If someone threatened you and you feared they would act on it...

[Girodin]

I can not believe that I am reading some of these posts about running from these people or hiding out.

I would not run, be scared of them in any way. If I die in a gun fight with these people I would take many of them with me.

And I guess in your grave you would feel like a tough guy, meanwhile your kids would still be without a father and your wife without a husband (at least for a while).

Think about if you were the one who was putting a hit on someone, how hard would it be to carry out on the average Joe, even if he was armed and ready to fight back. Most people would be pretty easy to ambush. When you consider there are a lot of gangs that have soldiers who are more than willing to commit a murder they won't get away with (i.e. in broad daylight in front of a bunch of witnesses) that makes it even easier.

I saw in another thread you are lending your self out as a trainer and wondering why you weren't attracting students. I think I'm starting to understand.

Survival > bravado/taking people with you.

Somethings might depend on the gangsters involved but there are groups that have carried out very brazen hits on people.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

and then there is the pesky reality of them taking your family first just because they can

 

[therewolf]

I'm too old to run, so that's out. These guys many times move on, if you don't
keep attracting attention to yourself, given time. So a vacation or making yourself scarce for awhile couldn't hurt. A change of pace won't kill you, even if a gang member will.

I'd be more alert,carry an extra mag, and throw a set of NAILCLIPPERS in my back pocket for good measure. Any thing which could hijack a plane is bound to help...

 

[Fred Fuller]

Folks,

Let's not make this discussion personal. It's all matter of opinion, and like certain anatomical features, everyone has one. It's not as if there is One True Answer to the proposed situation.

So... more light and less heat, please.

lpl

 

[clutch]

Move?

Well mom and the rest of the family live in the area. If they are really out to hurt you, they will hurt them. Can you get them to move? Doubt it. If you are rich, well maybe.

Stay?

Now you are living in fear. May still kill family, burn your home, ect. Your life is ruined, they know you, you don't know them. Bad situation.

Now you know why there are few witnesses in crime ridden areas. Those living there have already processed the logic.

Clutch

 

[Frozen North]

Frozen North, sorry to hear about your past situation. Did anything actually materialize or was it just "idle threats" someone else had mentioned? I had to deal with a pack of meat heads in college that lived across the hall and got into it with us over their late-night techno dance parties. They weren't armed, but they did jump us once or twice as a group out of the bushes and would try to intimidate my friend by standing outside his door whenever he'd come back from the shower or bathroom. Lasted about five to six months, before the one with the room failed out of classes. Again, we didn't have a legitimate fear for our lives per se, but the act of constantly being on the lookout for a random fist fight and dealing with their posturing was tiresome, and amounted to stress I certainly didn't need at the time. It is unfortunate that there is really no better recourse with people like this to either play their game and wait them out, or run away, which involves the personal inconvenience of moving your home. They begin to feed off of your life's energies like a parasite, as more of your time is occupied thinking about them, when in the perfect world, you would never think about them at all.

Yes it did materialize.... twice. The first time was neutralized by a deputy that showed up roughly 3 minutes after the call was placed. They stayed outside, I stayed inside with the children and an 870. They were not armed, told the deputy they (5 of them) were just here to talk to me. The deputy searched their car and on their person (all felons) and sent them on their way.

Dialing 911 AT THE FIRST SIGN OF TROUBLE saved my butt that time.

The second indecent was a bit more interesting. The deputy took 40 min to arrive and the aggressors were high and bent on revenge. They broke a side window out of my pickup to get to a garage door opener (non functional) on the sun visor. The noise woke me and it came to end in my front yard. One was armed with a knife, I was armed with a Glock. They left with a clear idea of how willing I was to defend my family. No one was injured, that is where I will stop the story.

 

[theory]

If I were you, I think I would be having a talk with the newspaper editor about your life being put at risk.

 

[oerllikon]

You can be former Delta Force, but it's hard to defend against 4 scumbags firing AK clones and Tec-9s out of their low-rider through your windows at 3:00am.

I got a really good chuckle out of this for some reason..
I would really hate to be in this situation, but I am always extremely paranoid about these sort of things. If I ended up turning someone in, or if I called the police on them for an attempted burglary (not sure the circumstances, if it was a home invasion I probably wouldve used my rights on them), I would have made sure i was anonymous. I am always looking at my 6 when driving, walking, and otherwise. I usually start to get suspicious if someone has made 2 or 3 or the same turns i have. If they think theyre being sneaky by being in the other lane, wait until you get to a stoplight. when the light turns green, wait a few seconds. If they dont make any attempt to move, that certainly seems suspicious. I actually had that happen one night, but im assuming they were just doing it out of boredom

 

[Deanimator]

Not calling the police isn't reasonable nor productive.

It may be or it may not be.

When I was in college, the dope dealer who lived across the hall from me in the independent students' dorm and his nitwit "hitman" buddy were both expelled (along with a bunch of fraternity pledges), for an incident in the dorm arising out of a botched drug deal.

The next day, the "hitman" stopped my best friend while he was driving the local school bus and threatened to have several of us killed for getting him and his "boss" expelled (which in fact, we had NOT). This simpleton was known for a fact to own (and illegally carry) firearms.

We went straight to the Fulton, Missouri PD and reported the threat. We might as well have reported that our shoes were too tight. The people who talked to the cops were told that there was NOTHING that could done on the basis of a threat, but as soon as one of us was HARMED, they'd spring into action.

We then went to the Calloway County Sheriff who essentially told us the same thing. He however pointedly noted that the State of Missouri was VERY serious about the right to self-defense. We took the hint, went back to the dorm and did an inventory of firearms and ammunition, cross-leveling where necessary.

I typed several term papers with an Ithaca Model 37 Deer Slayer Police Special across my knees.

We eventually had a meeting with the "hitman" and gave him our version of the Richard Boone/John Wayne "your fault, my fault, nobody's fault at all" speech from the movie "Big Jake". As stupid as he was, he took the hint.

Do NOT assume that the police will give you the time of day. They may not give a tinker's cuss and you will be COMPLETELY on your own... until you're maimed or murdered. From that day, I've never relied upon ANY "protection" from the police as an individual.

Epilogue: A few days before going home for Christmas vacation, I was cleaning the Ithaca. There was a knock on the door. It was the "hitman". He started into my dorm room, and ran onto the muzzle of the riotgun with his crotch. I asked him "What do you want, Dean?" It turned out that I'd made a few phone calls home on his phone before he went off the deep end. I had him stand in the corner while I wrote him a check. I never saw him again.

 

[Deanimator]

But if you are dealing with a real gang, say MS-13, perhaps b/c you got the better of one of them in a particular situation, temporary or permanent relocation is a good idea.

I wonder how THAT would work out for the average working man without government funding in THIS economy.

Quit your job, move away and live on... WHAT???

 

[Corporal K]

I wonder how THAT would work out for the average working man without government funding in THIS economy.

Quit your job, move away and live on... WHAT???

No easy answers, but in a way, I equate this type of situation to a natural disaster evacuation. It's best to have contingency plans in place now before the big hurricane, earthquake, societal collapse or squad of al Qaeda shows up at your door.

If you have to get out of Dodge for a few months, plan out where you would go, how you would live, etc. This is where financial planning comes in. An emergency nest egg is far more important than an extra 5k rounds, 3rd vehicle or new 1911. (Though the first 5k rounds are part of the contingency plan )

 

[Deanimator]

If you have to get out of Dodge for a few months, plan out where you would go, how you would live, etc. This is where financial planning comes in. An emergency nest egg is far more important than an extra 5k rounds, 3rd vehicle or new 1911. (Though the first 5k rounds are part of the contingency plan )

Honest people who get into these situations, frequently live in areas where these things happen, precisely because they ARE honest. Lacking the illicit income, they're usually on the financial edge at the BEST of times. If you're laid off, as I am, there ISN'T any "nest egg".

My choices would be "stay and fight" or "homelessness". At 53, homelessness is the worst option of all.

 

[Corporal K]

homelessness is the worst option of all.

Can't argue with that.

 

[fireside44]

In real life i'd consider a long vacation elsewhere.
On the internet I'd carry a Serba super shorty.

Bubba 613, this is the funniest thing I have heard all week. Here I was trying to finish my morning cola. lol

 

[Deanimator]

Now you know why there are few witnesses in crime ridden areas. Those living there have already processed the logic.

What REALLY drives the lack of witnesses in large part is the general knowledge that the police have no duty to protect you as an individual, and once your utility has been exhausted, often little desire. Combine this with the MANIA in places like Chicago and NYC to prevent that witness from defending HIMSELF, and you'd be a FOOL to testify.

This relates not just to MS13, but to a single criminal out on bail as well.

When the motto of the system is, "We don't have to protect you and we won't let you protect yourself", why would ANY sane person put themselves at risk to uphold a system which holds them in such profound CONTEMPT?

 

[Deanimator]

In real life i'd consider a long vacation elsewhere.
On the internet I'd carry a Serba super shorty.

In real life, I'd be better off putting that Serbu in my mouth than freezing to death, homeless in my car.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

What REALLY drives the lack of witnesses in large part is the general knowledge that the police have no duty to protect you as an individual, and once your utility has been exhausted, often little desire.


er no or at least based on my experience living in anacostia and southeast and northeast dc. its much more based on a culture that closes the streets for a drug dealers funeral and derides someone like the head of bet or the former mayor of dc for not "keeping it real"

 

[M2 Carbine]

If someone threatened you and you feared they would act on it...

Preemptive strike.

Long story and I'm not sure the tale would be within THR's rules.
So I'll just say, a POS threatened to kill my Wife. We went to the Sheriff. Going to the law does nothing for you except makes a record of the threat. The law's hands are tied. It pretty much comes down to the law MAY BE ABLE to make an arrest after you or loved one are dead.

There comes times that you have to stand up for yourself and loved ones.

I went after the lowlife but before I found him, he killed another person.

 

[Deanimator]

er no or at least based on my experience living in anacostia and southeast and northeast dc. its much more based on a culture that closes the streets for a drug dealers funeral and derides someone like the head of bet or the former mayor of dc for not "keeping it real"

Google the name "Harry Aleman". The guy who was the principle witness against him was treated like garbage and his life destroyed... by the authorities. The whole thing was detailed in one of the A&E true crime stories with Bill Curtis. The upside is that the judge who tanked the first trial for pay blew his own brains out in his backyard. Cold comfort to the upstanding citizen...

 

[Frozen North]

In real life...

The cops cant/wont do squat until a crime has been committed and there is proof of its occurrence.

If you go Rambo on them, you will rot in prison next to their homies.

In real life you can either move or forget about sleeping until they fry enough brain cells to forget why they hate you so bad.

Best case scenario, they do something stupid and go away to the state pen. Second best, they give you an airtight self defense case to keep you out of prison for shooting them.

 

[BudW]

I would call my cousins Carmine and Vinny,then have a little chat.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

The guy who was the principle witness against him was treated like garbage and his life destroyed. you aren't talking about robert cooley are you?

 

[Deanimator]

you aren't talking about robert cooley are you?

No, Robert Lowe.

The government's treatment of Lowe is an object lesson in why trusting law enforcement and the criminal justice system is sometimes an exceptionally BAD idea.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

what is it the gov did to lowe?

 

[AWDeanSR]

The first house my wife and I moved into after being married was in my childhood neighborhood. It was a nice place where older folks lived. Then a certain family moved in across the street. They would play loud rap music day and night while sitting outside smoking dope. I would often see local girls going in and out of the house, we later found out they were trading sex for drugs. The traffic increased so much in this"quiet" neighborhood. It seemed every scumbag in the county started hanging out at their house, which was directly in front of mine

On mothers day, at about 4 am, I was starting to get out of bed. I told my wife happy mothers day...next thing you know we are ducking for cover. Shots were ringing out in front of my house. A drug deal went bad. I called the law on them, and the law did nothing.

The drug dealers were renting from the same landlords as me. So one day the landlords came over and I informed them about the situation. They walked over from my house to where the drug dealers were sitting and watching us. I do not know what they said, but, they kept pointing over at us. This was the beginning of several months of sleepless nights.

These people were all career felons who had nothing to lose. None of them worked, and there was so many of them that there was small groups of them awake all day and night. Whenever I would go outside they would yell curse words and death threats.

I begged the local law enforcement to step in. I offered them the use of my house to just come over and observe what is going on. The cops wanted no part in stopping these guys. I think they were scared!

So, we decided we had to move. We had hardly any money and a newborn. It took us several months to save money to move. Each day I would have a 38 in my hand while leaving and entering my house. When at home I kept an sks nearby. I made sure that they knew I had guns too.

I had to go to sleep when I got home from work about 5 in the evening so that I could be up and watching them in the early morning hours. One night we came in late and I heard someone say lets get him. I pulled my gun out and hurried inside and grabbed my rifle and went back outside and sat on the porch watching them. They decided not to attack us that night but they attacked another man that night with a hammer and killed him.

I could go on and on, but to keep this sort of short. My advice...do not rely on Leo's for your safety, and family members will scatter when they see you need help. Arm yourself and be alert. Keep changing your patterns and move when the opportunity arises.