spartacus2002
Member
If your mother really loved you, she woulda bought you .45ACP instead
(sorry, couldn't resist)
Met an Anti yesterday.......
- Thread starter 45R
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If your mother really loved you, she woulda bought you .45ACP instead
(sorry, couldn't resist)
7.62FullMetalJacket
Member
I would take 9mm as a slight too
Pendragon
Member
Why were you wearing your hat at dinner?
Was it a picnic?
Was it a picnic?
45R
Member
I had to bite my tongue really hard last night at dinner. I was pretty close to taking a similar argument that HankB took. As she was talking I was thinking......Is she for real, I mean no person in their right mind would sit and watch a crime happen to a child when it is something they could have prevented. What self worth does this person have, is her self-esteem so low that she would let someone violate her.
Then the peace keeper jumped in and saved her from having to answer questions based on these thoughts. Hell 45Boo's sister has a major phobia of firearms and she even said that if someone was out to rape her and she had a gun. She wouldnt like it but she would use it.
After reading all of your responses it made me think. I dont think Stacy knows the difference between self-defense and murder. She stated that if it was up to her nobody would have guns but societies arent perfect. Guns make it easier for one man to kill another. She even stated that using guns for hunting and sport was BS but they are out there and its not a perfect world.
Maybe it was a relgious conflict?
Maybe its all the second hand pot smoke that she has inhaled?
Beer?
For her sake I hope she understands the true power that lies behind the right to bear arms and never becomes a victim because of her beliefs. Thank you all for leaving an opinion. This event was an eye opener for me. We as a whole have many battles to fight and "PostModern" views like this just makes it harder for all of us.
BTW I was wearing the hat because it was raining last night and I just never took it off. I was also wearing a Sig Arms jacket too.
Then the peace keeper jumped in and saved her from having to answer questions based on these thoughts. Hell 45Boo's sister has a major phobia of firearms and she even said that if someone was out to rape her and she had a gun. She wouldnt like it but she would use it.
After reading all of your responses it made me think. I dont think Stacy knows the difference between self-defense and murder. She stated that if it was up to her nobody would have guns but societies arent perfect. Guns make it easier for one man to kill another. She even stated that using guns for hunting and sport was BS but they are out there and its not a perfect world.
Maybe it was a relgious conflict?
Maybe its all the second hand pot smoke that she has inhaled?
Beer?
For her sake I hope she understands the true power that lies behind the right to bear arms and never becomes a victim because of her beliefs. Thank you all for leaving an opinion. This event was an eye opener for me. We as a whole have many battles to fight and "PostModern" views like this just makes it harder for all of us.
BTW I was wearing the hat because it was raining last night and I just never took it off.
I was also wearing a Sig Arms jacket too.Treylis
Member
I second the .45ACP vs. 9mm caliber snobbery. ;-)
I know I got a bunch of .45 for Christmas, myself.
I know I got a bunch of .45 for Christmas, myself.
Zundfolge
Member
I still contend that the vast majority of self anointed "pacifists" are liars who know they will never have to be tested. Unfortunately, when the time comes that they are tested, they will be unprepared.
The only true pacifists I've ever met where Mennonites (I was raised in a Mennonite Brethren church ... although my parents are not pacifists, in fact my father is a vet). But thats only a couple of people out of the dozens of self anointed pacifists I've known.
Now what's even sillier is a friend of a friend I used to hang out with who said he would be willing to defend his family (even kill) with a baseball bat or knife, but he'd rather die then use a gun
The only true pacifists I've ever met where Mennonites (I was raised in a Mennonite Brethren church ... although my parents are not pacifists, in fact my father is a vet). But thats only a couple of people out of the dozens of self anointed pacifists I've known.
Now what's even sillier is a friend of a friend I used to hang out with who said he would be willing to defend his family (even kill) with a baseball bat or knife, but he'd rather die then use a gun
My wife is SLOWLY turning from the same dark path of...for lack of a better word, stupidity. Now that we have an 18 month old daughter she does realise that, push coms to shove, she would use a gun. (She used to tell me that she would "beat them up" at 5'2" and the fact that everytime we 'wrestle' for fun she either gets hurt/pinned and tied up ) she realizes that is she is gonna to 'beat someone up' its only going to happen after she shoots them. She even asked me last week to take her shooting and doesn't complain about having a loaded gun in the house.......now if only I can get her to vote republican......
) she realizes that is she is gonna to 'beat someone up' its only going to happen after she shoots them. She even asked me last week to take her shooting and doesn't complain about having a loaded gun in the house.......now if only I can get her to vote republican......
Baba Louie
Member
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- Dec 26, 2002
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- 3,831
I've interacted with several people of that ilk and mindset in the past. Usually members of the female persuasion, a couple of men also. There's anti-gun types and then there's anti-violence types, sometimes they have both mindsets.
Usually younger, with no children, mostly college educated.
I enjoy discussing morals and ethics with them concerning life and the protection of same, focusing on the saving/preservation aspect in lieu of the taking of life... until we get into discussing hunting or... anti-hunting. But thats another hot topic for another thread, however closely related to this one.
On the other hand, I've met a couple of individuals, all men, who go to the opposite extreme; who, upon discussing firearms, talk about blowing holes in people, the bigger the better, etc.
I'd far rather discuss the merits of firearms with one than the other, in fact
I shun the latter, as they tend to make me angry with their bluster, and I fight back my desire of wanting to "GUN CONTROL" them.
But these same blustering idiots must be how the intelligentsia emotional types see me and my kind at times, and I'm sure that this attitude is what fosters busybody meddlin' do-gooders to enact legislation against all law-abiding gun owning citizens.
To the anti's, I usually add something to the effect that "No one I know, wants to take someone's life, nor do they want anyone to take theirs. My life and my familys lives are worthy of protecting, in my opinion. Thats how my parents raised me. Your parents obviously taught you differently and we'll just have to agree to disagree."
These are the same people who think nothing of calling for LE to come to their aid first and foremost... you know, men and women who wear GUNS to STOP CRIME. That's why we have Police.
small sigh...
However, I have always invited each anti out to go plinking in the desert. Several have gone along and enjoyed shooting .22's.
I just hope that they don't run for office some day. I'm thinking of a certain photo of Chuck Schumer with a huge grin on his face as he fires a hi-capacity 9MM "sporting" handgun... (thats just wrong!)
Some great replys in the posts above. I'll have to "borrow" some of them for future use.
My grandparents (mom's side... no sons, only daughters) were extremely anti-gun. They lived and worked for the Fed Govt in Wash DC all their lives and retired out in LV NV. Their home here was broken into one day many years ago. Upon my grandfathers death, my grandmother gave me, besides all of his library, one very small RG-(something) .22 that he'd bought. It had never been shot. Still had a full box of WW .22 lr in the cardboard box with the little thing. Sticker price of $39.95 still on the box, all the papers. Pristine. He never talked about it and really hated my passion for things that go bang.
I shot one cylinder (in his honor of course), cleaned it and put it away. Always wished he'd have bought a S&W 19...
Usually younger, with no children, mostly college educated.
I enjoy discussing morals and ethics with them concerning life and the protection of same, focusing on the saving/preservation aspect in lieu of the taking of life... until we get into discussing hunting or... anti-hunting. But thats another hot topic for another thread, however closely related to this one.
On the other hand, I've met a couple of individuals, all men, who go to the opposite extreme; who, upon discussing firearms, talk about blowing holes in people, the bigger the better, etc.
I'd far rather discuss the merits of firearms with one than the other, in fact
I shun the latter, as they tend to make me angry with their bluster, and I fight back my desire of wanting to "GUN CONTROL" them.
But these same blustering idiots must be how the intelligentsia emotional types see me and my kind at times, and I'm sure that this attitude is what fosters busybody meddlin' do-gooders to enact legislation against all law-abiding gun owning citizens.
To the anti's, I usually add something to the effect that "No one I know, wants to take someone's life, nor do they want anyone to take theirs. My life and my familys lives are worthy of protecting, in my opinion. Thats how my parents raised me. Your parents obviously taught you differently and we'll just have to agree to disagree."
These are the same people who think nothing of calling for LE to come to their aid first and foremost... you know, men and women who wear GUNS to STOP CRIME. That's why we have Police.
small sigh...
However, I have always invited each anti out to go plinking in the desert. Several have gone along and enjoyed shooting .22's.
I just hope that they don't run for office some day. I'm thinking of a certain photo of Chuck Schumer with a huge grin on his face as he fires a hi-capacity 9MM "sporting" handgun... (thats just wrong!)
Some great replys in the posts above. I'll have to "borrow" some of them for future use.
My grandparents (mom's side... no sons, only daughters) were extremely anti-gun. They lived and worked for the Fed Govt in Wash DC all their lives and retired out in LV NV. Their home here was broken into one day many years ago. Upon my grandfathers death, my grandmother gave me, besides all of his library, one very small RG-(something) .22 that he'd bought. It had never been shot. Still had a full box of WW .22 lr in the cardboard box with the little thing. Sticker price of $39.95 still on the box, all the papers. Pristine. He never talked about it and really hated my passion for things that go bang.
I shot one cylinder (in his honor of course), cleaned it and put it away. Always wished he'd have bought a S&W 19...
harpethriver
Member
Since there is no mention of any religious objection by this young lady and she doesn't seem to hold anything back, it is supposition to inject the religious angle in to her argument. I think we can agree she has no real thought process going on here, rather she is exhibiting the ramblings of a brain-washed individual. It appears she represents the "collective", that being the cumulative rants of the intellectual elitists, comprised primarily of the media and our educational system, who seem bent on a non-religious agenda. I'll bet when asked her race she marks the box "other", and fills it in with the word Borg.
artherd
member
This should probally be in it's own thread.
But one of the most useful things I got out of catholic High School was a furthuring of education on the concept of Nonviolent Resistance.
It is NOT about becoming a victim! It is very much about POWER, and an effective way to put POWER back in the hands of THE PEOPLE.
Let me explain:
This is a challenge. Society at the time regarded the right hand as a tool of insult.
But it regarded the left hand as unclean (you literally whiped your ass with it.) .
Turning the other cheek to a slap meant the insultor had two options.
1) employ the left hand and be known as a disgusting degenerate.
2) do nothing, and now the man you slapped has subdued you into TOTAL IN-ACTION through sheer willpower alone. You just got royally owned.
There were huge penalties for collecting more than justly awarded. Think of it today. What if some dickweed sued you for looking at him funny? Say he was awarded $50,000. What if he was found with $100k in cash, your TV, car stereo, and jewlery and an extortion note was found in your house? Hmmm?
A Roman soldier, at the time, could conscript a pesant and have them carry their pack for a mile. One mile. EXACTLY ONE MILE. No furthur. Very strict.
Imagine an over-zelous volenteer, "Oh, I'll carry it furthur good sir! I love to be your whipping boy, that's right!" And imagine the soldier now reduced to *begging* the pesant to give him back his pack, lest his seargent get wind of this and whip him.
This is probally more fluff that King James added to what he thought were passages that would pacify the people. In reality, these non-violent actions EMPOWERED the people.
Non-voilence, properly used, is a VERY effective tool that can be used to re-arange society in a way more conductive to peaceful free life. It will never work against a firing squad. But it may work in instances when people respond en-masse, and the jails would be full. So the government could decide a law was not worth enforcing anymore. (say they outlawed blue-jeans. 100,000 jeans wearers standing on the lawn of the whitehouse peacefully being arrested could work.)
But one of the most useful things I got out of catholic High School was a furthuring of education on the concept of Nonviolent Resistance.
It is NOT about becoming a victim! It is very much about POWER, and an effective way to put POWER back in the hands of THE PEOPLE.
Let me explain:
This is a challenge. Society at the time regarded the right hand as a tool of insult.
But it regarded the left hand as unclean (you literally whiped your ass with it.) .
Turning the other cheek to a slap meant the insultor had two options.
1) employ the left hand and be known as a disgusting degenerate.
2) do nothing, and now the man you slapped has subdued you into TOTAL IN-ACTION through sheer willpower alone. You just got royally owned.
There were huge penalties for collecting more than justly awarded. Think of it today. What if some dickweed sued you for looking at him funny? Say he was awarded $50,000. What if he was found with $100k in cash, your TV, car stereo, and jewlery and an extortion note was found in your house? Hmmm?
A Roman soldier, at the time, could conscript a pesant and have them carry their pack for a mile. One mile. EXACTLY ONE MILE. No furthur. Very strict.
Imagine an over-zelous volenteer, "Oh, I'll carry it furthur good sir! I love to be your whipping boy, that's right!" And imagine the soldier now reduced to *begging* the pesant to give him back his pack, lest his seargent get wind of this and whip him.
This is probally more fluff that King James added to what he thought were passages that would pacify the people. In reality, these non-violent actions EMPOWERED the people.
Non-voilence, properly used, is a VERY effective tool that can be used to re-arange society in a way more conductive to peaceful free life. It will never work against a firing squad. But it may work in instances when people respond en-masse, and the jails would be full. So the government could decide a law was not worth enforcing anymore. (say they outlawed blue-jeans. 100,000 jeans wearers standing on the lawn of the whitehouse peacefully being arrested could work.)
Diggler
Member
When you turn your left cheek to your opponent, you're just setting yourself up to deliver a powerful right hook.
Nazirite
Member
I remember a quote from a movie. I think it goes “ The only way for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing.†Personally, if you are unwilling to protect your family your as guilty as those that seek to do them harm.
Zundfolge
Member
A quote from a MOVIE!?
Hollywood and the public schools are ruining America
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
--Edmund Burke (1729 - 1797)
Hollywood and the public schools are ruining America
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
--Edmund Burke (1729 - 1797)
Nazirite
Member
That's just where I heard it, didn't know where it came from.
sturmruger
Member
This poor girl, I feel sorry for her. I hope no one ever tries to do her or her family harm. I think if she was truly getting raped her fighting instincts would take over and she would wish she had a gun!!
I too have met people like this. They just make me shake my head and thank the Lord I was brought up in a family that believes in personal resposibility.
I too have met people like this. They just make me shake my head and thank the Lord I was brought up in a family that believes in personal resposibility.
I don't think it has to do with personal responsibility. There are a significant number of people who are very responsible, yet are anti-gun. My wife comes to mind here.
Our society in general has created a fantasy that many buy into. It goes like this: You are safe. You are safe in your home, car, mall, school.
This fantasy is comforting to many who don't/can't deal mentally with the FACT that nowhere is safe. They pretend, like my wife, that because they live in a low crime area, and avoid "bad neighborhoods" that personal safety isn't a concern.
Our society in general has created a fantasy that many buy into. It goes like this: You are safe. You are safe in your home, car, mall, school.
This fantasy is comforting to many who don't/can't deal mentally with the FACT that nowhere is safe. They pretend, like my wife, that because they live in a low crime area, and avoid "bad neighborhoods" that personal safety isn't a concern.
chrisb507
Member
But the fact is that most (or the majority of) people ARE safe, in most places, most of the time. Why does someone need a gun to go from their safe suburban home to their safe suburban mall or their safe suburban job? I mean, nearly everything is safe: driving, going to the movies, shopping, eating out, you name it.
The problem is nothing is safe all the time for everyone. How can you get an anti to understand that? How can you get someone to understand preparedness when they see no need to be prepared?
Take wearing a seat belt. Most folks do, even though they feel "safe" in a car. Plus, it's easy to put on, takes only a second, and doesn't hurt anyone. How can you get an anti to see the paralell to a CCW?
I wonder how many antis there are in UNsafe environments. I'll bet there are fewer...But I don't want to move to a bad neighborhood just so my wife's views on guns will improve.
The problem is nothing is safe all the time for everyone. How can you get an anti to understand that? How can you get someone to understand preparedness when they see no need to be prepared?
Take wearing a seat belt. Most folks do, even though they feel "safe" in a car. Plus, it's easy to put on, takes only a second, and doesn't hurt anyone. How can you get an anti to see the paralell to a CCW?
I wonder how many antis there are in UNsafe environments. I'll bet there are fewer...But I don't want to move to a bad neighborhood just so my wife's views on guns will improve.
Penforhire
Member
True pacifism is rare. I totally respect that choice. Out of hundreds of people I've talked to enough to know well, one, maybe two, are real pacifists.
Most of the time the anti's are NOT true pacifists. Those dufuses are worth the argument and it is easy to work them into a corner. The end result is a clear understanding that their position is purely emotional, 'guns are evil' lacks proper logic, and/or lemming-like behavior (the Hollywood anti's).
Most of the time the anti's are NOT true pacifists. Those dufuses are worth the argument and it is easy to work them into a corner. The end result is a clear understanding that their position is purely emotional, 'guns are evil' lacks proper logic, and/or lemming-like behavior (the Hollywood anti's).
7.62FullMetalJacket
Member
Do you have a fire extinguisher at home? At work? Have you EVER used it? Do you feel safe since fires do not spontaneously occur?
Or is the fire extinguisher there because, should a fire start, you have the tools necessary to extinguish the fire?
Think of CCW as a "threat extinguisher."
Or is the fire extinguisher there because, should a fire start, you have the tools necessary to extinguish the fire?
Think of CCW as a "threat extinguisher."
Zundfolge
Member
Don't worry Nazirite, I was just giving you a bit of good natured ribbing
Eskimo Jim
Member
Hank B that's priceless!!!
7.62, you're right about a CCW weapon being a 'threat extinguisher"
I've met antis and have tried to reason with them. When they won't listen to reason, then sometimes I have some fun with them.
If they say "Guns are bad because they kill people", I ask them about cars, planes, skill saws etc. Are they bad because they kill or injure people too? I try tp trip them up in a double standard. Sometimes I actually see the lights click on behind their eyes like they are getting it.
45R, how old was the young lady that was anti-gun?
As an aside, give some thought to the concept of 'Age of Reason". This the age when someone really knows the difference between good and bad etc etc. Some say that the age of reason is somewhere around 16-18. The more 16-18 year olds that I meet, the more I think that the age of reason is somewhere around 26.
-Jim
7.62, you're right about a CCW weapon being a 'threat extinguisher"
I've met antis and have tried to reason with them. When they won't listen to reason, then sometimes I have some fun with them.
If they say "Guns are bad because they kill people", I ask them about cars, planes, skill saws etc. Are they bad because they kill or injure people too? I try tp trip them up in a double standard. Sometimes I actually see the lights click on behind their eyes like they are getting it.
45R, how old was the young lady that was anti-gun?
As an aside, give some thought to the concept of 'Age of Reason". This the age when someone really knows the difference between good and bad etc etc. Some say that the age of reason is somewhere around 16-18. The more 16-18 year olds that I meet, the more I think that the age of reason is somewhere around 26.
-Jim
cidirkona
Member
Hampsters and Rats...
Do any of you ever find it extreeeemely frusterating sometimes?
Roommates of friends saying "Don't come into my house with that thing," and the such. I usually reply with "You're safer with it in here than it being locked in the car, but it's your house, your rules."
-Colin
Do any of you ever find it extreeeemely frusterating sometimes?
Roommates of friends saying "Don't come into my house with that thing," and the such. I usually reply with "You're safer with it in here than it being locked in the car, but it's your house, your rules."
-Colin
atek3
Member
I used to live in a UC berkeley student co-op with a ´no weapons´ policy. I had a kind of ´don´t ask don´t tell´understanding with the leadership of the house. I got accosted by an anti while reading shotgun news in the common area, something about, "who would want to own those evil things" and we argued for a while. Arriving at the same "she would never under any circumstances hurt an attacker, and thinks it is immoral to do so". Whatever. I took 5 housemates to front sight for the free Uzi course and about 12 housemates to the local range for some "hands on education" and was rewarded with about 12 new gunnies. When I moved out I walked with two long cases one labeled winchester and one of the leftists at the house said "you know, I feel less safe without out you in this house any more." Not kidding either. A few weeks later the house had a violent sketcher and he mentioned he REALLY wished I was around.
atek3
atek3
cidirkona
Member
Well, at least there are plenty of fence riders out there that we can still convince the safety of our tools! The only cost is some ammo and lane rentals every once in a while. Sometimes people try to pay me for the ammo they've used, but I just tell them they have to let me try out whatever gun they get first.
Took a new shooter out last night - he didn't care too much for the glock but really liked my little firestorm .380 -- said he couldn't keep the muzzle down with the glock. For never shooting before the kid had a decent grouping (4 inches at 7 yards).
-Colin
Took a new shooter out last night - he didn't care too much for the glock but really liked my little firestorm .380 -- said he couldn't keep the muzzle down with the glock. For never shooting before the kid had a decent grouping (4 inches at 7 yards).
-Colin
GigaBuist
Member
Man, if I had a box of ammo for every time a fence-sitting friend said "What do you NEED another gun for?" and in the same breath mentions that they're coming to MY house if SHTF (ie: local terrorist strike).
They kinda get it, but there's still the knee-jerk reaction when they see a picture of an AR or AK.
- Status
