where I’m at. And given the choice I’ll carry what I think will give me the most protection from what I mayexperience.

 

[Random 8]

I voted option 3, however my circumstances are unique. I cannot carry at work unless assigned security duty (rare), and at home I feel little need as most anything on my property would be facing a rifle or shotgun rather than handgun, so most days I do not carry at all. On security duty, generally wildlife is a larger concern than people, my carry piece is a .357 Taurus and/or the M1A we inventory for overwatch. When I do go out and mix with the gentry, or we have a security role in urban terrain I carry concealed a mid-sized FN hi capacity 9mm which also fits into category 3. I choose firepower and shootability over weight and compactness.

 

[plumberroy]

I can't carry at work. Once I get home I carry. I had been carrying a G26 most of the time out and about switching to a G17 if I went to a higher risk area or walking security at church . I have moved to G29 and G20 for those types of carry working around the house or late runs to drive threw I will pocket carry a G42
All are gen 4 with mag release switched to lefty . All controls are the same from sub compact 380 to full size 10 mm

 

[CDW4ME]

I've been carrying concealed legally for 25 years, no I did not imply anything.
Jogging, mow yard, walk dog... just pocket 9mm; leave house for other than that: 1911 IWB, two spare mags, and pocket 9mm.
What is "program compliance"? I don't like the notion that I have to comply.
Do I get a prize for sticking with the program, how about a "beyond the call" award.

 

[Jack B.]

Conceal Carry every day all day. Except were it is not legal to do so.

 

[AK103K]

I don't like the notion that I have to comply.

You and me both brother.


Ive carried full sized handguns daily, pretty much every day, for over 40 years now. Gun goes on with my pants in the morning and comes off with them at night. Started with 1911's (and on occasion, 4" K frame S&W's) back in the early 70's, switched to P Series SIG's in the early 2000's, and then to Glocks about 10 years ago. Currently, carry a 17. I often carry "smaller" (G26 or maybe a 642 S&W) guns as backups too.

I personally think the main criteria should be, carry what you shoot best with. Not what you can easily hide. If you dress properly (in your normal clothes), use good and proper gear, and have the right attitude, you can carry pretty much anything, daily, for long days, with little effort.

 

[montanaoffroader]

I can carry at work but carrying a full sized handgun is just not practical. Crawling under broken vehicles, squeezing under dashboards and leaning over fenders is a good way to damage a pistol or the customers paint - or drop a loaded gun.

I have found that the only reasonable way to carry at work is a mouse gun in a pocket holster, so that is pretty much what I carry all the time. Not the necessarily the best choice for self defense but I figure that a pistol in my pocket is better than a pistol that is locked in my tool box or truck when I need it.

YMMV

 

[labnoti]

I get it about "compliance." It's not my term, but one I've heard from several pop-media gun pundits. I guess it's intended to mean, "compliance with one's own wishes" -- as in, you want to carry a Desert Eagle every day, but do you comply with this? You got a license and bought a Glock 19 and a holster, but are you with the program you set up or does it live in the nightstand?

I understand there are potentially good reasons why people will not carry all day, every day, like prohibitions at work, but the criteria are for 4 hours per day, which is still practical if one carries during their commute and most of the waking hours outside an 8 to 10 hour work day. If a person can't carry at work and therefore just leaves the house without a firearm, that would probably be a data point for less than 4 hours. Since the poll is regarding concealed carry, it's not relevant that they strap a pistol around the house unless that's also what they carry just about everywhere else.

 

[CDW4ME]

I personally think the main criteria should be, carry what you shoot best with. Not what you can easily hide. If you dress properly (in your normal clothes), use good and proper gear, and have the right attitude, you can carry pretty much anything, daily, for long days, with little effort.

Yea. I've posted similar.
Unless limited by work attire, carry should be the pistol you would prefer to defend yourself with of the handguns you own; if not, why are you carrying it.
Jogging, bicycling or mowing the yard, is like work attire, a "valid" reason to carry less.
Desire to tuck shirt into jorts / jeans to "look nice" eating at Olive Garden (whatever) is not a valid reason to carry less, IMO.
For "good area" a 32 acp / 380 (mousegun) deemed sufficient whereas "bad area" merits something bigger is flawed rationalization too.

ETA: I didn't vote in poll cause I'm retired and don't leave the house (go to town) every day.
However, prior to retirement I could carry at work and I carried a 1911 IWB + 2 spare mags + pocket 9mm every day (desk job) for months.
That ^ is still what I carry for trips to the store, restaurant, church, errands, ect...

 

[labnoti]

You and me both brother.


Ive carried full sized handguns daily, pretty much every day, for over 40 years now. Gun goes on with my pants in the morning and comes off with them at night. Started with 1911's (and on occasion, 4" K frame S&W's) back in the early 70's, switched to P Series SIG's in the early 2000's, and then to Glocks about 10 years ago. Currently, carry a 17. I often carry "smaller" (G26 or maybe a 642 S&W) guns as backups too.

I personally think the main criteria should be, carry what you shoot best with. Not what you can easily hide. If you dress properly (in your normal clothes), use good and proper gear, and have the right attitude, you can carry pretty much anything, daily, for long days, with little effort.

How big a man are you (I mean weight and height)? What are your normal clothes?

 

[Old Dog]

personally think the main criteria should be, carry what you shoot best with. Not what you can easily hide. If you dress properly (in your normal clothes), use good and proper gear, and have the right attitude, you can carry pretty much anything, daily, for long days, with little effort.

This.

In a similar thread a while back, I pontificated that I just didn't get mousegun carry and some guy from Florida lit me up saying I could not possibly understand (presumably because I live in the Pacific Northwest where everybody knows we wear parkas 365 day a year) ... I didn't reply then even though I've spent considerable time in Southern California, Florida and Arizona, carrying full-sized handguns all day long. It's simply a choice; If I ever need a gun again when I'm not working, I don't want to be scrambling to pull out and defend myself with a little Kel-Tec or LCP.

 

[AK103K]

How big a man are you (I mean weight and height)? What are your normal clothes?

Im 5' 6", have broad shoulders to a narrower waist, and hover around 165-170#. My pants are a 34" waist.

Normal clothes for me are Carhartt or Dickies carpenter type pants, with either a untucked tee shirt (my normal size, L, and usually over a "wife beater") or an untucked oxford type shirt over a tucked in tee. Colder weather, sweatshirts or fleece over whatever is comfortable.

If I need to be more "business casual", I just tuck the oxford over my 17 (I normally carry AIWB).

Ive carried fat (as heavy as 215# / 38" waist) as well as skinny (155# / 32" waist). I always wore the same clothes I would have worn if I werent wearing a gun. I dont "size up", as no matter what size you are, the clothes dont look or fit right if you go bigger.

 

[huntsman]

I carry a gun all day every day but since I’m retired the bulk of that time it’s an LCP, since I recently bought a Shield9 that goes on the belt when I leave the house.

Both guns are under 24 ozs and to be honest I bought the Shield9 because a loaded G23 was too heavy.

 

[AK103K]

This.

In a similar thread a while back, I pontificated that I just didn't get mousegun carry and some guy from Florida lit me up saying I could not possibly understand (presumably because I live in the Pacific Northwest where everybody knows we wear parkas 365 day a year) ... I didn't reply then even though I've spent considerable time in Southern California, Florida and Arizona, carrying full-sized handguns all day long. It's simply a choice; If I ever need a gun again when I'm not working, I don't want to be scrambling to pull out and defend myself with a little Kel-Tec or LCP.

I dont get the "little" gun thing for a primary gun either. I think its just the age we are in these days, and the availability of both permits to carry and with so many smaller guns now available, they make for a popular choice. I often think its more of a fashion or status statement thing, than something really taken seriously.

I know a number of "gun people" who are like that. They really dont carry all that often, always let you know they are when youre with them (the old "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" thing), and I rarely ever see them practicing at the range, or they have all sorts of excuses why they dont, if I ask. Yet they consider themselves "prepared". Kind of scary to me, but, hey, what do I know.

I currently live in PA, and work and play outside year round. My work is physical too, I'm not in any kind of controlled environment. Summers here are pretty steamy, and often in the mid to upper 90's with 90% plus humidity. Then put some fairly steady and heavy labor for 10+ hours a day on that. Ive never had a problem concealing and carrying a full-sized handgun doing so, in any weather, and have routinely done so, often in NPE's as well.

When I hear someone say they "cant", to me that simply means, they "wont", or "dont want to". I know it can be pretty easily done, so I dont want to hear it.

Ive carried those smaller guns as well, usually as second and third line backups, and always found them to be slow to get at and going, and harder to shoot well with (not to mention usually being a questionable caliber), especially under any kind of stress, and shooting "realistically". I also cant remember ever seeing anyone practice with one at any of the ranges Ive been to, in any manner other than stand there, with the gun at the ready, and slow fire at close distances.

But hey, if they feel good about it, whatever. I just hope Im not there if things go south. Look at what happens in NYC when the "trained" cops get to shooting.

 

[FL-NC]

I EDC a S&W shield 9, which weighs whatever it weighs.

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

My first CCW piece was the only gun I had at the time: Sig P226 ST.
Thing weighs 41 ounces.

after about 6 months, I got a Sig P239 which weighs 25-29 ounces (depending on the source). Much better.

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

My EDC's are almost always over 24oz empty. A Steyr S9 and now a 4" PPQ. With a good holster and an even better belt they carry very comfortably.
On rare occasions, like today, I carry a Ruger LC9S pro. Had a doctor appointment and after 50 you can't be to careful around those guys. Actually, I left it in the truck.

 

[Steveo_1704]

i voted #3, but i work from home and always carry when i leave the house. when i work, i have something sitting in the desk drawer next to me.

 

[labnoti]

Im 5' 6", have broad shoulders to a narrower waist, and hover around 165-170#. My pants are a 34" waist.

Normal clothes for me are Carhartt or Dickies carpenter type pants, with either a untucked tee shirt (my normal size, L, and usually over a "wife beater") or an untucked oxford type shirt over a tucked in tee. Colder weather, sweatshirts or fleece over whatever is comfortable.

If I need to be more "business casual", I just tuck the oxford over my 17 (I normally carry AIWB).

Ive carried fat (as heavy as 215# / 38" waist) as well as skinny (155# / 32" waist). I always wore the same clothes I would have worn if I werent wearing a gun. I dont "size up", as no matter what size you are, the clothes dont look or fit right if you go bigger.

I wear the Carhartts too. But I weigh about 50 pounds less than you. 50 pounds... that's like an 8 year old kid -- a lot less real estate to carry on. I wear 30" waist but it's a loose fit. I tried AIWB with a medium-frame non-snubnose revolver and it looked very "immodest." An untucked flannel shirt wouldn't hide it at all. If I put it anywhere outside my hip bones, it sticks out from my waist substantially. A vertical shoulder holster worked best, but the butt still printed through a loose flannel shirt. A 36" chest doesn't give much depth to conceal it. I need somewhat deep concealment too as I interact closely with kids and adults, ride skateboards, play with a dog and so on, so I can't just stand in the corner and keep my sport-jacket properly adjusted. I carry one or two .357 j-frames everyday without issue, but haven't made the full size thing work yet. I any event, thanks for the response.

 

[JR24]

You and me both brother.


Ive carried full sized handguns daily, pretty much every day, for over 40 years now. Gun goes on with my pants in the morning and comes off with them at night. Started with 1911's (and on occasion, 4" K frame S&W's) back in the early 70's, switched to P Series SIG's in the early 2000's, and then to Glocks about 10 years ago. Currently, carry a 17. I often carry "smaller" (G26 or maybe a 642 S&W) guns as backups too.

I personally think the main criteria should be, carry what you shoot best with. Not what you can easily hide. If you dress properly (in your normal clothes), use good and proper gear, and have the right attitude, you can carry pretty much anything, daily, for long days, with little effort.

Yep.

Though I swapped my 17 for a 19X some months back.

Rarely I'll carry the 26 when the 19x can't conceal, namely when I wear a tighter shirt to church and its easier to tuck the 26.

When I get home the 19x goes back on and stays that way till I go to bed. Watching TV, mowing, working in the yard/garage/roof/on the truck, cutting trees etc etc.

Though mostly just chasing my toddler around.

 

[Livin_Cincy]

This is my everyday Colt Bulldog Carry:
https://www.classicfirearms.com/col...416741439894607419408882520849919812196160775

Appendix Carry can be difficult...

 

[JR24]

This is my everyday Colt Bulldog Carry:
https://www.classicfirearms.com/col...416741439894607419408882520849919812196160775

Appendix Carry can be difficult...

You must have a good belt. 1/2" steel?

 

[Livin_Cincy]

You must have a good belt. 1/2" steel?

I actually let my gun crew carry it. I have gone thru the Airport with TSA not asking any questions. It is rough to get down the aisle...