Sierra Bullets take on the .22 LR shortage.

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I have to laugh at this whole 22 LR shortage. If I had a 22 LR rifle right now I would sell it for whatever I could get and put the money into a 17 HMR.

If what the article states is true, and I believe it's pretty accurate, the price of 22 LR will be coming down hard soon.

In a few years 22 LR will become a pistol cartridge only for any new guns. The 17 HMR will take it's place as an inexpensive rimfire rifle cartridge. Prices will come down as more rifles and ammo are sold. I predict that they will eventually be much lower than current 22 LR prices.

I was at my LGS last week and they had a large stack of 17 HMR. All those hoarders and scalpers better start dumping some ammo soon because that inflated market isn't going to be there forever.
 
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As for the collusion comment. Thats not true. Prices of like items in markets always try to come together. That is not collusion.
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Trying to come together is a whole nother animal from several major companies deciding to raise prices simultaneously in order to take advantage of high demand. I agree that all the LGS is a given area will tend to be close to the same price on similar items. Just like Home Depot and Lowe's. That is "market intelligence". Pricing discussions among competitive companies are frowned upon. On the other hand pricing discussions by a "co-op" are perfectly okay.
 
I'll say one thing about the shortage of .22 lr.

Ruger owns CCI, and if Ruger wants to sell their 10/22 or MKII .22 pistols, or Single Sixs or any .22 gun of any kind, they need to expand their factory and start pumping them out.

I now see tons of .22 rifles and pistols on the shelves at stores. Few buyers cause of the shortage of ammo.

Same for Remington. They sell .22 rifles and they ought to start making lots more .22s if they want to sell guns anymore.

Deaf
 
jrdolall said:
Trying to come together is a whole nother animal from several major companies deciding to raise prices simultaneously in order to take advantage of high demand. I agree that all the LGS is a given area will tend to be close to the same price on similar items. Just like Home Depot and Lowe's. That is "market intelligence". Pricing discussions among competitive companies are frowned upon. On the other hand pricing discussions by a "co-op" are perfectly okay.
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Sure. But thats not what we are talking about and not at all what would need to happen in this case. Nobody is talking about collusion.
 
hardheart said:
What is the problem with pricing?
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Prices have not increased to meet demand.

I am pretty sure that is the answer you were expecting and I am pretty sure what your response is going to be. I know there are a lot of reasons. Many of them valid. But the reasons are beside the point. There was a shock to demand, a shock I believe had multiple factors, and prices did not move far enough to meet demand. Therefore you have shortages that only exacerbate the issue and create ultimately wide variations in price of like items. That is the very basic problem at its simplist level.
 
No, I really was hoping to get your take on it. I don't mind reading the thoughts of others, as this is a discussion forum, so the more words the better, imo. Personally, it comes down to six cents a round = no buy having been in place for me over the last 18 months, and I am pretty much unconcerned in my day-to-day beyond that point. But the limited talk of supply and demand that normally comes up like a misquoted sound bite is a bit bothersome to me.
 
hardheart said:
No, I really was hoping to get your take on it. I don't mind reading the thoughts of others, as this is a discussion forum, so the more words the better, imo. Personally, it comes down to six cents a round = no buy having been in place for me over the last 18 months, and I am pretty much unconcerned in my day-to-day beyond that point. But the limited talk of supply and demand that normally comes up like a misquoted sound bite is a bit bothersome to me.
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Fair enough. And dont get me wrong. I am enjoying this discussion. I just thought you were baiting an answer to make a point. No big deal. And I 100% agree with your last sentence. It can get pretty frustrating.
 
mac66 said:
On thing not touched on in that article is that there was a shortage before the Dec 2012 panic.

While .22 ammo was available in 2012 before the panic and election it was in short supply even then. Retail stores would get it in but it wouldn't last more than a few days at the prices they were selling it and they were limiting it to a couple boxes per customer.
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While I agree with your post on the reasons .22lr is hard to come by, I never noticed any shortage before Dec 2012.

Nor did I notice a huge increase in price, and it was gradual and keeping in line with the higher cost of other ammo. Until Dec 14 that is.

I was fortunate, in that in the week before the Newtown shooting, I made two different purchases of .22lr. Some as Christmas presents, and the rest for me.

The presentation wooden cased bricks sold for 27 to 28 bucks, and I bought 5 of them for Christmas presents, for nephews and nieces, and 3 boxes of bulk packs for me, at the regular price.

Perhaps, it was a local shortage you were experiencing, or perhaps I just always lucked into places that had plenty of stock, (almost always at Wal-mart, or the local big box sporting goods store). I certainly never noticed any shortage, and I bought a lot of .22lr ammo that year, as I was teaching four nephews a niece to shoot.
 
Ruger owns CCI, and if Ruger wants to sell their 10/22 or MKII .22 pistols, or Single Sixs or any .22 gun of any kind, they need to expand their factory and start pumping them out.
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ATK Sporting group owns CCI and Ruger doesn't own ATK.
 
jrdolall said:
Price increases on the retail level are not the answer. It may sound right and seem right but it is a fantasy because the big companies like WM don't play the game like we think they should. The .22 LR "shortage" isn't a blip on their screen outside of the local Sportings Good department. While it sounds impossible to us it is reality. Heck If anything they are GLAD there is such a shortage. Doesn't it get people to come in the store or get people that are buying toilet paper to stop by and check ammo? It does for me. I don't quit going because they are out of 22 because I know most everyone is out of 22.

The only PRICING scenario that would work would be for the major ammo companies to raise prices significantly to every retailer, wholesaler, re-distributor and Tom, Dick and Harry. If they did that then prices at every retailer would rise accordingly and the demand would drop and the scarcity would, theoretically at least, end.

Of course if they all did that at the same time it would be collusion and the only companies that can get away with that nowadays are the big oil companies. Why is gas always within a couple of pennies in a given area and then fifteen cents cheaper at the next corner?
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Oil companies make 10 cents on a gallon. govt makes 41 cents a gallon. Govt bombards us 24/7 with their propaganda but God forbid if you take them to task you are a conspiracy nut or domestic terrorist. Oil companies do all the work govt gloms their money
 
I cant believe people go through a brick each outing. I went shooting recently and was amazed at the guys with the 25 round magazines playing fast shooter with their 22's. My first thought was "how will they replace it?!" If I go shooting with just about anything 50 rounds is about my max.
 
IlikeSA said:
I cant believe people go through a brick each outing. I went shooting recently and was amazed at the guys with the 25 round magazines playing fast shooter with their 22's. My first thought was "how will they replace it?!" If I go shooting with just about anything 50 rounds is about my max.
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I have shot 500 .357's outta a revolver in one outing. Shooting a brick of .22lr outta a semi pistol dinging steel swingers ain't hard to do.
 
CoalTrain49 said:
I have to laugh at this whole 22 LR shortage. If I had a 22 LR rifle right now I would sell it for whatever I could get and put the money into a 17 HMR.

If what the article states is true, and I believe it's pretty accurate, the price of 22 LR will be coming down hard soon.

In a few years 22 LR will become a pistol cartridge only for any new guns. The 17 HMR will take it's place as an inexpensive rimfire rifle cartridge. Prices will come down as more rifles and ammo are sold. I predict that they will eventually be much lower than current 22 LR prices.

I was at my LGS last week and they had a large stack of 17 HMR. All those hoarders and scalpers better start dumping some ammo soon because that inflated market isn't going to be there forever.
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17 HMR is about the only rimfire ammo I have seen in 18 months. 17 HMR will NEVER replace 22LR. It would be more likely that 22 WMR will eventually push 17 HMR into obsolescence. But it won't happen anytime soon. 22 Mag has been getting much more popular in the last 5 years.

The price of 22LR is not going to come down substantially except relative to the re-sellers (non-dealers). Frankly I would make sure that they have a business license.

I find it hard to accept that some people here actually want the manufacturers to raise their price to their direct customers so that it forces an increase at the retail level accross the board. I would just let the re-sellers to continue their ways until the market closes the gap with increased supplies. It is no skin off my back for them to be selling 22 ammo at 2 to 4 times the retail price. It bothers me, but it really doesn't impact me at all.

Higher priced 22 ammunition is available if you look for it. I would rather not shoot than pay those prices.

Someone mentioned that the same dollars would be spent at gunshops regardless of the current rimfire shortage. I dissagree based on my own experience, I don't even bother visiting gunshops much in the last 18 months. That means I am not spending ANY money of ANYTHING they sell.
 
22-rimfire said:
17 HMR is about the only rimfire ammo I have seen in 18 months. 17 HMR will NEVER replace 22LR. It would be more likely that 22 WMR will eventually push 17 HMR into obsolescence. But it won't happen anytime soon. 22 Mag has been getting much more popular in the last 5 years.
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To be honest I didn't even consider 22 Mag. Shows you how much I know about 22's. :eek: It seems that 22 mag has a bit of an advantage to 100 yards but loses that to the 17 at longer range. 17 HMR has also been getting popular. Marlin and Ruger both build guns for it and I know where I can buy a Ruger right now.

Here's a good comparison of the 17 HMR and the 22 WMR. Personally I would take either one over a 22 LR but 17 HMR will be the only ammo you will be able to find now.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/compared_17HMR_22WMR.htm
 
I paid .08/round and .11/round respectively for the last two bricks I ordered, both prices being absolutely in line with what that same ammo would have cost me two years ago. I'm not getting gouged, I'm shooting the ammo my rifles prefer and I have plenty of bulk stocked up to continue shooting as much as I please.

I would love to demand that gas prices roll back to .89/gal. where it was in my high school days but that's not gonna happen. $9 bricks of Winchester that I stocked and sold case after case isn't around anymore either. Refusing to drive or shoot aren't options I give serious consideration to so I buy at reasonable prices when I find them. Last years deal was 6 bulk packs of Federal at .04/round and believe me I'm not saving it for an apocalypse.

Back when I started, 100 rounds of Remington T22, two boxes (100 rounds) of .357 semi-wadcutters and two boxes of 12ga breaking pidgeons was an outing for me and my sister. Sometimes we had ammo left, sometimes we didn't but there was always more at home. Years of reloading and rimfire purchasing meant no shortage of components or ammo during the current drought while teaching my 3 children. They don't bang away aimlessly, but they do run through a few hundred rounds on occasion.
 
The article is pretty much spot on.

Hoarders are the big reason AFAIC. I saw an example on another forum. The guy is a casual shooter who goes through say a brick a month (if that much). He found a place that had 22 for $40 per brick. That wouldn't be a bad price for CCI Mini Mags IMO. The guy bought 12,000 rounds. A two year supply. When you get a few people doing this the shortage gets worse.

Their are many doing this with reloading components too. Reminds me of the reloaded induced primer shortages of the Clinton Administration.
 
Ruger ought to get into the .22 ammo business or they won't sell many
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Considering Ruger sells basically whatever they can manufacture before they can even ship it, I don't believe for a second their sales of .22 caliber firearms is in any sort of serious trouble. Too, the idea of 22 LR becoming "obsolete" in favor of the .17hmr is laughable, due to the sheer numbers involved. It would take decades of people buying .17's over 22's for their number to EVER come close to matching the number of .22 LR firearms out in the real world at this very moment. That alone guarantees the survival and continued popularity of the .22 There is simply no indication whatsoever that the HMR is encroaching on the levels of popularity enjoyed by the .22 LR, and one could make the argument that the .17 WSM rimfire stands a good chance of eventually rendering the HMR obsolete, as it does everything the HMR can do a bit better, at little additional cost.
 
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All I know is I want to be buried like a pharaoh with 3 million 22 rounds in my coffin
 
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