Help choosing a 9mm 1911 for USPSA shooting

[Brenainn]

Hi all,

I am new to this so bare with me!

Here’s the deal… Hopefully I can get some advice, etc.
I am looking for a good 1911 9mm for eventual competition in USPSA. I want to start out by getting a quality gun. I don’t want to have to upgrade a lot. I don’t know exactly what I should be looking for as far as specifics, features and details. However, I do have preferences.

It needs to be:

Reliable
Accurate (obviously)
All steel (NO polymer)
1911 style
Non-fixed sights
Preferably not smaller than a 5” barrel (open to suggestions)

Not knowing all the specifics of the USPSA rules and allowances yet, how limited would I be in a competition (if at all) if I bought a 1911 9mm? I will eventually like to get a .45, but 9mm is what I can afford to shoot at the time.

Here is what I am leaning towards, but since I don’t really know what I am doing, I am going on opinions from message boards and personal preference of the looks. I have not actually held all of them. I did shoot a Springfield that I liked a while back, but it was an older model and I can’t remember what it was.

Kimber Stainless Target II 9mm Steel frame, bushing, ramped match grade 5" barrel (a plus!), adjustable sights, Recoil spring 12lb.

Kimber Tactical Pro II 9mm 4” barrel, Steel slide, 4" Bushingless bull barrel, ramped, recoil spring 14lb. DOWNSIDES: fixed sights & ALUMINIM Frame

Kimber Pro Carry II 9mm 4” barrel, frontstrap checkering, checkering under trigger guard, ramped, Magwell trigger, Ambi thumb safety, Recoil spring, Bushingless bull barrel. DOWNSIDE: ALUMINUM FRAME & fixed sights,

Kimber Custom Aegis II 5” barrel, recoil soring 12 lbs, front strap checkering, steel match barrel, stainless match grade bushing, ramped. DOWNSIDE: ALUMINUM Frame & fixed sights


Springfield Px9130Lp 5” barrel, match grade barrel and bushing, all stainless, DOWNSIDE: fixed sight
Springfield PI9134LP 5” barrel, match grade barrel and bushing, fully supported ramp, adjustable rear Dovetail front target sights.
Springfield 5” Service Stainless Steel


What is bushing and bushingless and ramped? What is best for comp.?

I am only going with Springfield and Kimber because they are basically the only 1911 9mms with half decent reputations that I could find. Actually, they may be the ONLY 9mm 1911s made.

Some of these pistols are pricey, but I keep thinking I might be able to find a deal on one out there. I also want to get a quality gun right off the bat. I want a gun that will last me for as long as I am alive, so I don’t want to start out with cheap. On the other hand I really, really can’t go MORE than $1,000 and would preferably rather go for the $600 - $800 range. It's still a stretch for me, but I know the right gun is worth it and I think of it as a good investment. However, I like to keep an open mind – which is why I put a top limit of $1,000.

Any ideas or comments, etc? Thanks in advance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I Have ruled these non-1911s out
Kahr – LOVE the grip, but not reliable.
Springfield XD – grip too big
Most Rugers – grip too big
Glock – nice gun, but grip too big

 

[Dilbert]

9mm 1911

I often shoot a Springfield Armory 1911 9mm in IDPA. The gun is accurate, and has low recoil due to the size of a 1911 vs. the small 9mm round. The gun from the factory has an okay trigger with good adjustable sights. That said, I have sent mine to Wilson Combat to be worked over. Fiber optic front sight, checkered front strap, lap the slide, trigger work, bead blast finish, and mag funnel - that's all I remember that I told them to do,,,,,,,,,,, but I may be forgetting something.
I wish I had gotten a Wilson Combat KZ in 9mm to start with (www.wilsoncombat.com). That's a poly 1911 (15 rounds I think) that's as slim as a steel 1911 in the grip. Depending how you spec it out, and where you get it, it will be a little over your $1000 limit, but it would be a much better gun. My Springfield started out at about $800, but I'm having to spend another $600 or so to get it up to my standard.

 

[Zak Smith]

Make sure you know what you're getting into, and why. I say this because a 9mm "1911" pattern pistol does not fit competitively into the USPSA rules:

* it can't make major (by definition) in Limited and Limited-10

* you evidently aren't talking about an Open division "1911" shooting 9mm Major

* 1911's are not legal in Production division.

Now there's nothing wrong with buying a gun that you want for whatever reason, and shooting it in whatever USPSA division you want, albeit at a competitive disadvantage.

As for the pistols you mention, I don't have any experience with them. I do have an SV/STI double-stack "2011" in 9x19 for practical matches that do not distinguish between Major and Minor Power Factor, and I'd do it again just the same.

-z

 

[Navy joe]

Good to see you gearing up!

9mm 1911 is not really where it is at. The single stack 1911 fits into USPSA single stack or Limited-10 categories. Both require a minimum of .40 cal bullet diameter to make major.
9mm is getting used in two places ; Open where it is loaded to 165 power factor and shot out of double stack 1911 derivatives complete with dot sight, compensator, and four figure price tag. The other place is Production class where you need to be a double action to play.

Now you can get a 9mm 1911 and still compete, you just get scored at minor power factor which may matter to you as you progress and want to be competitive. I shot a 9mm Glock for a little while in Limited just because I wanted to do something different for a little while.

Otherwise, if you are wedded to the 1911 idea get a .40 or .45 and "bite the bullet" on ammo prices. Now would be a good time to learn reloading too!

If you have to go with 9mm due to price get a 9mm that is approved to compete in Production class.

I hope you are at least going to attend that charity match Asheville practical shooters is putting on right? Helping out a match is a great way to learn all about it. Jump in and shoot too, my first match was a 500rd count 3 gun affair. Never forget it.

 

[Navy joe]

As an afterthought, here is the approved gun list for USPSA Production class from www.uspsa.org. Maybe if you like the 1911 platform you could think about the Para LDA series which fits into Production and into your 9mm 1911 criteria?

US Production Gun List

This list is maintained by USPSA as a separate and distinct list from the IPSC list. If you are going to shoot a match outside the United States, please consult the production list at www.ipsc.org
Make Model
ALFA-PROJ Alfa Combat 9mm, Alfa Combat 40 S&W, Alfa Combat 45 ACP, Alfa Defender 40 S&W, Alfa Defender 45 ACP, Alfa Defender 9mm
ARMSCOR AP9, AP9MS, APP9, APP9MS
BAIKAL MP446 Viking
BERETTA 8000 Mini, 8000DL, 8000FL, 8000LP, 8040 Mini, 8040D, 8040F, 8045 Mini, 8045D, 8045F, 8357D, 8357F, 9000S Type D, 9000S Type F, 92, 92 Custom Carry, 92 EL, 92 Elite 1A, 92 Steel, 92 Stock, 92D, 92D Centurion, 92DS, 92F, 92FS, 92FS, 92FS Brigadier, 92FS Centurion, 92FS Deluxe, 92G, 92G Centurion, 92G Elite, 92G Elite II, 92G-SD, 92L Compact, 92L Compact type M, 92S, 92SB, 92SB Compact, 92SB compact type M, 92SB-F, 96, 96 Brigadier, 96 Centurion, 96 Elite 1A, 96 Steel, 96 Stock, 96D, 96D Brigadier, 96D Centurion, 96D Compact, 96D Compact Type M, 96DS, 96FS, 96G, 96G, 96G Brigadier, 96G Elite, 96G Elite II, 96G-SD, 96L Compact, 96L Compact type M, 98 Deluxe, 98 Steel Cougar Series 8000D, 98 Stock Vertec series 92G, 98F, 98FS, 98FS Brigadier, PX4 Storm Type F, PX4 Storm Type G
(no single-action only variants or laser equipped models allowed) (Inox versions of approved models allowed)
BERSA Mini T40, Mini T9, Thunder 40, Thunder 9
BROWNING PRO40, PRO9
BUL Cherokee-full size, Storm
Colt 2000, Double Eagle
Any DAO or DA/SA revolver with a barrel length of up to 8.5" is approved
CZ - CESKÁ STRAKONICE MT9, MT9L, ST9, TT40, TT45, TT9
CZ - CESKA ZBROJOVKA CZ100, CZ100B, CZ101, CZ110, CZ2075 Rami 9mm & 40 S&W, CZ2075 Rami P 9mm & 40 S&W, CZ75, CZ75 Combat II, CZ75 Compact 9mm, CZ75 P01, CZ75 SemiCompact, CZ75 SP-01, CZ75 SP-01 Tactical, CZ75B 9mm & 40 S&W, CZ75B Stainless, CZ75BD, CZ75D Compact, CZ83, CZ85, CZ85 Combat, CZ85B, CZ97B, CZ99
EAA Witness (decocker), Witness (standard steel), Witness-P
FEG P9R, P9RK
FN HERSTAL FNP-40, FNP-40 DAO, FNP-40M, FNP-9, FNP-9 DAO, FNP-9M
Glock 17, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 26, 27, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37
(L models are not approved) C models are allowed providing that the barrel is non-ported and the other requirements are met.
GRAND POWER K100 DAO
H&K P2000, P7, P8, P9S, USP, USP Compact, USP Compact Stainless, USP Custom Sport, USP Stainless, USP9SD, VP80Z
HS PRODUKT HS2000 Series, HS357, HS40, HS45, HS9
IMI Barak 40, Barak 45, Barak 9
JERICHO 941FB, 941FBL, 941FS
KAHR K Series 40cal, K Series 9mm, MK Series 40cal, MK Series 9mm, P Series 40 cal, P Series 9mm, PM Series 9mm, T Series 40cal, T Series 9mm, TP Series 9mm
MAGNUM RESEARCH Baby Eagle Compact 40 S&W, Baby Eagle Compact 9mm, Baby Eagle Polymer Compact 40 S&, Baby Eagle Polymer Compact 9mm, Baby Eagle Semi-Compact 9mm Baby, Baby Eagle Standard 9mm, Baby Eagle Standard 40 S&W
NORINCO NP18, NP22, NP34, NP40, NZ75, NZ85B
PARA-ORDNANCE LDA
(all models except variants with enlarged magwells)
Ruger K94/95, KP345, KP345PR, KP89, KP90, KP93, KP95, P85, P89, P90, P91, P94, P95, P97, SR9 in 9MM
S&W 1006, 1066, 39, 3913, 3913L, 3913TSW, 3914, 3953, 3953STSW, 4006, 4013TSW, 4043, 4046, 4053TSW, 410, 439, 4506, 4513TSW, 4553TSW, 4566, 457, 4586, 59, 5904, 5906, 5946, 659, 669, 6906, 6946, 908, 910, M&P 357Sig, M&P 40, M&P 45 ACP, M&P 9mm, Sigma models Compact SW9V, SW40C, SW40F, SW40V, SW40VE, SW99, SW9C, SW9F, SW9M, SW9VE
(Any DAO or DA/SA revolver with a barrel length of up to 8.5" is approved)
SARSILMAZ Hancer 2000, Hancer 2000 Light, Kilinc 2000 Light
SIG P2009, P220, P220-1, P220RST, P225, P226 AL-SO, P226 Blackwater, P226 Equinox, P226 SAS, P226 SL-SO, P226 Sport II SL ohne Schiene, P226 Sport Stock, P226 Stainless, P226 X-Five Allround, P226 X-Five Tactical, P226 Xpress, P226DAO, P226R, P226R DAK, P226R Two Tone, P226SL, P226SL Black, P226ST, P228, P229, P229RST, P239, P239RST, SP2022, SP2340, SPC2009
No SAO (Single action only) versions are approved.
SPHINX 3000 Standard Series Stainless, 3000 Standard Series Target, 3000 Tactical Series Stainless, Titanium
Springfield 357SIG 3", 357SIG 4", 357SIG 5", 40S&W 3", 40S&W 4", 40S&W 5", 45GAP 4", 45GAP 5", P9, Service model 9mm 3", Service Model 9mm 4", Service Model 9mm 5", Sub-Compact 9mm 4", Sub-Compact 9mm 5", Tactical Model 9mm 3", Tactical Model 9mm 4", Tactical Model 9mm 5", XD 45ACP 4", XD 45ACP 5", XD Sub-Compact 9mm 3"
Ported models are allowed providing that the barrel is non-ported and the other requirements are met.
SPS Compact SP II, Compact SP II Plus, Compact SP III, Police Compact SPII, Police Compact SPII Plus, Police Compact SPIII
STAR M30, Megastar, Ultrastar
STEYR M357A1, M40, M9
TANFOGLIO Combat Sport, Force 38, Force 38F, Force 38F Carry, Force 38L, Force 40, Force 40F, Force 40F Carry, Force 40L, Force 40R, Force 40R Carry, Force 45, Force 45F, Force 45F Carry, Force 45L, Force 45R, Force 45R Carry, Force 921, Force 921F, Force 921F Carry, Force 921L, Force 921R, Force 921R Carry, Force Compact 40, Force Compact 45, Force Compact 921, Force Pro, GT10, GT21, GT21 Baby, GT21 Combat, GT23, GT40, GT40 Baby, GT40 Combat, GT45, L, P19 Combat, P19 Standard, P19L, P21 Combat, P21L, P23, P23L, P38L, P40, P40 Compact, P40F, P40FB, P40L, P40R, P41, P45, P45L, Stock, T94F, T94R, T95F, T95F Stock, T95R, T96F, T96R, T97F, T97L, T97R, TA10, TA10 Compact, TA40FB, TA45, TA45 Compact, TA90 XL2, XL4
(Stock Custom model is NOT approved for Production Division)
Taurus 24/7, 817, 827, M66, P945, PT100, PT101, PT111, PT140, PT145, PT911, PT92, PT940, PT945, PT99
C Models not allowed. Any DAO or DA/SA revolver with a barrel length of up to 8.5" is approved. All listed models must be DAO, DA/SA or with a decocker only. All models listed must be in DAO, DA/SA or with a decocker only.
VEKTOR SP1, SP2, Z88
DAO, DA/SA, Decocker only models
WALTHER P1, P38, P5, P88, P88 Compact, P99, P99AS, P99C, P99DAO, P99QA
WITNESS Witness Elite Stock, Witness P Carry, Witness Polymer, Witness Polymer compact, Witness Steel, Witness Steel compact
(Witness Carry Comp, Gold, Silver and Limited versions are not approved)
ZASTAVA CZ99

 

[Brenainn]

Wow, thanks for that list. I will read through that in a bit...

So, it's not common to see 9mm in SANCTIONED PS matches?

What COULD I do competitively with a 9mm 1911 in USPSA?

What would you recommended for a newbie to USPSA, that won't break the bank? I am looking to move up and compete pretty seriously. It sounds as if that's not going to happen with a 9mm... ?

As for the charity match, yes, I may attend. Not sure if I will shoot or not, but I may consider it after I have shot with the group for a while and PRACTICED!

 

[dbarale]

Did anybody ever make single stack/10rds mags in 9mm that would allow to compete in Limited 10?

 

[dbarale]

Brenainn, have you shot with the APSA before? If so, you know that you can try out pretty much anything with enough notice...
As much as I do not like Glocks (I really, really don't...) a used, stock G17 is probably a good way to get started.
Mags and holsters are cheap. The gun will be reliable, and it's probably the most important on a first setup. Failures to feed, fire, eject will cause you a lot of aggravation and will keep you from improving and focusing on your shooting.
When you are ready to move up, they are easy to re-sell with no loss of value.
Another choice would be a steel CZ75 or clone. Their controls are similar to a 1911, they have a pretty decent trigger, are reliable with good mags and are well fitted for the limited category.
I started with a Springfield P9 (another CZ clone) and it was a good introduction. I only sold it to purchase a 625 as I am forever a revolver guy...

 

[akanotken]

It seems like you've done a lot of reading, and tried a good bit of handguns.

I'll submit the following in an effort to help:
I'm pretty sure ANY gun with a semi decent trigger will be fine for you. Unless it's EXTREME, I'd forget about grip size, you'll learn to shoot it fine! I doubt you are gripping the way you will when you get good (I didn't initially). I swore off glock's because they were ugly and grips were too big. I wish I hadn't, but the same could be said for many of the guns you've rejected.

I'm going to guess that you've latched on to the 1911 because of that delicious trigger ... I know that's why I keep em around. But people are winning with other platforms. For instance, NON 1911's were at the top in the 1911 IDPA category at the nationals level.

So, I'd rethink where you are heading.

If you are going 9mm and definitely USPSA, then go with a production gun .. M&P, XD and Glocks are rocking that world, are very affordable, and there are some SICK (read awesome) trigger jobs for them. Almost like cheating.

If you just like the ergonomics and weight and would like a phenomenal trigger that isn't a single action, that LDA from para is hard to beat.

If you want to shoot a 1911 in USPSA, I echo the advice to get a .45 or .40. If it forces you into reloading (It should if you want to get good! ) then it will save you a lot of money over shooting 9mm. Shoot it in the single stack division or limited 10.

If you are dead set on the 1911 in 9mm, I'd suggest IDPA is a game the gun makes better sense in, but if you are set on USPSA I'd make sure you are ready for the frustration. It's not a bad thing, but winning a stage here and there, or having a really good match early on really helps in the motivation. You'll be delaying this. The models you are considering are fine, but I'd go hands down for an STI trojan.

But I think my generic advice for folks entering the sport is to buy a glock35, set it up for limited :
Price this out - Glock35, grip tape, sights, trigger, magwell, dillon press set up for 40, 10K bullets, primers, cases and powder.

Now get a 1911 in 9mm and 10K factory rounds.

You'll shoot these faster than you'd guess. Cutting corners? Hit the gun boards and get the glock for cheap (I wouldn't do that with a 1911 9mm, too many problem guns being ditched).

ETA:
Hmmm, I was typing with the last two posts. The 1911 in 9mm in USPSA penalizes you a lot for misses. Don't kid yourself, there'll be misses. You won't make up time shooting a subcaliber, the guys shooting the .45 are FAST! Google up singlestack uspsa on youtube and I'd guess you'll see ...

 

[Zak Smith]

Cheapest path is to buy a Glock or other similar 9mm and shoot Production.

 

[MarshallDodge]

Cheapest path is to buy a Glock....

But I thought he wanted something accurate?

I have a Springfield Loaded 1911 in 9mm and I don't find it as accurate as my Kimber 45. In fairness I have not played with it enough to figure out why.

 

[Zak Smith]

Well, yeah, but you can't shoot a 1911 in production

 

[Brenainn]

Thanks for the help. I am REALLY, REALLY new at this... I have shot mostly rifles and little revolvers and every once in a while a Glock .40 that my older brother owns, all here on the farm. So, all the info is a bit overwhelming!

I started out just wanting a simple semi-automatic 9mm pistol to practice with for fun here on the farm. I am an auto kind of person and always have been. Then, I found out about USPSA by stumbling across a video on the internet. Never having had anything to do with it or knowing the first thing, found a club, went and shot a little, and got hooked! Now as I am reading up on the sport for the first time, it seems to me that most of the bigger names in competition are using .45ACP. ?

So now, I have a dilemma. My whole plan has gone south. I just wanted a nice 9mm to plink around with, but now I find myself going toward maybe... eventually doing some competing in a sport I hardly know anything about, but LOVE!!!!! Do I spend the money on the nice 9mm that could put a limit to what I do competition wise? Or do I spend the money on something that is more expensive, but will allow me to compete? I could always get both... hmmm... I am thinking I may have to sell off my really nice road bike to afford that... kind of a bummer!

Also, about the Glocks, I know they are durable and reliable and ... But they are just a little more harsh for my own taste. Also, I have never had much luck with really good accuracy. Maybe it was the gun, maybe it was me, I just don't get that "vibe" from them. And I have very small hands so they always rub my hands raw. I don't really know if I want a Tupperware gun as my first either. I have always hated the idea. I think I want to invest in all metal and get started right. Honestly, the Springfields without the Houge grips are too big, but when I shot with Houges, it gave it a totally different feel, so I am definitely going to keep an open mind about things.

SO, what do I buy that allows me to shoot in most if not all categories of USPS? Seems as if it's not the 9mm.

Sorry if I seem to not be "getting it". I am just a wee bit lost in this whole competitive side of things, but am very willing to learn!

dbarale, yes, I have shot with APSA before. I may end up taking them up on their offer... I just want to narrow my list down a little more and figure out what I need to do first! How about you? Have you shot with them as well?

 

[Zak Smith]

Here are the dominant calibers:

Production: 9mm
Limited-10/Limited: .40SW (with a strong following of .45ACP in L-10 for the single-stack 1911 shooters)
Open: .38 Super or some variant

These are chosen to maximize magazine capacity and minimize recoil while still making the most favorable power factor rating in the division (Major for L10/L/Open, Minor for Production).

You CAN shoot whatever caliber you want in the different divisions, however, you may be at a competitive disadvantage with 9mm in Limited and L-10.

 

[Brenainn]

I think I need to print out the rule book and start reading. Seems like the best idea right now before I jump into getting a particular gun...

One more question... what does one usually look for as far as details and specifics when buying a gun for USPS competitions? What should you stay away from?

 

[Riss]

Basically in USPSA 9mm is in production class, list is above. OR you could get any one of the guns that are listed in Llimited and switch over to 9mm with a barrel change for plinking. The Glock is great for this because all you need to do to switch from 40 S&W to 9mm is a barrel change. Others on the list like the Beretta 96 in 40 cal may do the same but not all of them.

 

[dbarale]

Brenainn, are you and Kate the same person?

I am the guy with the weird accent and the big revolver...

What to look for in a first gun?
- Reliabilty (if you are Kate you'll remember how frustrating it was to deal with malfunctions).
- Good sights, a fiber optic front is pretty much the norm for fast shooting.
- Availabilty of holsters and mags, the 1911 is king here but there are quite a few other.
- What feels good to YOU, it doesn't matter what others like. If it works for you that's all that matters...

 

[jmorris]

A Para p16 would fit your budget and you wouldn’t be at a disadvantage shooting limited (with Dawson basepads) or limited 10. If you really want the 9mm try finding an IDPA club.

 

[MarshallDodge]

The Glock is great for this because all you need to do to switch from 40 S&W to 9mm is a barrel change.

Are you sure about that? I thought the slide had to be changed also???

 

[jenrob]

I'm a 1911 person and didn't really like glocks cause of the grips, but my wife has to have one (G22) for duty. I put a couple of rounds through it and just thought yeap it's a Glock. Then I tried it again and forsome reason it seems like a different gun. It's not that bad to shoot and shoots good once you learn a few tricks with it (my grip, trigger reset, ect.).

I don't know how the rules are on mods to your gun but there are (robar) several smiths that will custom the Glock. Like in the grip area and design.

I do think that I would step up and get a 40S&W over the 9mm, and start reloading. From your post above you stated budget that means that you will also have a budget on your ammo. If you are going to shoot competitive you are going to basically need an endless supply of ammo (almost). You can reload 40S&W and 9MM for about the same price. granted you can buy loaded 9mm cheaper than 40 S&W, but shooting comp you will pay for your reloading equipment in short time.

 

[1911NM]

I am afraid there really is no, one gun, one caliber for USPSA. The divisions were designed to keep specific types of guns, calibers(read power factor), and modifications within guidelines so competitors would not be at a disadvantage say by shooting a single stack 1911 in .45acp against a full race gun in .38 super. Yes, I encourage downloading the rules from the USPSA website, pick a gun you feel comfortable with, settle yourself within a division, ie., production, or Single Stack(if you think you can swing .45acp), then head to the matches, shoot, listen, and above all, practice, practice, practice. I only shot local matches a couple times a month last year, and burned somewhere between 5k and 7k rounds. I try to dry fire practice nightly, but was lax on live fire practice. More of that this year since I gifted myself with a progressive press this winter. Good luck, be safe, and have fun. Also, it would be worth it to look at the Brian Enos forum. Lots of hardcore USPSA'ers there.

 

[JackOfAllTradesMasterAtNone]

I don't shoot USPSA.

Reading the posts here, in reference to the rules, I'll make one huge suggestion. Buy the the gun/caliber that's going to put you on a level playing field with other competitors.

If I were to consider a 9mm from the list above, in any sort of competition it was allowed in, also being on a level playing field with others, I would seriously consider a Sig225/226. Prices for used ones are quite reasonable. I am a 1911 fanatic with small hands. I don't like the plastic guns at all. The Sig is neither, and the ones I've shot performed remarkably.

So if you're stuck on 9mm, go handle/shoot one of these to see if you like it. When the budget allows, buy a quality full sized 1911 in .45acp. and jump up to major.

-Steve

 

[neal7250]

I like a 9 MM but I love a 45

 

[skinewmexico]

My advice would be to get something (anything), and start shooting in competition (probably production) before you try to decide. Trying to decide before you start and guess where you'll end up after a few years is an exercise in futility. And a Glock is more than accurate enough for USPSA, you don't have to shoot .3" groups at 25 yards. Your gun will shoot worlds better than you will for.......probably several years.

 

[Brenainn]

dbarale, yep! That's me. It's kind of weird that we meet again "in here"! It seems that everyone is on the HR! Do you happen to know if Tyrone has an email address by chance? I have some stuff I want to send him...

Cool, thanks everyone. That gives me a lot to go on. I may very well, end up with two pistols. Who knows? I have some more thinking and reading to do though. I have to print that rule book out as well. I'll let you know what I decide! Thanks again...