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Raccoon whips my 2 dogs after being shot out of a tree and falling 30 feet!

Discussion in 'Hunting' started by Sal Mann, Jul 14, 2017.

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  1. dh1633pm

    dh1633pm Member

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    As a kid I had a big black lab. His name was Sarge. He could put a coon out of his misery in no time flat. I have two labs now and they both would be helpless against even a cat. Big babies they are. But I still remember with fondness my big black lab and his ability to kill critters. Wood chucks, coons, skunks, rabbits, and the occasional loss to a hedge hog. I used him to hunt anything, except what a lab was bred to hunt. Enjoyed every minute of it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
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  2. MtnCreek

    MtnCreek Member

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    A dog that doesn't know what it's doing is libel to get tore up by a coon. A hound that's been there - done that will go strait in a grab it and shake and crush the life out of it in no time. Doesn't matter if it's a small female walker or a gritty male redbone.

    Someone mentioned a coon looking away from the light. Don't shine a bright light up the tree till you've exhausted all other options. Turn the light down very low to try to get his eye. You can also shake the light and make squalling sounds to get him to look. A bright light will just make him look strait up.
     
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  3. DM~

    DM~ Member

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    We use to have a collie shepherd that killed several big raccoons...

    Them days, dogs were hunters and still had game killing instincts, not like the sissy of today! lol

    Generally, coons like to get dogs into water, where they will get on the dogs head and drown them...

    DM
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017 at 8:45 AM
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  4. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

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    There seems to be a lot of lore and speculation getting passed around this thread, and not a lot of experience. I can confirm after hunting coons with hounds for over 25yrs, with certainty, a few things to confirm or dispel some of the legendary aire floating around coons and dogs:

    1) Hounds are used every night during legal seasons to track and kill coons around the country. However, they were bred to track and bay up coons, not to kill them. They kill in teams, and developing that technique takes training and collaboration among hounds. Hounds kill by working together to stretch out the coon, one or more dogs hitch onto the hind legs and hold fast, while one dog works to the neck and ends up asphyxiating the coon. Too many hounds on a fight hinders the process, with good hounds, two or at most 3 are as effective as anything. We catch our dogs at the tree and rotate on the fights whenever we hunt with too many hounds at once. Similarly, when most hounds catch a coon on the ground, rather than in a tree, they'll bay up and cut in and out, not committing to the fight - this is a good instinct, as it keeps them safe and healthy, and lets the hunters do their job, which is to put a bullet in the coon to give the hound the advantage. It's very common for a shot coon to get the best of 2 untrained hounds.

    2) Inexperienced hunters let their dogs get torn up. Whether that's by hunting an under trained dog, or putting the dog at a disadvantage. If your dogs don't know how to fight, you have to expect to be in on the action. I've hunted many nights just by myself with one dog. As I described above, the throat dog needs a partner holding the back legs to keep the coon from fending them off of the throat - when hunting alone, when the coon hits the ground, the dog hits first, then the hunter needs to help hold the coon for a quick finish kill. Ears on hounds do get torn up, and often lips, but if you have dogs getting cut up by coons very often, you either have poor hounds, or you're a poor hunter. None of the dogs pictured below have ever had stitches, but they've killed thousands of coons over the years.

    3) Any animal of sufficient weight which can climb in water will drown a dog. Coons and bobcats are just better at it than some other species - badgers, fox, and coyotes can't climb, and opossums often aren't heavy enough to weigh down a hound sized dog. However, despite the popular lore, it's not a matter of intelligence on part of the coon - Any animal finding itself being pulled under water will try to climb on top of anything they find - when that is your dog, the coon ends up on top. My sister nearly drowned me when we were kids, she was struggling in the deep end of the pool, and then when I went to her aid, she climbed onto my shoulders and clung to my head, making it almost impossible to swim. It's an instinctual panic response, not a strategy. I've "gone swimming" in ponds, rivers, and creeks many times rescuing my dogs over the years. Key tip - kick off your muck boots before jumping in, and be sure your phone is waterproof. (Cobra and Motorola walkie-talkies ARE pond diving resistant, FYI).

    4) Many Terrier breeds will kill coons outright one on one. We've ran Jack Russel and Patterdale Terriers for many years, they tend to walk with us hunters most of the night, rather than legging it out with the hounds. In the pics below, there's a "red head" b!tch of mine as a puppy - she's now too old to hunt, but still lounging around the farm. Her first kill was the packrat pictured when she was about 4-5ish months old, I was carrying her in my pocket while we hunted, and had let her down to "potty," she ran off to the creek and ran up a ruckus, by the time I found her, she had killed a rat almost her weight. She would go on to kill many coons on her own. The photo of the terriers on the tailgate were all killed by the terriers in the foundation under a barn. The two black/brown Patterdale's pictured weren't as "ballistic" as the redhead and her little black eared sister, as those two fought more like a pair of hounds - they'd work together with the chocolate & white one taking the backleg, and the black with tan legs one going for the throat. The terriers go into holes, and either kill the animal and drag it out, or get it so fighting mad that it chases them out where the hunter can aid in dispatch. The sharper, finer teeth, and proportionately more powerful jaws of the terriers do tear up hides, however, so a guy doesn't want to let a terrier gnaw on a coon for more than a few seconds after it has expired. A guy does have to watch out for his terriers, however, as a white Jack in a wheat field or a dark Patterdale on snow cover are easy targets for owls.

    5) Many non-hound breeds are dumb enough to dive on a coon. This is especially true for working and herding breeds, as their "prey drive" has been developed as a part of their breeding process. I saw a Chow mix and a Dobey used in a couple posts above - I've used a Chow in the past, just because we owned them and "Poke" (named after the interaction between Gus and Lori-darling on Lonesome Dove) loved mangling any farm cats who jumped into his pen so we gave him a run. I had a Rottweiler which made quick work of coons as well - we'd take these "kill dogs" along when hunting with the terriers during the day in wood piles and under barns, the little dogs go in, and if anything but a dog comes out, the big dogs pounce and end the fight. The down side - big and powerful dogs like these do a he11 of a lot of damage to hides and bones inside, making it a bit more difficult to skin them for money. They're also not particular about species so they'll go after anything small and furry, and they also tend to be possessive of the quarry, so they'll fight the other dogs.

    6) There are LOTS of nasty, nasty things which coons carry. Ticks, fleas, and mange are the least of a guys worries - various worms are very common, even though it is difficult for the dogs to pick them up, unless the hunter irresponsibly lets the dogs chew on or eat parts of the coon afterwards. One of the most disturbing of which is Trichinosis (Trichinella round worm infection), which lives in and around the muscle of the coon - so when you slice around the ankles and wrists to skin, the worms spew out like spaghetti from a ziplock bag. Of course, since the worms are under the skin, it's easier for the hounds to become infected. Coon Dog Paralysis, or Polyradiculoneuritis was a new one on me, but we lost one of our Jack's to it years ago, some sort of nerve disorder which occurs after a coon bite, any time he'd get too excited, like a coon fight, he'd lock up and not be able to walk for a while. His back legs stopped working right shortly after, which is when we took him to the vet - it's suspected to be either a viral or bacterial infection, but as far as I know, there's no confirmed cause other than correlation to coon bites, and no known cure. Our dog died of respiratory arrest, whereas I've heard other dogs will recover after a few days or weeks. Our vet suggested, however, if a dog were diagnosed with it, they shouldn't be hunted any more even after they recover, because they'd be more susceptible to recurrence. Heartworms, tapeworms, hook worms, round worms, whip worms, giardia, coccidia, baylisascaria... Coons can be fat and happy, and riddled with worms, bacteria, viruses, and protozoa which will be detrimental or even deadly for dogs. Never let a dog eat coon feces or carcasses, or chew on a coon carcass for too long after they kill one. There are also plenty of things which humans can contract as well, so watch your own intake.

    7) A coon hunter who has been at it very long has seen amazing, and sometimes disturbing things in the creek. He'll also be sure footed and be able to walk any mall-walking soccer mom out of her shoes, even carrying his beer belly.

    8) Few things are more exhilarating than dumping the dogs on a hot scent, or hearing a striking hound break the silence of a still night.

    Below are several pictures from some of my experiences hunting coons with dogs over the years. My family and group of hunters predominantly hunts with treeing walker hounds, and of course, our Jack & Patterdale terriers. In our hayday when we run 3-4 nights each week, we'd hunt over 200 coon a season with the dogs, on lighter years, we might only go out once a week and bring in 50 or so. My son went on his first trip when he was about 2 1/2 yrs old - which of course, does require staying up far past normal bed time. The picture of hides thawing in the sun was about a month into the season with the hounds, getting ready to go to the furbuyer - if memory serves, there's 43 coons laid out there. Again, the photo taken with the terriers on the tailgate were all killed by the terriers, without bigger kill dogs or hounds in tow. The photo is at night, but the coons were taken during daylight hours under a grainery, finding the coons sleeping in their "den."

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  5. Captcurt

    Captcurt Member

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    One of the worst fights that I have ever seen was 2 grown pups against a 25# boar coon. We tied the older dogs up, cut the tree because the coon was in a hole, and then turned the pups loose on it. Those two dogs were bitten everywhere but the bottom of their feet. The coon finally bailed and made it to the lake. Luckily we caught the pups before they made it to the water or I am sure that Ol' Rocky would drowned one or both of them.
     
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  6. Sunray

    Sunray Member

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    Rocky is quite capable of tearing a cat or small dog to pieces. I've seen 'em hit by cars and not be killed.
    "...my 2 dogs..." Get 'em checked for rabies.
    "...my feeder..." As in bird feeder? A screw top is nothing to Rocky. Spent a week collecting worms for a fishing trip, long ago. Put 'em in 2 or 3 screw top jars. Camped on an island and lost all 3 to Rocky the first night. Next night they wanted to come into the tent for the food we had.
     
  7. CraigC
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    CraigC Member

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    A good sized coon will whoop the piss out of most dogs, even those many times their size. A really big, old coon, might as well be a bear!
     
  8. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    I caught another one today in my live trap. I've lost count of the number of coons I've trap in that thing and they just keep coming. I get rid of 'em because they trip my hog trap and mess with my corn feeder, and if they get up front, they'll kill chickens. They're BIG time chicken killers, worse than the coyotes around here because they're so danged smart. I built a "chicken tractor", a pen I can move around the yard and garden off season to fertilize my garden. I built it with chicken wire. Danged coons got to it, one would scare the chickens to one side of the pen, the other would be on that side of the pen, grab a head and rip it off the chicken. I found my chickens all decapitated. That's when I decided to finally go to war and bought the trap. LOL I armored that chicken tractor with a finer mess wire which stopped the decapitations.

    Anyway, the one this morning was trapped by my feeder. They've been messing with the feeder lately. My black lab, Molly, is a GREAT retriever and loves to hunt doves and ducks. But, she ain't much of a coon dog, thinks she is, though. She will bark, growl, go nuts trying to get at the coon in the trap. I thought about maybe turning this one lose this morning as it was a little one. But, NAH, I don't need the vet bills and I don't wanna get that danged close to a mad coon. :rofl: So, I just whipped out my SR22 and fed the vultures. The vultures around here love me. :D

    I've got wild game cook books with recipes for coon. I know guys that eat 'em. I just ain't into it. When I was trapping 'em 36 years ago, I butchered one and put it in the freezer. I never did do anything with it, tossed it. I just figure I ain't that desperate. But, if it ever come s to the zombie apocalypses and I don't have any more hog or deer meat, I can live on the danged things, I reckon. :rofl:
     
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  9. Panfisher

    Panfisher Member

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    By far the most viscious fight I ever witnessed was between my first gem an shepard and a mid sized raccoon. The coon was in the barn and old Bo had him backed up into an old metal barrel. I suspect I siced him on the coon, but didn't know it was gonna get midevil. Old Bo was a good dog but had a temper when he got mad or hurt, after the first clash between thm in the barrel I tried to drag him off and he was not about to leave, when the blood and fur quit flying Bo was stI'll ravaging in the dead coon trying to make it come back to life so h could kill it again maybe. He was shaking and took me a few minutes to calm him down enough to get him away. Had to take him to a garden hose for clean up and examination. Didn't look too bad, but by the next day he was swollen up and didn't get around much for a few days. But dang did he hate coons for the rest of his life.
     
  10. witchhunter

    witchhunter Member

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    I ran hounds for over 20 years for bear and mountain lion. Registered Blueticks. When a hound fights bears for a living, he will kill a coon in a hot minute. A coon will try to grab a hound and bite him. A bear dog will bite back, crunch and that is that. A big bobcat? Now that is a fight for even a pair of good hounds. Dogs are a lot like people, some will rise to the occasion and some will do just enough to get by. On two seperate occasions, I saw my dogs pull a bear off a tree that it was trying to climb to get away from them. He knew it was on and crackin' right about then...
     
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  11. DM~

    DM~ Member

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    It always amazes me how many coons there are around here...

    I kill 30 to 40 a year, sometimes as many as 50 and they keep on coming!

    They are dead all along the hi-ways around here too...

    DM
     
  12. CraigC
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    CraigC Member

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    Nothing will clean out a chicken house quicker than coons. I raised chickens in Florida and we had a lot of coons but nothing like when I moved up here. I got fed up with feeding chickens and feed to the local coons, who will find any weaknesses in your pen, that I built a rifle strictly for the purpose of going out at midnight. I killed hundreds of coons and possums those first few years and lost a lot of chickens before I finally sealed it up tight. I got married in 2011 and moved to a more suburban area and here our problem is skunks. I killed 20 skunks last year within 100yds of the house.

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  13. entropy

    entropy Member

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    Looks just like my son's coon huntin' 10/22! He just has a different red dot and light on it.
     
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  14. Sal Mann
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    Sal Mann Contributing Member

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    My dogs are better now, just resting. I'm definitely using a 12 ga. for my next run in with a coon.
     
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  15. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    Yeah, I've never seen a coon population like we have here. I got another one today and have no doubt I'll get another one tomorrow. I'm only running ONE TRAP. The vultures clean 'em up out by the back fence and there's a pile of bones there, now.
     
  16. huntsman

    huntsman Member

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    12 gauge for killing varmint, .22lr for harvesting pelts.
     
  17. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    I use a .22 pistol or even my mini revolver for coons in the trap. Occasionally I've used my .38 I always have in my strong side pocket, but it seems overkill, 158 grain +P JHP.
     
  18. dh1633pm

    dh1633pm Member

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    From reading all your posts, I found that I wasn't much of a racoon expert by any means. I did seem to learn that dogs that crunch to kill do better with racoons. My lab was a cruncher. The neighbor invited him in their house once because of his kind nature. He grabbed their cat by the head and then "crunch". They yelled at my dad and he told them if they didn't want the dog to kill their cat, they shouldn't have invited him into the house. Funny he never touched our cat. I remember one day he got into a fight with a medium sized racoon behind the house. It was over quickly. I also remember taking him on the Golf Course near where we lived. There were loads of wood chucks there. I worked for the greenskeeper and we were always smoke bombing them. Smoke bomb down the hole and then fill it in. Look for smoke coming out the other hole and then fill that one too.

    Anyhow the dog was with me and we trapped one between it (the dog and I) and the hole. Wood Chucks go aggressive when you do that. It charged him and bit his nose and wouldn't let go. My dog shook him off and then caught him before he hit the ground. Then crunch. Dead wood chuck. Sarge the lab that thought he was a hound.
     
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  19. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    My lab is trained to have a "soft mouth". I'd prefer to keep her that way because I don't want my ducks or doves chewed up. :D She's very good. I had a chicken pen open one day and there was an Inca dove in there eating the scratch. Molly saw the dove, ran over there into the pen and grabbed the dove and brought it to me. :rofl: The dove was unharmed other than some dog slobber. when she gave me the bird, it turned it loose and it flew off. She looked at me with a critial eye, like "WHAT did you let it go, for?" :rofl: I explained to her it wasn't dove season, but I'm not sure she bought that.
     
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  20. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    Another coon today. I brought the trap in since we're going fishing tomorrow for a few days, won't get to check it.

    Hmm, maybe I could grind the bones up for fertilizer. Didn't they do that with bison?
     
  21. Blue68f100

    Blue68f100 Member

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    Coons are a constant battle around here. There into my feeders as well as my peach trees. I use the Duke's Traps that works very well. Since I got the traps I've trapped over 15 this year and shot 8 more. The only way to stop a coon quickly is a brain shot. I hit one with my 223R (at night) that blew half it's innards out and that thing still ran off before I could get down there. Find him the next morning once the sun came out, 75 yrds from where I shot him. I have the varmint guards on my my feeders, but that does not stop them from trying. I've got one other neighbor that's started trapping them too, been tearing up his feeders.
     
  22. Skoghund

    Skoghund Member

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    Jagdterriers are special. For many years i had a long legged Jack Russel terrier who had the same attitude as a Jagdterrier. He was instant death on foxes and cats. He always saw bigger dogs as no problem. Love a dog with character.
     
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  23. Patocazador

    Patocazador Member

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    I have a Boykin spaniel retriever who retrieves birds and small game with a soft mouth. However, she draws the line at coons and hogs.
    I wounded this mama coon with a blackpowder shotgun and she dove into the palmettos and finished her off. Then I dispatched her 2 young-uns.

    [​IMG] Croom Coons 9web.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017 at 5:10 PM
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  24. hdwhit

    hdwhit Member

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    Most dogs would be.
     
  25. redneck2

    redneck2 Member

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    I had a friend that was a hard core coon hunter. He always used a .22 Mag. There were times that a .22 LR would bounce off their head
     

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