First handgun purchase; forgot the bill of sale.

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njhockey

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I made my first handgun purchase during the previous weekend, but I foolishly was in a rush and forgot to get a receipt/bill of sale--which was a listed requirement of the seller, and something I wanted as well.

The deal was done FTF, as all of my long guns have been purchased. I reside in Missouri, which places no restriction on private sales other than a reasonable belief that the other party may legally possess firearms.

I haven't been able to contact the seller since the transaction, and I'm wondering what repercussions, if any, my hasty purchase might cause down the road. What if the firearm has been previously used in a crime? What if I need to prove ownership?

I realize the same scenario could be presented for my long guns, none of which I have a bill of sale or receipt for, but it just seems different in a way with a handgun.

In short, am I being irrational or was this a major mistake on my part?
 
I wouldn't worry about it.

Now where is that receipt for the gun I got in 1963? :) Heck, the receipt for one I bought in 1993 faded to blank paper in about five years.

John
 
JohnBT said it...I have seen some of those "thermal paper" cash register receipts fade in as little as a year.

Not that this will help in your situation, but what I do for those thermal paper sales slips is to scan them into my computer, and print a copy. Now, as long as my paper files don't flood......
 
where is this database?

i think we're all too influenced by the movies and tv shows that there's a national database of where guns have been used in crimes.
 
Your local PD will likely run it thru NCIC if you ask them to....Of course it it's entered as stolen, they'll seize it.
 
No worries the only possible forseeable problems I see is if you paid cash and the guy reports it stolen. Or you paid cash and the guy is robbed and killed and some how the numbers show up as his and you are the target of an ivestigaton
 
Yes - always get a receipt for your own protection. It's best to do so and if the seller is reluctant to give you one, I'd walk away regardless of how good the deal is.
 
The only problem that you might have is if your gun is defective and you have to return it to the dealer for repair or replacement.

As far as the law is concerned, our system of justice supposedly presumes innocence until guilt can be proven in a court of law. (Though they are working hard to get around this) The burden of proof is supposed to be on the accuser. In other words, you don’t have to prove that you own your gun, the police or whoever has to prove that you do not.
 
Forms on purchases

I would not worry too much about it though a receipt is always a good thing to have (if nothing else than for your personal records). I believe there is a thread on THR somewhere where someone posted a link for a "Firearm Bill of Sale". Just do a search and you'll find the thread.

I bought a gun at a gun show from a FFL that I know and I went back to his store a week later to get a receipt cause he doesn't give em out at shows (go figure). Of course having a CHL I just have to fill out the 4473 and show em my CHL and DL and I'm good to walk with the weapon once they have their $$ :) :D
 
Thanks for all the replies. I did pay in cash, and I have no reason to believe that the individual would report it as stolen; from the dozen or so e-mails we exchanged and meeting in person he would seem to be an upstanding guy who also took great care of his firearms. I have already printed copies of the original classified listing and e-mails.

I will continue to try to contact him to get the bill of sale, if for no other reason, than for my own records. I assumed that having the gun in my safe along with manual, original packaging, etc would constitute prima facie possession.
 
Receipt?

You paid for it. It's yours. Don't worry about it. Too many what ifs will drive you crazy. I've bought and sold guns through FTF and have NEVER asked for a receipt or given a receipt.
 
Do not sweat it too much. I would however write out down on a piece of paper the date you got it. Description of the type of pistol and serial number. You might even put down where you made the purchase and a general discription of the person you bought it from. Keep it where you keep your other bills of sale. If it ever comes up give you at least have that.

I ask the FTF buyer to sign a bill of sale and I give them a copy too. I think this is the safe thing to do. I also ask for valid ID which I check against the signature and the name I am given but I do not record it.
 
Even if your gun were stolen, law enforcement will never have the oppertunity to run the serial number on it to find out unless you use it in a crime and they confiscate it.

My neighbor had all his guns stolen once and about a year later he found one of his shotguns on a table at a gun show. He knew it was his because of the odd combination of after market accessories on it. The poilice were summoned but because the gun was bought used from an individual and he never recorded the serial number, there was no way to prove it was ever his.
 
I keep a log, for my own records and my insurance if it's ever required. Note the date purchased, price paid, pertinent data on the gun, and I take photos of the gun, including any serial numbers or other markings. No one has access to this except me. It's stored on a flash drive and one of my kids has a copy.

It's surprising how many guns I have bought from unknown sellers and they are so marked. I do the same on guns I sell, and if the seller will disclose the info, ok, if not, ok too. I just note "sold at xxx gun show" or "private purchaser" if I don't have a name. I'm not required to have one.
 
Even if your gun turns out to be stolen or had been used in a crime about all they can do is confiscate it if they can't prove that you knew. My Dad once bought a stolen saxaphone (without knowing it of course) and some months later took it to a repair shop where the owner recognized it as belonging to a friend. The police returned it to its rightfull owner before Dad even found out. The guy who stole it was already in jail so they never even questioned Dad. He was just out $1,500.
 
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njhockey said:
Thanks for all the replies. I did pay in cash, and I have no reason to believe that the individual would report it as stolen; from the dozen or so e-mails we exchanged and meeting in person he would seem to be an upstanding guy who also took great care of his firearms. I have already printed copies of the original classified listing and e-mails.

I will continue to try to contact him to get the bill of sale, if for no other reason, than for my own records. I assumed that having the gun in my safe along with manual, original packaging, etc would constitute prima facie possession.
Click to expand...
Just staple that info together, write the gun's serial number on it with a note saying you paid $xxx.00 cash for it in a FtF sale on XX DATE 2011 just so you have it for your records (in case YOU ever experience fire, theft, flood - etc)

In south MO there's a website called Rolla.net....
http://shopping.rollanet.org/index.php
...that has a firearms section with generally about 250-300 items listed on it daily.

We're talking a little bit of SOUTH MO here and some of those ole'Ozarkians are the kind of people that like to stay UNDER the radar of the taxman - sometime's you'll get a receipt from them, sometimes you won't - I've learned to create my own LEGAL "documentation" by using info like you have (emails, photos, etc)
 
where is this database?

i think we're all too influenced by the movies and tv shows that there's a national database of where guns have been used in crimes.
Click to expand...

You can call your local PD and search stolenweapons.com. I have asked my local PD a couple times for friends or family members who were weary about the history of a gun the bought in a FTF sale.

I said nothing about a gun used in a crime and yes a stolen database exists you just didn't know how to get access to it ;).
 
Thanks for all the excellent help guys; this was exactly what I was looking for.

A special thanks to Toforo, my fellow Columbian, for the link! Looks like another site I'll have to keep tabs on.
 
njhockey said:
Thanks for all the excellent help guys; this was exactly what I was looking for.

A special thanks to Toforo, my fellow Columbian, for the link! Looks like another site I'll have to keep tabs on.
Click to expand...
No prob - ain't Columbia an AWESOME place for gun hobbyists??

Midway, Grafs, GreenValley (home of the Bianchi Cup)

and about 30 minutes away - Starline Brass, Sierra Bullets, 15 minutes past that Missouri Bullet, lol.
 
I too bought a handgun without a bill of sale and was concerned after thinking it over. So I contacted LE and ask them if they could check it out for me and was told no. The only way they said it could be checked was if their was probable cause to do so. What that meant was if I was suspected of having commited a crime with it, or other wise did something that presented probable cause to run the serial number. However, my Son has a personal friend that is a LEO and he did it as a favor for me. But to the best of my knowledge, I don't know of, or have ever heard of a data base.
 
The last thing I would do is talk to the local PD about it. Even if you are in complete comliance with the law the local pd always just seems wierdo about those things in my experiences.

I wouldnt worry too much about it until you can contact the guy. That is if you really want the bill of sale. Just be patient, he may just be busy or who knows what. You contacting him once, you likely can again.

Thats just me.
 
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