Is gun ownership becoming a luxury?

[browningguy]

Worst of all the boomers and folks running the show are totally oblivious as to how the "American dream" has turned into a fantasy for younger citizens. Part of me thinks they're simply oblivious another suspects that they don't care since they've already got what they want.

I don't know that you are entirely accurate, maybe I pay more in income tax than the median income in America, but I put myself through college while working full time and got a BSc and MSc, so I do kind of feel I've earned it. And to be honest it sounds a little like you feel the world owes you a living doing whatever it is you want to do.

My first job out of the Navy (6 years) in 1980 paid $18k per year, life was tight but we got by. We had two kids and managed to pay for them to get their Masters with out them having to take on any debt. But I took jobs in places I didn't really want to live because it gave me more opportunity down the road.

These days I pay new college graduates with an engineering degree $65k to start, that seems like an ok life to me. The salaries for the top performers go up 5-8% a year, of course for the poor performers it's much lower. There are also plenty of 20 something's driving new BMW's, Mercedes and $65k Ford Raptor pickups at our office. There wasn't much of that going around in the 70's and 80's.

Back to the original post, guns are just like anything else, there are guns anyone can afford, and there are guns for the 1% (luxury market). Find something in the middle and you can be happy. Ammo is also cheaper than it ever was back in the day, as others have mentioned there wasn't anyone going out and blasting a couple of hundred rounds of pistol or centerfire rifle ammo just for fun. Todays youngsters got spoiled through the 90's and early 2000's with the cheapest ammo anyone has ever seen, but you couldn't realistically expect that to last forever.

Everyone has to make choices, and every choice you make will have some effect on the rest of your life. Education, where you decide to live, what work experience you decide to get, how you spend or invest your income, everything matters. It also helps to get lucky, but luck is mostly preparation meeting opportunity.

 

[Sol]

Amish are an anectdotal example.

I've seen many using SNAP cards at Wally world.

Also ask your friends how much tax they pay as well.

Anyways, a couple hundred dollar gun for general usage and self protection isn't necissarily a luxury purchase.

A $100k high end shotgun used exclusivley for trap or doves is a luxury item.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I agree with jcwit. I make the least amount of $ now than I ever have. But I live more comfortably than ever bc I have learned to make each $ scream and got my priorities in line.

You guys aren't getting it.

That well managed and frugal head start can and will carry over into more wealth later.

The problem is today you will NEVER get that head start. Living frugally is not enough. Actual essentials in Life is getting really close to costing more than the average non professional can ever hope to make. Anything extra is going to automatically be debt.

Just groceries for a family (where nobody eats what they want) for a month is getting darn close to what an average monthly MORTGAGE payment was before the turn of this century.

 

[H. Floyt]

Hasn't shooting always been an expensive thing? I remember something about a typical rifle costing a month's pay from the 1780s through 1900ish. E.g. a lever action in 1880 would cost $30+ at a time when a dollar a day was common pay.

It is pretty common to make $2000 a month after taxes (maybe $40k or a bit less) now. That can buy a fancy gun.

I think the costs have shifted. People aren't paying as much for guns but they are now paying for all sorts of things they didn't before. Range fees, license fees, safes, practice ammo. I think most shooters 100+ years ago would be astounded at the idea of paying to shoot at paper targets. Just hike out of town a bit and try to shoot something you can eat or at least turn in for bounty money.

Everything in my world has gotten more expensive over the past 10 years, sometimes a lot more expensive (I think the actual rate of inflation must be about 8%)...except guns themselves.

 

[jcwit]

That may be. And you have no idea what living and raising a family is like today so we are even

Really? I guess my watching my daughters raising my grandkids allows no knowledge of what it takes to raise a family????????????????????????????

 

[R.W.Dale]

And the Latin folks have already discovered it, but make little inroads as owners of many of the factories have family members still in the group.


.

By your own admission they're a sheltered group of pseudo communists insulated from the job market forces the rest of the nation must face.

In the real economy the Amish would sink without the subsidatiom of their communities

 

[jcwit]

I've seen many using SNAP cards at Wally world.

Positive that's a snap card or a prepaid debit card, they're big with the Amish.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Really? I guess my watching my daughters raising my grandkids allows no knowledge of what it takes to raise a family????????????????????????????

As a parent who deals with grandparents who THINK THEY KNOW

With all due respect no no you don't.

Our kids grandparents out themselves a the time on how out of touch they are. We just simile and agree and don't rock their boat.

 

[jcwit]

By your own admission they're a sheltered group of pseudo communists insulated from the job market forces the rest of the nation must face.

In the real economy the Amish would sink without the subsidatiom of their communities

You know little of what you talk about. Plain and simple.

Many own their own business, and yes they all pay taxes. To think otherwise is pure ignorance.

 

[R.W.Dale]

You know little of what you talk about. Plain and simple.



Many own their own business, and yes they all pay taxes. To think otherwise is pure ignorance.

Which is it.

Are the Amish battling against the Latin onslaught in jobs or are they given preference for being Amish?

You are claiming BOTH

 

[H. Floyt]

Also, as far as boomers...unless you have a legal and ethical solution who cares? They got a different deal than we do, but is it worth lynching them over?

 

[jcwit]

As a parent who deals with grandparents who THINK THEY KNOW

With all due respect no no you don't.

With all due respect you have no idea how intertwined I am with my daughters, you are implying thing you know nothing about. Period!

BTW the RV industry is doing very well here, some are working 24/7. Course the Amish are not working 24/7 as they do not work on Sundays.

 

[22-rimfire]

If you are fortunate and have worked hard educationally, maybe had some luck in the employment arena, and secured a good job when you are younger, you can amass a substantial amount of money if life's turns don't force you to tap into this last resort reserve. Those that were fortunate and saved and invested are likely to be easily worth a million (perhaps several) by the time they are retirement age.

Unless you have a really good job, you are not going to be buying a gun-a-month for the most part and if you do, you are probably risking attaining that "million" and don't even realize it.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Also, as far as boomers...unless you have a legal and ethical solution who cares? They got a different deal than we do, but is it worth lynching them over?

No absolutely not.

They played within different rules of a different time. That's all any of us can do within our own season


It's just annoying how oblivious they are and how they still believe the same rules still apply

 

[jcwit]

Which is it.

Are the Amish battling against the Latin onslaught in jobs or are they given preference for being Amish?

You are claiming BOTH

You do not realize they "battle" nothing.

 

[jcwit]

Well I retired at the age of 58. But I don't recommend folks to retire my way, tackled cancer at 57.

 

[R.W.Dale]

You do not realize they "battle" nothing.

Yes yes they do. WE ALL DO

Be a paid slave and work yourself to death and have no family time or get replaced by an illegal willing to work for 2/3rds the money.

If YOU don't know this you are by definition "out of touch"

 

[jcwit]

Dale, what do you drive? Is it paid for or do you make payments?

 

[R.W.Dale]

Paid for and OLD

 

[22-rimfire]

We all fight battles. RW Dale, what you said about "undocumented immigrants" is exactly correct. This was not a major problem 30 years ago. Now with immigration enforcement the way it is, if they can do the job for 2/3 your price, they get it and either you get dumped quickly or slowly get nudged out the door. You choices are generally getting another job making less than the 2/3rds and that leads to no raises, and very tight family budgets.

 

[jcwit]

Yes yes they do. WE ALL DO

Be awesome and work yourself to death and have no family time or get replaced by an illegal willing to work for 2/3rds the money.

If YOU don't know this you are by definition "out of touch"

Like I've said for a few times, you have no idea what you speak of. May hap all of No. Indiana is out of touch! LOL

Google up our unemployment rate here. You want to work here? There is a job for you!

 

[chicharrones]

Unless you work for the government, you can generally forget getting a good factory job or a white collar job and working there for 30 years. The company may well be sold several times during that time period and the likelihood of being flushed are very high. They only thing folks have now are 401K plans or the equivalent. They're great, but for lower income folks, they can't contribute the % that the company might match because they are barely surviving day to day.

Now, back to guns.... I don't consider a reasonable number of guns as a luxury even at today's prices. If you hunt, you need suitable guns for the sport. I am starting to consider deer hunting a luxury expense.

Speaking of 401k plans, many employers have scaled back matching funds years ago to the point of zero. Having a generous employer provided retirement plan for blue collar workers in non-union areas is but a long lost dream.

The deer hunting thing sure seems to have hit near luxury to true luxury in many places for the city dwellers in states with limited public land. The hunting rifle can be the least expensive part of that equation.

 

[R.W.Dale]

We all fight battles. RW Dale, what you said about "undocumented immigrants" is exactly correct. This was not a major problem 30 years ago. Now with immigration enforcement the way it is, if they can do the job for 2/3 your price, they get it and either you get dumped quickly or slowly get nudged out the door.

Thank you

And this is assuming what you do can't be fit into a shipping container and done in China for not even a quarter of your pay.

It's a different world today.


If you want an indicator of just how bleak things are for the generations behind me (x) read about how the auto industry is in a mild state of turmoil because they cannot get younger people to buy new cars anymore because they cannot even afford the smallest stripper model economy models that meet the barest minimum gov't crash and emissions standards.

 

[chicharrones]

Central Air?

Is that a luxury in Indiana? It sure isn't considered a luxury in Texas and hasn't been for decades.

 

[jcwit]

Dale, You do not live here, you have no idea how the Amish live here, you have no idea of the workforce here, you have no idea of the hiring practices here, you have no idea of the wage scale here, you have no idea of the farming practices here.

You have no idea of little here in No. Indiana.

I'm done for tonight, as I must be up and on the go for my leisure activities tomorrow, life is grand. Time to spend the day at the range enjoying the "rich mans" sport. LOL