Shotgun stock finishing - Help..

R

rhtwist

Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2004
Messages
698
Hello,
Requesting advice on refinishing the buttstock and forend of a Stevens 311 shotgun. Wanted a stained walnut, linseed oil type finish. Stripped the finish and found a very light wood. It needs significant coloring and a finish as of now. I can not find a way to color it and still use an linseed/tung oil finish. Tried using baking soda and water and it only darkened it almost imperceptibly. Need advise on getting a colored finish that will look acceptable even if is like the original ?colored varnish???.
Thanks foe the assistance
rhtwist
BTW what type of wood is it likely to be? Has a splotchy kind of look when I wet it,
 
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Some birch stocks are so close grained that they won’t take an oil stain. They need a water or alcohol based stain both of which are hard to get even colors with. I have had the best luck with brown leather dye. I’ll get the brand name tomorrow.
 
Kp321 said:
Some birch stocks are so close grained that they won’t take an oil stain. They need a water or alcohol based stain both of which are hard to get even colors with. I have had the best luck with brown leather dye. I’ll get the brand name tomorrow.
Click to expand...
Thanks for your reply! All I've gleaned from the internet was that the wood was probably birch.. Appreciate any advice, suggestions, successful products
 
I have had good luck with Feibings alcohol based leather dye for stain. rub down to desired color with OOOO steel wool. Clear coating with satin kylon is all you need. This Marlin had stripes of sap wood when I stripped it. The dye (saddle tan) stained evenly, and you would never know.

315930_252940418090242_2061900491_n.png

My Zastava .458 was light wood, leather dye was the ticket there too. Hope this helps.

458.jpg.jpg

tr10 (1).jpg
 
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Hello JeffG,
I like the looks of the Zastava for sure. Was that a single coat of dye? Will investigate the product! An idea if tung oil or blo can be used over it?
Thanks
 
rhtwist said:
Hello JeffG,
I like the looks of the Zastava for sure. Was that a single coat of dye? Will investigate the product! An idea if tung oil or blo can be used over it?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Single application of dye, and steel wool it. If you're not satisfied, reapply. Use gloves for sure! If it is thoroughly dry, tung oil will work fine, make sure it is well burnished with fine steel wool, and rubbed well with a soft cloth befor applying tung oil. BLO tends to dissolve the dye, rather than seal it.
 

Will commercial, modern BLO usually darken wood? L1A1 FAL rifle: unknown wood types---

Some comments on the net state that it does darken, and show household furniture before and after. I don't like most of the differences which are depicted After applying such oil.:( No idea how many layers they used, if they can be quantified. This is an ---Aussie/Brit--- rifle on an Imbel...
www.thehighroad.org

Read this for how to apply BLO.

Stain - use a stain meant for gunstocks such as Laurel Mountain which you can find at Brownells or Birchwood Casey which should be available at most gun stores. Follow their directions for stain prep. .

You're some lucky if the stock is stripped down to light wood. Is the color even throughout the stock? I it is, you're good that way. Raise the grain by spraying w/ water and do a final sanding with something like 400 grit. Stain, apply BLO

If you want a fancy finish, that's another story.
 
Let me expand on my last post. Had a guy bring me a 311 (old model sold by Sears) with a busted stock. I found a factory stock at Numrich. He wanted a lighter color than the walnut-ish sorta paint job that it had. That factory stock was a pig to strip. Whatever they had used had penetrated deep into the grain. I finally bleached the stock to get that final bit and used an oak colored stock stain. Glad I was to get it back to him.

The reason I mentioned this and asked if the wood color was uniform throughout is that if you have a situation like I describe, then it can be a bugger to go lighter stain. Since you want to go walnut, you shouldn’t have any problems. But ……

Would you mind sending a pic of the stripped stock? I might be able to help avoid some pain.

Look back up at kp321‘s photos. The area around the grip and some of the areas left side base are examples of not getting completely stripped. It’s not bad or anything like that and in fact gives character.

Bleaching will get the last of it. I looked on the dreaded You Tube and found this guy. There are others. It’s an old method.

youtu.be

Stock refinishing - removing the old stain and preparation.

Part 2 of the old stock project. The dents and bruises have been steamed out. Now its time to remove all the old stain and prepare the wood for the applicati...
youtu.be youtu.be

Notice how many strippers he tried.

I actually had to bleach the stock I had 3 times.

The 311s I know of didn’t have checkering, but if you do, then that’s another discussion.

I’m out of wind. Good luck.
 
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Kp321 said:
Feibings is what I used too. Here are before and after pictures of the 10-22 stock I dyed and added a mesquite fore end cap to. Looks like I used Tru-Oil from the can in the picture. View attachment 1185187View attachment 1185188View attachment 1185189
Click to expand...
So far I really like the results. Great job "thumbs up"! But I am still unclear on a few concerns. If the stock seemed to get consistently wet from the water, that should mean that I got the original finish off. I did sand it some with 220 and cleaned with ethanol, yes... maybe? Also the final finish is from the examples shown, an aerosol of lacquer or true-oil. Those leave a solid coating unlike oils that require occasional re-doing with the oil???
Thanks for any clarification!
 
JeffG said:
Single application of dye, and steel wool it. If you're not satisfied, reapply. Use gloves for sure! If it is thoroughly dry, tung oil will work fine, make sure it is well burnished with fine steel wool, and rubbed well with a soft cloth befor applying tung oil. BLO tends to dissolve the dye, rather than seal it.
Click to expand...
Appreciate your information. Still trying to figure out the combinations. I am thinking, initially of the tung-oil, since I don't want the blo messing the color up. Are there reasons for using another type of finish like poly or whatever?
I am kinda old schoolish...
Thanx
 
NMexJim said:

Will commercial, modern BLO usually darken wood? L1A1 FAL rifle: unknown wood types---

Some comments on the net state that it does darken, and show household furniture before and after. I don't like most of the differences which are depicted After applying such oil.:( No idea how many layers they used, if they can be quantified. This is an ---Aussie/Brit--- rifle on an Imbel...
www.thehighroad.org

Read this for how to apply BLO.

Stain - use a stain meant for gunstocks such as Laurel Mountain which you can find at Brownells or Birchwood Casey which should be available at most gun stores. Follow their directions for stain prep. .

You're some lucky if the stock is stripped down to light wood. Is the color even throughout the stock? I it is, you're good that way. Raise the grain by spraying w/ water and do a final sanding with something like 400 grit. Stain, apply BLO

If you want a fancy finish, that's another story.
Click to expand...
Okay and thanks for another option. Yes the stock is pretty consistent in color. I would like a walnutty looking color and again, originally considered the blo. Wood workers have all sorts of methods for attaining a finish, base coat, dye, shellac, gel stain and then poly. Not gonna do that.......... Thanks for the link!
 
Oh geeze, here I go getting into trouble. There is steel wool and then there is steel wool. Regular steel wool has oil on it. Gun steel wool doesn’t.

When doing stock finishing and where you seal the grain, steel wool of any kind will dig out the grain seal. I do not use steel wool of any kind, but that just me.
 
NMexJim said:
Let me expand on my last post. Had a guy bring me a 311 (old model sold by Sears) with a busted stock. I found a factory stock at Numrich. He wanted a lighter color than the walnut-ish sorta paint job that it had. That factory stock was a pig to strip. Whatever they had used had penetrated deep into the grain. I finally bleached the stock to get that final bit and used an oak colored stock stain. Glad I was to get it back to him.

The reason I mentioned this and asked if the wood color was uniform throughout is that if you have a situation like I describe, then it can be a bugger to go lighter stain. Since you want to go walnut, you shouldn’t have any problems. But ……

Would you mind sending a pic of the stripped stock? I might be able to help avoid some pain.

Look back up at kp321‘s photos. The area around the grip and some of the areas left side base are examples of not getting completely stripped. It’s not bad or anything like that and in fact gives character.

Bleaching will get
Click to expand...

NMexJim said:
Let me expand on my last post. Had a guy bring me a 311 (old model sold by Sears) with a busted stock. I found a factory stock at Numrich. He wanted a lighter color than the walnut-ish sorta paint job that it had. That factory stock was a pig to strip. Whatever they had used had penetrated deep into the grain. I finally bleached the stock to get that final bit and used an oak colored stock stain. Glad I was to get it back to him.

The reason I mentioned this and asked if the wood color was uniform throughout is that if you have a situation like I describe, then it can be a bugger to go lighter stain. Since you want to go walnut, you shouldn’t have any problems. But ……

Would you mind sending a pic of the stripped stock? I might be able to help avoid some pain.

Look back up at kp321‘s photos. The area around the grip and some of the areas left side base are examples of not getting completely stripped. It’s not bad or anything like that and in fact gives character.

Bleaching will get the last of it. I looked on the dreaded You Tube and found this guy. There are others. It’s an old method.

youtu.be

Stock refinishing - removing the old stain and preparation.

Part 2 of the old stock project. The dents and bruises have been steamed out. Now its time to remove all the old stain and prepare the wood for the applicati...
youtu.be youtu.be

Notice how many strippers he tried.

I actually had to bleach the stock I had 3 times.

The 311s I know of didn’t have checkering, but if you do, then that’s another discussion.

I’m out of wind. Good luck.
Click to expand...
Sorry you had the problems and I have the apparently same problem!!! Mine has no checkering. I will see if I can some pix uploaded. As long as we are at it is I steamed some dents out, but there is a crack in the side that covers the right side of the open action. It is practically flush and a lot of effort could not open it hardly any. Can't see how to get any glue in. The crack was not noticeable until the finish was stripped off. It held up for probably a half a century like that ?
Many thanks!
 
NMexJim said:
Oh geeze, here I go getting into trouble. There is steel wool and then there is steel wool. Regular steel wool has oil on it. Gun steel wool doesn’t.

When doing stock finishing and where you seal the grain, steel wool of any kind will dig out the grain seal. I do not use steel wool of any kind, but that just me.
Click to expand...
Gotcha. Since I did not use paint stripper on it, should I? As mentioned, when the stock was wetted down it seem to be consistently wet?!!?!?
 
rhtwist said:
Gotcha. Since I did not use paint stripper on it, should I? As mentioned, when the stock was wetted down it seem to be consistently wet?!!?!?
Click to expand...

Can you give me a pic?

Do you have checkering?

Yes, I start w/ paint stripper usually a citrus brand. You may need to strip a couple or three times.

Sand down lightly. You usually don’t want to remove anymore wood than necessary.

Spray with water. This does two things; raises the grain for a final sanding and gives you an idea of what the stock will look like.

Are there stains remaining or dark spots down in the grain? Those will be in the finish. If you don’t like the look, you may have to bleach. If so, bleach everything. Not just that one area. Read up on bleaching. There are various products, but I’ve used Clorox

I’ve not used leather dye although the results look pretty good above. What I use is purpose-built stock stain. I always have. I read the final wood prep instruction for that dye, and that’s what I do, Go to the Birchwood Casey site and read up on their products. They work.

Gun Stock Refinishing Guide

Refinish your gun stocks and firearms with the right oil and methods to bring back the wood grain and nickel luster like it was new.
www.birchwoodcasey.com www.birchwoodcasey.com

Since you want to use BLO, and there’s nothing wrong with that, don’t worry about filling the grain. If you’re next stock is a nice, checkered stock, then think about a better product.

Look at the stocks I posted in my first post above. It’s fast, it’s easy and it works. Notice that the grain is not filled in those stocks. If I had gone to the trouble of filling the grain, I wouldn’t have used BLO. It’s a matter of how much effort you want to put in. For a 311, BLO is fine.
 
Good day kind Sir! Here are some shots of what I have to work with. Not looking for an exquisite finish. Thank you for the additional reference material!!

IMG_3412.JPG IMG_3413.JPG
 
The spotty areas will come out darker when you finish. Walnut stain may cover that and may not. You can apply some citrus stripper to everything and see if that helps. I doubt it, but one never knows. Finally, there is bleach which will leave the stock white as in the videos I sent. When dry, remember to spray with water to raise the grain for a final light sanding. This helps prevent grain raise when you apply stain. As I said, follow the wood prep as shown with the stain. I don’t have a clue for leather stain other than for leatherwork which I happen to enjoy too.

The BLO is easy after this. One mistake I made in relating what my grandfather taught me ( a fine antique reproduction man out of North Carolina) is that you can run long rods parallel through the inter can lips that will go out over the edge of the outer can for warming the BLO. They can be as small as 1/8” as long as they give good support.Just be sure you have control of the inner can for safety.

We mixed hide glue this way too. Now that’s a smell you won’t forget! Thank the stars for modern epoxies glues. All of it was flammable and handled very carefully. No open flames.

If you’re happy where you are, then that’s fine as frog‘s hair. Finish it out.

BTW, that’s not a bad looking grain. Should be pretty nice when you’re done.
 
NMexJim said:
The spotty areas will come out darker when you finish. Walnut stain may cover that and may not. You can apply some citrus stripper to everything and see if that helps. I doubt it, but one never knows. Finally, there is bleach which will leave the stock white as in the videos I sent. When dry, remember to spray with water to raise the grain for a final light sanding. This helps prevent grain raise when you apply stain. As I said, follow the wood prep as shown with the stain. I don’t have a clue for leather stain other than for leatherwork which I happen to enjoy too.

The BLO is easy after this. One mistake I made in relating what my grandfather taught me ( a fine antique reproduction man out of North Carolina) is that you can run long rods parallel through the inter can lips that will go out over the edge of the outer can for warming the BLO. They can be as small as 1/8” as long as they give good support.Just be sure you have control of the inner can for safety.

We mixed hide glue this way too. Now that’s a smell you won’t forget! Thank the stars for modern epoxies glues. All of it was flammable and handled very carefully. No open flames.

If you’re happy where you are, then that’s fine as frog‘s hair. Finish it out.

BTW, that’s not a bad looking grain. Should be pretty nice when you’re done.
Click to expand...
Well I decided on the Tru-Oil Walnut stain, which is enroute. The original finish showed the darker areas so I am not that concerned about it. Will sand to 400 grit and give it a try. Finger's crossed.
Thank you and the other members for the guidance.
Rhtwist
 
IMG_3417crop.JPG


Update on the challenge- Applied two coats of the Tru-Oil Walnut stain. Defiitely darker and shows the splotching. Not bad. Then I applied a coat of BLO which is still curing, hoping that the Linseed would darken the finish more. No luck. Wondering what my options would be to get a darker finish, not involving sanding the current stain and finish of and starting over. Thinking of an overall darkening, like what might be called a glaze on furniture. Oil paint mixed with the BLO, the aforementioned leather dye?
thanks
 
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Tru-Oil is a mixture of linseed oil, varnish and solvent, so if you want a "real oil finish" you'll have to be careful with it as it builds up a layer on top of the wood - I suggest to read carefully the thread "How to do the World's best oil finish" from Dfariswheel. Although it's already missing the pictures, it's a detailed explanation how to mimic an oil finish with "Danish oil" type finishes (Tru-Oil is essentially a type of Danish Oil).
Sadly, you are a little bit late for another coat of stain... You already applied BLO which penetrates and seals the wood and will be a PITA to remove, so don't even try it because you may ruin your stock with the solvents, or from excessive sanding - just let it be, your stock is actually turning rather nice.
P.S. If you want to use Tru-Oil, than there's really no need for first coats with BLO - just go straight with it.
 
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