stalker

[Moparmike]

if he touches my girlfriend I will have to restrain myself but it will be legal action, not physical action that is taken.

If I understand the law correctly, if you are witness to said actions and you believe her life and limb is in harms way, you are legally able to take preventative physical actions.

Especially if a restraining order is put into place.

 

[WonderNine]

On a different note, she is 17 and a high schooler, you are 19 and in college, right? Why? This "stalker" may honestly feel that you are the bad influence. In his mind, (confused as it may be) he is going to be her knight and protect the damsel in distress. This actually sounds like immature behaviour. I would get OUT of the whole situation, PDQ! I have heard these fantasies so many times. This is not a flame. This is experience. If you stir manure, don't expect a smell of roses.

That's just goofy. Anyways I'm 24 and chase the 18 year olds.

Whack this guy.

What a shame if this guy would just suddenly "disappear".

 

[sturmruger]

good Job

Fslflint I have allot of respect for how you are handling this. When I was 19 my girlfiriend, now wife got felt up at a party. I have never felt anger like I did the night I found out about it. I was lucky that there was so much distance between her, and I and this lousy scumbag. I am sure at 19 I would have done something stupid. Handling everythign on the up and up will get your farther in the long run.


Good luck I hope all goes well.

 

[joab]

I am not some unrestrained punk 19 year old. I wear other colors besides tactical black and camo. I am not a future marine or future swat guy. I have a good respectful relationship with my girlfriend and her parents. I am not infatuated with how tough or cool I am. I do not like to fight but I am always prepared to do so.

I can only assume that that was meant for Josey or me. Well let me fill you in. I was an honor roll student college bound with a career as a teacher or some sort of legal degree in mind probably immigration law. I was raised by a pacifist conscientous objector medic. Who loved his guns but probably could never bring himself to harm anyone for any reason and never watched me in a football game because he objected to the violence of the game.
He taught me to never raise my hand in anger to another human being. The reason he had that attitude was because as a young man in high school some guy said something to his girlfriend and things escalalated as they do and he broke the guys cheek bone.

The young testosterone driven human male is as dangerous as any animal when he feels that he has been pushed to far. And some times that trigger is surprisingly light, even for some one that doesn't wear camo or black.
I will also assume that you did not mean to imply that Marines and S.W.A.T. officers start out as punks

 

[fslflint]

I wasn't implying that swat or or marines are punks. I was saying that I didn't think I was tough as nails. it was not a rip on swat or marines. I just know allot of guys who think they are the tough and claim all this "i'm gonna be a -------", fill in the blank.

 

[cryptoguru]

fslflint, just go start the papertrail with your gf. If this guy has an outstanding warrant or something, the LEOs might be glad to use that to hook him up.

 

[tommytrauma]

So, she hangs around with "friends" who don't report rapes, her last bf was a "psycho", and she's being stalked by another now.

She needs to take a long hard look at how she's making decisions in her life. You also need to take a second look at things, and make sure you're not being sucked into someone else's melodrama. I've seen all to many people who spend their whole lives flitting from one crisis to another, and too many guys who get caught up trying to 'save' such.

You might want to pick up a copy of 'The Gift of Fear' by Gavin DeBecker. He's not my favoriate guy due to some 'anti' leanings, but he has some good insight into stalking situations.

As far as not trying to be a tough guy goes, there's a difference between macho posturing and doing things that need to be done. You're telling me that this guy is a serial rapist and is stalking someone you care about. If a serial rapist was stalking my wife, well... I'd be pretty proactive in handling the situation. Macho posturing gets you arrested. Well thought out actions don't.

 

[fslflint]

tommy
my gf has made some bad decisions in her life. she has also made the decision to fix her mistakes, she made that decision before I came along and is sticking to it. as for her ex, almost everyone has someone they don't want to admit that they were with at one point in time. I'm not trying to be macho because I'm not. I do think through anything before doing it so as I said earlier, if he comfronts me or touches my girl while I am there then it was his choosing to start it, not mine. If you research the stats you will find that a large percentage of rape goes unreported, thus a large percentage of the female population that you live with may have neglected to report rape or sexual abuse. it is supprising how many women look the other way and try to suppress their emotions in such a situation. I don't understand it and probably will never understand it.

as for everyone out there that thinks this is reason to end the relationship, I fear for any relationship you are in. I have said I love her, this has been a very good relationship and a long term one. I havn't regretted anything about this relationship. to me my word is my bond. feelings and emotions come and go but what I have said stands. to me being honest and respectful is very important, she has done this and I have done this. it would take allot more than some guy following her around to make me want to end something this good.

 

[sturmruger]

I don't why people are telling this guy to rethink his relationship. The only problem right now is some freaky stalker. What kind of a man would he be if he dropped her just because some crazed pervert likes to watch her. It isn't her fault she didn't ask for it.


I am only 26, but I have identified lots of things I did at 17 that weren't very smart. I think we should stay on topic and stay away from the love advice.

 

[clubsoda22]

I say we just "james bond" your car with an oil slick and smoke screen. That should take care oh him on those windy back roads...as for the stinger missiles behind the headlights....

Ignore some people's love advice...

 

[G21dude]

Might be too late, but...

fslflint, and *everyone else*, go read "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin de Becker. He's all wet on guns, I think, but he's got everything else right. This book is about identifying potential threats in advance -- his company is (one of?) the foremost in threat analysis, works with Supreme Court Justices, Sec. Service, etc. etc.

"The Gift of Fear" is focused on women, but it all applies; he talks about how violence *always* is preceded by what he calls "pre-incident indicators" that we all pick up on, typically subconsciously, and lots of other good stuff. Another EXCELLENT book by him is "Protecting the Gift" aimed toward parents.

Go read it right now, and get her to read it, and get her parents to read it.

(Everyone else go read it too)

(And ignore his anti-gun stance, the rest is great)

(OK, I'll stop talking now)

(No, really, everyone go read this book)

 

[Meow]

"The Gift of Fear"
Already read it.
Yes, everyone read it.

 

[Josey]

You have made a decision. I simply want you to think it through. You say you have. I can only take that at face value. My adventures and experiences have kept me from making the same mistake twice. I have watched people I worked with go down. One is on trial for murder. Death penalty is sought. One is in prison for life for murder. One friend was shot 26 times while doing a murder. He lived. He still has 20 years to go before he can apply for parole. One friend is going down for a homicide. He pled guilty. I was a football player, rough and tough soccer and rugby player. I drove race cars. I had a woman that was crazier than I could see. I was not a cheek turner. I paid a price. I learned and matured. I hope you are offered a choice. May you make the right one. I was not of age when I was forced to make life and death decisions. I guess what I am hoping for is a good future for you. Joab and I made ours, with help. We became part of a brotherhood. We stopped seeing the world as ours. We realized that there were others who had given us a path to follow. Deviation from the path would bring us only death, destruction, shame and no honour. I hope your path brings you and us, honour.

 

[clubsoda22]

fslflint, and *everyone else*, go read "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin de Becker. He's all wet on guns, I think, but he's got everything else right. This book is about identifying potential threats in advance -- his company is (one of?) the foremost in threat analysis, works with Supreme Court Justices, Sec. Service, etc. etc.

Yep, he's the prick that wrote the software to test what kids are likely to become school shooters. If i remember correctly, i was hearing of kids getting put in counciling because they preformed badly on the test. In some cases the police were even involved. Had a heavy emphass on gun ownership too.

It was kinda like preventative medicine. None of the kids it picked out ever shot up the school because they we're forced to seek counciling, thrown onto anti-depressants and had every move monitored by social workers and the police. Gotta wonder if they would have anyway. I know plenty of perfectly sane kids who had their lives ruined by it.

If you asked me, the guy has ruined countless lives by people putting too much faith in his research.

As for leaving your girlfreind, wouldn't that simply be giving the stalker what he wants? Why give him a victory? Make the girl he's stalking available, i'm sure that won't encourage him.

For her 18th birthday bring her to the sheriffs office to file a restraining order. I'm sure when the stalker gets the notice in the mail he'll be furious and do something stupid. When he does something stupid with the RO in place, then you have the means to send him to jail.

 

[WonderNine]

.

 

[joab]

The above post is what we're talking about Flint. Avoid it . It doesn't impress anybody. And just makes you look ridiculous

 

[G21dude]

Quite often, TROs are the straw that breaks the camel's back. That is to say, some loser freak has some fantasy in their head, and may not be brave enough to do anything about it, until the victim takes an official, undeniable step, and gets a TRO. Now the perp gets hassled by the cops, takes this as a major affront/offense, and has to "retaliate."

TROs don't stop assailants any more than locks stop burglars -- they are good for keeping honest people honest. But if you think you might be dealing with someone who's elevator doesn't quite make it to the top floor, a TRO can't stop them from doing anything, and might just piss 'em off.

Just a thought...

 

[fslflint]

ok, This is what I have been trying to get across. I know allot of guys that want to go out and the the "tough" thing. I don't want to do the tough thing, I want to do the right thing. I have two sisters, I also have a girlfriend that I care very much about. its not going to help a thing in the world if I go out and start threatening this guy. I asked for advice on what to do because I didn't know what was legally in my bounds. I don't want to come off as the cocky tough guy here. thats not who I am. I also don't want people to think that I am going to go break this guys jaw, whether he deserves it or not. I posted because I was, and still am, concerned about my girls safety. as I said before, her parents are involved more than I am because it is legally not my responsibility. but morally I feel obligated to help if I can. I asked for advice and I thank all of you that have given me the friendly advice I asked for.

thank you

 

[Heraclitus]

The squeaking wheel gets the grease.

Get the cops involved. Get those rape victims to file charges. Don't wait for the worst to happen. And it probably will if no one builds a case.

 

[proven]

howdy
had the same problem myself a while back. might vary due to county, but i live in pa and when this nutbag was "stalking" my girlfriend, the police said a restraining order could only be put in place if she had a relationship or sexual history with the guy. he would show up at her work, follow her home, follow us out to dinner (come in the restaurant and just sit there), all kinds of stuff. he even followed me home and left a 2 page letter on my jeep about how he knew her long before i came along bla bla bla, with a pic of them together with the third friend cut out. called the police and got the runaround that they couldn't do anything. her father actually had a nyc private investigator follow this guy for about 2 months but could not pin anything on him because he didn't actually break the law.
here's what i did: you'll have to decide this for yourself, but i pretty much came to the conclusion that this guy was not interested in harming her. i also had decided that i would probably fair well if we were to end up in a "scuffle" so, i confronted him. not agressively but waited untill he started following and just turned the tables. he stopped in a park and started to walk. when i cought up, i told him that she didn't want to have anything to do with him and that he should seriously consider staying the "f " away. so from then on every time i caught him tailing i would pull over somewhere public and watch as he kept driving. one night as she was leaving work late, i sat down the street in my car. his apartment was about 1/2 block away and i saw him come out the door and start walking towards her. i got out and started walking towards him, and as soon as he saw me he turned and went back inside without a word exchanged. it's takes effort and is frustrating but i became the pain in his "a" and he got tired of it. ended up moving shrtly after. not saying your situation would end up the same, but i think it's a good idea for you, her parents and everybody else to let this guy know that you know what he's up to. we even let his "friends" (read: people he talked to) know what he was doing. you don't have to threaten him to get your point across, just being stern about the warning worked for me. and if he says "or what??", i just repeated the warning and let him think about it.

hope this helps and good luck

 

[clubsoda22]

what proven suggests sounds reasonable to me.

 

[Joe Demko]

Well, I live in PA, also. Where I am, such a situation is frequently handled by hiring a couple crackheads to break somebody's legs. People frequently end up incarcerated and with criminal records here, too. Lots of machismo in this thread. I very strongly urge you to handle this by pestering the police. "Stalking the stalker" or similar behavior is only going to make you a willing participant in the eyes of the law when this finally boils over.
If, I were you, I'd pester the police and do some documentation of his activities. Photographs and video tapes are a good place to start.
I'm also in agreement that you need to closely examine the entire situation and see if you aren't just part of a drama-addict's soap opera lifestyle.

 

[mete]

Many states now have stalking laws ,if yours does take advantage of it .Go through all the legal means such as restraining orders. She should have a cell phone with her at all times and if she sees him following her she shouild call the police - every time .

 

[strambo]

Lots of good advice so far on both sides of the spectrum. Here's the problem, you can't see the future and nothing is certain. What worries me about the "a restraining order will only escalate" and "if you confront him it will piss him off" type advice is that he already has escalated well beyond this point multiple times in the past (Rape)

He has crossed that MAJOR line on multiple occations, so it's reasonable that rape is a very likey conclusion to this episode as well if nothing is done. He might cross another line into new territory as well. We just had a rape/murder in Portland by a 20yr old male (alleged) He admitted to punching her and throwing her in the river, he hasn't copped to the rape/ strangulation yet.

SO what I'm saying is maybe he needs to know there will be IMMEDIATE and CERTAIN consequences to his future actions. This the police cannot ever provide. On the soft end of the spectrum you could do what "proven" did (no laws broken) and on the other end of the spectrum, a very tough individual can let him know...etc...(I don't advocate this one way or the other, I don't know what I would do) the problem is you can't bluff or threaten, only promise, so if you can't back up a promise, don't say it.

Yes, the above advice could backfire, and doing nothing could backfire as well. If he hadn't raped before, then I would strongly be in the "don't confront him" camp.

Since he raped multiple times before, I think the odds favor that eventual outcome or worse, if nothing is done. Another benefit of confrontation is if it escalates things sooner that is an advantage (it will/can be on your terms) Kind of a choose your time and place of battle kind of thing. And whatever you do keep as many friends and family involved as possible. If she's always surrounded by people on the lookout for this creep and they make eye contact with him (So he doesn't think he's got everyone fooled) this alone could make him choose an easier target. Of course psychologically he'll decide she's doesn't deserve him or some crap before moving on. Good luck, I don't envy your position.

 

[proven]

pester the police and do some documentation of his activities

how about $3500 of documentation from a p.i. this didn't work in my case. the police aren't going to do anything because the guy isn't breaking any laws. he can drive, shop, eat when and where he wants. the only thing you might have is harassment, and that's tough too. you call the cops and say he won't stop calling you or stopping by. if they actually go to speak with him, he tells them you guys are friends and had a fight, you're upset and he just wants to apologize. the cops then tell him that she doesn't want to see him right now. that's it.
and as far as "stalking the stalker", all i did was let him know i knew where he was when he was following me or her. i didn't seek him out. and if want to watch my girl leave work to make sure she gets to her car ok, what cop is going to have a problem with that.
alot of situations are best left alone. many will work themselves out. that's why i said you have decide for yourself how to handle your particular predicament. as for me, i let it go for about a month before i got sick and tired of this whackjob making us miserable. always wondering when is he gonna show up next?? is he gonna give her a hard time at work tonight?? will he be waiting at her car??
if i were told that he had raped before, i wouldn't wait to take action. if the police won't MAKE this guy back off. i know that i would. like i said before you don't have to threaten, just warn. but if it goes further, be ready to back it up. i fhe attacks you or threatens you when you warn him, then the police have to respond.