General all around farm gun

[TCB in TN]

Farm guns are just as varied as the farms they are found on. BTW as a small farm-farmer myself I can say that MOST varmits will run when confronted or shot at, much less actually shot. I have never found a coyote that waited around more than a second or two after a shot, whether hit or not. Now bear and panthers may be another story and I don't know as I have no experience with them, but I can speak from personal experience that in most populated areas there will be a significantly higher level of predation from domestic or feral dogs than anything else. They will also typically be harder to run off than wild predators also!

While raising goats and horses I have killed a few coyotes over the years, but again most of the trouble has just come from dogs. They typically cause more trouble because the are not really afraid of people, that said most will still break off attack when confronted by people. Under most circumstances when going out after dark I go with the ole pump shotty, loaded with 00 it can bring down just about anything I need it do, it is also slightly more forgiving of poor aim than a rifle. And as I mentioned above coyotes and dogs will typically break off attack when you yell or shoot which would give you a clean shot even around horses. Now during the day using a rifle is usually my first choice, but after dark I go with the shotty. Further more a new shooter is NOT going to consistently hit a moving dog, or coyote with a rifle at any significant distance at night, and under pressure. I have been shooting all of my life and the number of hits I have made under those circumstances is dwarfed by the number of misses by a large margin. Training and practice will be key to develop the skills needed.

If she is set on a rifle then getting a similar rifle in .22lr will be important. It is easier for most non-shooters to develop good shooting technique with the .22. Low noise, low recoil, and low cost provide the best chance for extensive correct practice. I like the 30-30 lever gun couple it with a .22 lever for practice and you could do pretty well. But I don't really see the problem with a semi-auto. I know that some folks feel that a newbie shouldn't use one, but in my experience if you are going to practice enough to shoot well then you can learn to handle a semi just fine as well.

 

[mgregg85]

Given the low cost thing I would suggest a kel tec sub2000, either the 9mm or the .40S&W should put down most anything she has to deal with. It is also a small weapon so perhaps it will fit her well. Very simple controls and easy to use.

 

[fearless leader]

A 6.5mm Carcano. It's light, cheap (under $100 ususally) and according to the Warren Commission that investigated the Kennedy assasination, it's the fastest shooting, most accurate rifle in the world!

 

[76shuvlinoff]

I live on 11 acres in Michigan with other homes to consider. We have 4 horses on the property, had 5 until yesterday, lost a nine year old unexpectedly, total heartbreaker. She simply shutdown and it looks neurological, even the vet is baffled. I just buried her a couple hours ago.
However to get sorta back on track the biggest physical threat to our horses would be woodchuck holes and my little scoped Marlin 39A (yeah I put a scope on a lever gun, total blasphemy I know) works just fine for those varmits with CCI stingers. I do have an 870 with slugs available if the stakes go up (think aggressive stray dogs 2 or 4 legged) and I have used my 1911 for critters in close quarters. Not skunks though, I prefer to reach out long distance for those.

 

[mustanger98]

A 6.5mm Carcano. It's light, cheap (under $100 ususally) and according to the Warren Commission that investigated the Kennedy assasination, it's the fastest shooting, most accurate rifle in the world!

My brother-in-law is not a real bigtime gun guy, but he has a Carcano carbine. I went to hunting parts and ammo for it because he don't know where to look. The rear sight starts at 600m. The ammo... the only hunting ammo's made by Norma and it's $40/20rds. This makes the Carcano my dead last pick to recommend to anyone. Therefore, I hope fearless leader is joking.

 

[fearless leader]

Mustanger98, AH, you got me.

For occaisonal shooting you could use one. It would be cheaper than say an AR-15 and a scope would allow sights to be set where you like, and even expensive ammo (figuring on 40 or so round a year) cheaper than a AR that others were suggesting, but yes I was joking for the most part. They aren't that great of rifles.

According to the Warren commission, they suggested the rifle was capable of remarkable things. About that, I was joking.

I, personally, would have one for such a purpose due to the nature of the conditions it would be handled. (It's going to be in a shed or barn or something)

1) if it is stolen, you're out a cool C note, as opposed to someone taking a good, and expensive gun, like an AR 15.

2) you aren't going to shoot it for fun (don't need 1000 rds.) I have a rough duty rifle and haven't used the first 40 rounds yet. I've had it 3 years.

3) you needn't worry yourself with the finish (scratches, etc)

4) they don't kick that bad (not like 12 ga.)

5) you can file the sight to suit you.

6) the round is quite effective, as I understand, on critters; 2 and 4 legged.

Just because I would do it don't mean I think everyone should.

They are pricey, as you have noted to fix and to target shoot with, unless you reload. If she wasn't looking for a target gun, it could work. Say..$140 with 40 rounds. Is it really THAT far fetched?

 

[icebones]

go with an sks.

you can ususlly find one in decent condition for under $150

loaded with hollow point of soft point rounds a 7.62x39mm has about the same ammount of stopping power as the .30-30.

recoil is very mild, easy to use and rugged as hell.

also a box of 20 rounds normally goes for under $3

its semi-auto so hitting a running coyotie in the dark will be that much easier.

as much as i love shotguns, they are just not suited for famr defense. too many times ive shot several shells at a running coyotie or possum, just to realise trying to hit something at 50 yards with a shotgun is pointless.

with an sks you have 10 rounds or 7.62mm authority on hand

 

[crebralfix]

double tap due to slow server

 

[crebralfix]

Look at 243 and 270 Win.

Chuck Hawks has many great pages:

http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifle_killing_power_list.htm
http://www.chuckhawks.com/game_range_caliber.htm
http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifle_recoil.htm

On 270 Win: http://www.chuckhawks.com/accurate_rifle_cartridges.htm

243: http://www.chuckhawks.com/friendly_6mm.htm

The .243 Winchester and 6mm Remington are the best choices for the hunter who wants to combine varmint and medium size big game hunting. Both of these cartridges are very accurate, offer light recoil (in the vicinity of 10 ft. lbs. with most loads in most rifles), and flat trajectory that makes them suitable for long range shooting. These are short action cartridges, designed to function in all short action rifles that can accommodate the .308 Winchester.

32-20 (old counterpart to 30 Carbine...source = http://www.chuckhawks.com/small_game_rifles.htm)

The .25-20 and .32-20 are old cartridges designed for lever action rifles such as the Winchester Model 1892 and Marlin Model 1894. Once nearly obsolete, they have gotten a new lease on life because of the sport of cowboy action shooting. However, neither rifles nor ammunition for these old timers are widely distributed or particularly inexpensive. The .25-20 drives an 86 grain JSP bullet at a MV of 1460 fps. The larger caliber .32-20 drives a 100 grain lead bullet at a MV of 1210 fps. Due to their low velocity the .25-20 and .32-20 are the least destructive of the centerfire small game cartridges. Neither shoots as flat as the .22 WMR.

The .30 Carbine cartridge is a modern, rimless counterpart to the .32-20, loaded to considerably greater pressure and velocity. It starts a 110 grain JSP found nose bullet at a MV of 1990 fps and ME of 965 ft. lbs. This is far more powerful than required for small game hunting and represents the upper limit of acceptability. Its trajectory is flat enough to permit a 100 yard zero, much like that of the .22 WMR. As with any of the centerfire cartridges, head shots are desirable. This can be a problem for the .30 Carbine, since the cartridge and the rifles normally chambered for it (typically the U.S. M1 Carbine) have a reputation for indifferent accuracy. The .30 carbine has found a home in the Ruger Blackhawk and T/C single shot pistols, which will often outperform the M1 carbine (rifle) in terms of accuracy.

Remington 7600 in 270 Winchester with synthetic stock
Browning BLR in 243 (lever action)
Browning BAR in 243 (semi-auto)
Beretta Gold Rush in 45 Colt (pump action)
CZ 527 in 7.62x39mm
Romanian WASR or Yugoslavian AK-47 in 7.62x39mm
AK-74 in 5.45x39mm (mild recoil)

Frankly, the AK-47 will do everything you need for two and four legged critters. It has 30-30ish power, 30 round capacity, and is super-durable. You can get one for a very reasonable price. Wolf Military Classic ammo is under $200/1000. Pick up a few steel magazines and you should be good to go.

 

[Mac45]

Sounds like you have the right idea. Let her shoot a bunch and see what she likes. Doesn't really matter what, so long as it works for her.
I would think real hard about adding some sort of sidearm. Even a .22LR.
Darn handy thing to have around.

 

[mustanger98]

loaded with hollow point of soft point rounds a 7.62x39mm has about the same ammount of stopping power as the .30-30.

7.62x39 has 125gr bullets compared to a .30-30's 150gr and 170gr. Ballistic equivalency has been the subject of several debates on here and I don't buy it. I stick with my .30-30 levergun.

recoil is very mild, easy to use and rugged as hell.

It's easy to use if you know semi-autos. And recoil... different people percieve felt recoil differently.

also a box of 20 rounds normally goes for under $3

Price of ammo's going up across the board.

its semi-auto so hitting a running coyotie in the dark will be that much easier.

It's that much easier to miss 10rds in a hurry and further endanger the animals the OP's friend is trying to protect.

as much as i love shotguns, they are just not suited for famr defense. too many times ive shot several shells at a running coyotie or possum, just to realise trying to hit something at 50 yards with a shotgun is pointless.

Depends on the load, but we're talking defense of horses/foals and some of us already agree that you don't want a buckshot spread flying at an animal you're trying to protect. Don't want 10rds of whatever prayed at that same animal either.

 

[Wolfgang2000]

This needs to bee split into two categories.

First, it was stated that she was "gun ignorant", with no mention of how much if any gun training she has. I'll assume that she as little or none. So marksmanship training should be the first order of business. IMO a 22 rifle should be use for this. I have no aversion with using a semi auto for this. Most novices can be taught the proper discipline to shoot once and evaluate. So please leave the "spray and pray" cliché at home with the rest of the worn out arguments.

Then she should be allowed to try a variety of different calibers and actions types, so she can choose the one SHE likes the best. This should be done in a manner not to make her "gun shy". A bench or shooting sticks can be used.

Note:
For those of you who have wifes / girls friend that can handle those mow-m-down flat magnums, great, congratulations. However it's not the norm. Recoil sensitivity is a individual thing for men and women.

Two, caliber or gage.

A couple factors make a good "ranch gun".
Reliability
Durability
Effectiveness
Carry-ability

There are many firearms out there that will meet these criteria. 223, 243, 7.62x39, 30-30,et al all make very effective ranch calibers. But the choice would be the young ladies.

I live on a small ranch if very rural MO. I've seen coyotes and bob cats the size of German Shepard's. I've also seen Mountain lions, panthers, and feral dog packs. The rifle I keep loaded for my wife and I is a SKS carbine, (16" barrel). It has killed both deer and coyotes very effectively. Both my wife and I are proficient with it. However I freely admit that it is heavier nor does it carry as well as my Marlin 30-30. But for a "kick-around" gun it works very well.

 

[Jubjub]

If it's to be just one gun, I'd think short shotgun or maybe an old Savage 24 in .22 mag/20 gauge.

If the gun is kept in the barn, keep it in a case. I've seen a gun left out on an outside porch in the summer end up with a mud dauber nest in the bore.

 

[Officers'Wife]

Ten acres and bears? A 45-70 lever gun or single shot. Big enough to knock down what is shot at yet 'slow' enough not to stray beyond the boundaries.

Selena

 

[rickomatic]

Marlin 336 chambered in 30-30 will do the job just fine. Lever action, load up the tube and leave it be. Work the lever to make it ready to fire.

They aren't that expensive and don't have too bad of a recoil. Open sights are nice since she won't be hunting with it.

You can pick one up from a local Academy sports store for under 400 bucks.

Great gun. It was the first gun I ever purchased. I still have mine. And, as I was digging through some of my old gun stuff yesterday I found the owner's manual and receipt from Fred Meyer (remember when they sold guns?). It was dated Sept. 25, 1974, and the price before tax was $89.99.
Man.....I feel old.