Seeking info on open carry

[frankie_the_yankee]

IMHO it blares "Shoot me first!"

Yup. Or, "Snatch me from behind!"

 

[yesit'sloaded]

Or you could be tricky and carry an airsoft gun in your OC holster and have a real gun concealed.

 

[frankie_the_yankee]

Or you could be tricky and carry an airsoft gun in your OC holster and have a real gun concealed.

No good. If the BG snatches it you couldn't shoot him in self defense because YOU KNOW that it is an airsoft and not a "real" gun. So you'd just have to let him take it.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

Yes, but you get the best of both worlds. You have the deterrent that you are armed while at the same time retaining the element of surprise.

 

[ace1001]

When choosing to carry any weapon you must:
Know how to safely use and carry it.
Become proficiant with it, be able to hit where you aim.
Be resolved to use it if prudent.
Resolve that NOBODY except a LEO can be allowed to take away your weapon.
Decide to be situationally aware at all times.

About 100 LEOs have their weapons taken from them each year and almost half of them are then killed by their own gun. It is no joke. Study Krav Mega. It is very practical, no dance, no religion, just practical moves with NO rules, NO fouls.

There is a lack of training specifically for warding off a firarm snatch. Most police training and dash cam video I have seen, shows the officer in a wrestling match, trying to hold the gun in the holster. This is a losing scenerio IMO. A quick offensive strike that gives you distance and time to draw your weapon makes more sense to me. One, it is not the expected response. If someone goes for my gun he is beginning a deadly assault. It does not matter who owns the weapon, he is trying to USE it. My response would be quick and ruthless. As gun owners, we should make it clear that this is not the place for joking around.
In this age where if you snease too close to an LEO it is considered assault, and it is tacked on to every charge like punctuation, trying to snatch someones gun is the beginning move to a death struggle. Ace

 

[Mainsail]

Guns are SO magical that they possess the ability to cause crime by their mere presence. It’s disappointing to see Sara’s logic being used by gun owners.

 

[Browns Fan]

I have to agree with Frankie, OC is not a very smart (I am trying to take the High Road on this) option! I dont have a badge on my chest, nor is my name Matt Dillion.

I have CCWed for 10 yrs, never have I ever considered such a thing, except at an IDPA/IPSC match.

 

[JohnKSa]

Guns are SO magical that they possess the ability to cause crime by their mere presence.

There are certainly ways for a person to make crime easy for criminals--that's not debatable and should be obvious to anyone with a bare minimum of common sense.

Examples:

• Leaving high-value items in the front yard overnight.
• Wearing expensive jewelry and taking a stroll through a bad part of town after dark.
• Driving a very nice car and parking it with the windows down.
• Flashing a large wad of cash when you make a purchase.
• Being careless with your SSN.

By your logic, all of these things are situations where inanimate objects are "causing crime". The fact is that it's NOT the objects CAUSING CRIME, it's the OWNER who is CREATING OPPORTUNITIES for criminals.

Before anyone goes off on a tangent, I am NOT repeat NOT saying that the owner is responsible for any crimes that result, just saying that we can make it easy for those who want to commit crimes or we can make it hard.

 

[ace1001]

I OC because I have no interest in "little" guns and wearing jeans and shirt I would have little chance to CC. 95% of my life is rural but I think a snatcher would be the one suprised to find how aggressively I defend my weapon. The only rule is, there aint no rules. Ace

 

[frankie_the_yankee]

I OC because I have no interest in "little" guns and wearing jeans and shirt I would have little chance to CC. 95% of my life is rural but I think a snatcher would be the one suprised to find how aggressively I defend my weapon. The only rule is, there aint no rules.

Ace

Ace, you may well be a "hard target". Your size or appearance may deter snatch attempts. Or your training and skill may defeat them should anyone try.

All I am saying is that other things being equal, open carry presents an opportunity to a criminal that concealed carry does not. And this is particularly true in crowded urban environments.

And common sense says that if an opportunity is out there (think a nice car left unlocked with the keys in it) someone will be tempted to take advantage of it.

For those of us with less physical ability than you, or less training than you, or who frequent urban areas more often than you, concealed carry is a better choice IMO.

 

[Clyde Nocar]

US Concealed Carry Assoc. AKA USCCA

Anyone a member? Good or Bad?

 

[Maximum1]

"Seeking info on open carry"

Why would anyone want to open carry? To me it makes NO SENSE, period.

 

[WayneConrad]

I think the thread title is incorrect...

In any case, we evidently have a strong faith that open carry presents a clear danger to the carrier, because the possibility of a gun snatch is so very high. Evidence supporting that belief is less than a handfull of cases known to us where a gun snatch has happened to someone not engaged in law-enforcement activities. Evidence contradicting that belief are the many testimonies we have on here from people who open carry.

Faith is belief impervious to evidence. It's ok to have it, but please don't beat us nonbelievers about the head. It ain't polite.

 

[crebralfix]

OC with a group as a political statement and public awareness.

CC at all other times.

 

[JesseL]

I think the thread title is incorrect...

I agree, I think this thread is mostly about confirmation bias. It's funny how many people in this thread would give more credence to their own fearful speculation about the supposed dangers of open carry than they would to the people who have actually practiced open carry on a regular basis for many years.

I'll say this again, just to be sure no one misunderstands. I have open carried a lot, for many years, and the most negative consequence I have experienced was a few slightly hostile words from an ignorant old man.

• I have never had my gun snatched or had anyone attempt to do so.
• I have never had the police called, much less been tackled by police officers.
• I have never heard anyone scream in terror at the sight of an exposed weapon.
• I have never been asked to leave any establishment.
• I have never been the first one targeted in a robbery.

Conversely I have had numerous positive experiences precipitated by open carry.

• I have had several positive and polite conversations (mostly in checkout lines) about the legality of carry, open and concealed.
• I have had several compliments on my carry piece.
• I have had many police officers give me a polite smile and nod.
• I have had at least one person comment that my family looked very well protected.
• I have had many sketchy looking people begin to approach me, notice my sidearm, and decide they had other places to be.

My experiences are the norm for people who open carry in this area. If you feel that open carry is stupid or looking for trouble, please consider my real world experience in the matter before you berate my actions.

 

[Mainsail]

If you feel that open carry is stupid or looking for trouble, please consider my real world experience in the matter before you berate my actions.

I think you hit the nail on the head with those few words. It seems that most of the people who (vehemently) oppose open carry fall into one of two groups.

One group lives in some sort of post apocalyptic tacti-hell. Everyone they see is a thief, rapist, and murderer. Their neck is sore from constantly swiveling it back and for scanning for potential criminals, all of whom possess a zombie-like mentality. These criminals do not have the normal sense of self preservation, and would run a city block to pick up a hissing and smoking grenade just to have it. If they see your gun, they are willing to die to get the chance to take it.

The other group doesn’t want to deter a criminal, they want some thug to try to rob them so they can whip out their concealed gun and say, “Do you feel lucky punk? Well, do ya?”

Instead of giving weight to the arguments of the people who actually do openly carry, they waft into some tactical fantasyland where anything that supports their view is heavy, and anything that doesn’t is light. You cannot use logic to debate with someone who refuses to hear common sense.

 

[JohnKSa]

It seems that most of the people who (vehemently) oppose open carry fall into one of two groups.

This is the problem. I don't see a lot of VEHEMENT opposition to open carry on this thread or on any other.

I see some logical arguments posed and some evidence provided indicating that it is probably not the best tactical option in most cases.

THAT is then interpreted by the OC "pushers" as vehement opposition.

The fact is that very few people are actually AGAINST open carry--I'm certainly not and I've said that over and over again. I don't OPPOSE open carry--I've said that repeatedly. I do think that it has some significant tactical disadvantages and that it is often not done in a manner that helps to further gun rights. It's not an option that I would exercise frequently even if it were legal in my area.

What I VEHEMENTLY OPPOSE is the continuous PUSHING of OC, the snide implications that those who don't think it's the best option are anti-gun or aren't willing to take a stand, the repeated attempts to refute logical and common sense arguments and the increasingly desperate push to pretend that the negative incidents that have occurred have no bearing on reality.

 

[Fred Fuller]

OK, once we get into politics we depart from S&T. This one's done...

lpl/nc