You might try actually reading my post where it said:Plastic doesnt have anything to do with it, bountyhunter... case support does.
2) The cartridge is so poorly supported by the chamber that a defect in the case means personal injury.
That's really funny because last Thursday when I went to the range, the guys had all of the new PMC ammo boxes out and were checking them. It seems they found a box of ".45" where about half the box had been filled with brand new .40SW ammo. BTW, .40 ammo will fedd into and stay in most .45 mags so some poor schlub who didn't know any better could have loaded it up into his .45 and fired it. You want to own a gun that is only safe with perfect ammo? Go for it, I'll stay with the steel guns where even accidental double charge reload rounds ruin the gun but still leave you with two good hands.Glocks have loose tolerances and some have poor case support, I'll admit, yet I would have full faith in brand new, quality brand, factory ammo, or even once reloaded (by my own hand) ammo which I have visually inspected myself.
The gun is a different story, The mag blew out, the slide is jammed back and canted a little to the left and the left rear frame rail is gone. There is a small crack near the trigger on the left side.
To anyone who actually cares, that is mixing apples and oranges.Those "loose tolerances" and "unsupported chamber" allow the weapon to function in mud/dirt/snow etc. where other arms may fail.
Depends on the gun. According to some gunsmith books I read: a 1911 with a carbon steel barrel frequently survives a double charge with no damage (if it is well built). A stainless barrel will typically show bulging (and may split) and will be ruined (it also may extend out far enough to damage the slide). For that reason, some custom 1911 builders don't use stainless barrels. Stainless steel used in barrels typically is not as strong as carbon steel used for barrels, although SS formulae can be tweaked and heat treated for strength.So lets say an all steel pistol with super tolerances gets a double charged round... does it just laugh and keep on shooting? I'd think there would be even more force applied through the magazine and possibly the grip panels. The energy has to go somewhere.
True, but remember that big hole down the bore and out the front of the barrel? The gas is going that direction as well. If the gas motion is more restricted to the rear, more gas simply goes out the front.The energy has to go somewhere.
Every single time... ... I've heard about a kaboom on a message board, the next sentence is "he was using reloads".
Well, every pistol I've ever seen that did not fully support the case walls (feed ramp cuts into chamber, common on .45s) had the unsupported area in precisely the same place. Glock series guns appear from my observations to have twice as large of an unsupported area. Just look at some of Clark's case failure photos.The reason a Glock KB directs energy so forcefully down at the magazine and grips is simple: the weak spot is at the rear and bottom of the cartridge case, so it ruptures there which makes a gas port aimed straight down at the throat end of the barrel.
Yeah, I'm familiar with the site, in fact, I'm quoted there. The Gun Zone is not exactly a "message board", now is it?Then you need to get out on-line more. Check out the Dean Speir Gun Zone kB! faq. There are fewer than with reloads, but there ARE factory-ammo kB!s in every caliber above 9mm, and maybe even one or two of those (I don't remember any, just vague reports of reloads in 9x19).
Sometimes Dean makes some convincing arguments at the Gun Zone, then he turns around and shoots himself in the foot by making some blatantly hyperbolic statement that discredits his earlier statements in my mind.
That's a pretty light load. Even if it was a double charge, it should have still been safe. I've shot 7.0 Clays with no problems.3) Reloaded on a Dillion 650 press. 3.6 gains of Hodgdon Clays powder. Copperized 230gr bullet from National Bullet. Federal 150 primer.
2) You buy a $500 gun. I buy a $750 gun I can shoot reloads through. I reload for $3.50 per 50. Even cheap smelly Wolff is double that. Are you sure you save $ buying a Glock?He saved a dollar on ammo and voided his warranty. Really good idea.
Funny to hear this from the crowd who bashes 1911's - which used to all be built that way.Those "loose tolerances" and "unsupported chamber" allow the weapon to function in mud/dirt/snow etc. where other arms may fail.
Maybe it's blind luck on my part, but I own about seven autos and not one has an unsupported barrel (four 9mm and three 40's). Browning HP, Beretta 92/96, every 1911 I have seen have fully supported barrels.Well, every pistol I've ever seen that did not fully support the case walls (feed ramp cuts into chamber, common on .45s) had the unsupported area in precisely the same place. Glock series guns appear from my observations to have twice as large of an unsupported area. Just look at some of Clark's case failure photos.
I don't shoot .38S because it's basically a 9mm loaded up to insane pressure levels IMHO. I assume they would be subject to case ruptures because of it. I know that Govt 1911's will KB when fed a double charge, but you are WAY better off if it happens in a fully supported barrel. The point is, a double charge is pretty clearly a preventable offense, but a weak spot in a case may not be visible.Bountyhunter:
Are we to believe that you've never heard of the reasons why IPSC shooters made the fully-ramped .38 Super barrel the "standard" for hot-rod Gov't Models? Even in .45, that gun has also done a few kB!s over the years. I've read a few reports that the grip panels splinter and cut up the shooter's hands sometimes, even with crippling results when tendons got involved.
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