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10+1, light, accurate, reliable, Gucci $1500
10+1, light, accurate, reliable, Gucci $1500
What .45 For Self Defense?
- Thread starter Fisherman12
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Personally I don't think you can do better than a Sig P220. The only drawback is mag capacity IMO. There are a bunch of great .45's around. For 2 grand you can get into the top notch 1911's. But they're usually target pistols, not combat pistols. The P220 is a combat pistol. $2000 is a LOT of money for a pistol IMO. Generally people only spend that much when they want extreme accuracy. And extreme accuracy means tighter chambers which means less reliability.
That's why a P220 is a better SD gun IMO. It is plenty accurate out to at least 50 yards. But it is still dead reliable.
But these are general guidelines. I do know I saw a torture test of a P220 that was just incredible. It was posted online but it's gone now. Part of it is still available I guess. You can read about what they did here on the Internet Archive but the photos won't be there. Still you'll get the idea. What they did to that pistol was incredible. It would have helped to see the size of the crane they used to run over the pistol and how far up they were in the helicopter when they dropped it. Plus the drop onto concrete from the top of that building was really impressive too. But shooting it with another pistol and it still working was the real proof of just how tough they are. The photo showed how much damage was done to the gun but it still fired. I'm telling you it was an incredible torture test and by far the hardest treatment I've ever seen any gun survive.
Anyway that's what you get when you buy a Sig. Plus Sig guaranteed the P210 to shoot a 2" group from 50 yards and that was before the P220 was designed and produced. The new P210's are guaranteed to shoot a 1" group at 50 yards. That's mighty impressive for a combat pistol IMO.
The P220 is a fairly big gun but people forget that the frame is aluminum. It's not as heavy as a full steel pistol. That certainly doesn't keep it from being tough though.
There are some other guns I think are great combat type handguns that are really good for SD. The HK USP is a great choice. And truth be told most of the 1911's are going to work very well too. I just don't think you need to spend $2000 to get a top notch defensive handgun. I think the Sig P220 is as tough and reliable as it gets and they are about half that $2000 price. I've had mine a good while so I didn't pay that much for it. I've got at least 15,000 rounds through it and it still runs great. I keep it in my desk drawer just in case. Of course I have guns all over the house but I sit at the desk a lot. I keep a bunch of mags though because like 1911's they just don't hold as many rounds as I would like. That's where the Springfields come in. I have a XDm .40 that holds 16 + 1. I know that's not a .45 but I bought it before the XDm .45 came out. Those hold 13 + 1 rounds which is great IMO. Heck I have a Taurus PT-145 that is much smaller than my Sig that holds 10 + 1. That thing is amazing how they squeezed so many rounds in such a small space. It's never had the slightest problem as far as firing but it is no Sig. Neither is the XDm. Sig makes a freaking nice pistol IMO.
BTW that $2000 could buy you a new P210 Legend which is a remake of the original P210. That is probably the best pistol ever made IMO. But it isn't a .45. It's a 9mm but it's been called the perfect pistol by some. It can be bought for under $2000. That guy talks about getting 1" groups with any ammo. I don't know if that means the claims of 1" groups at 50 yards is bogus or it takes special ammo or the guy just can't shoot that well. I've shot 2" groups with my P220 plenty of times at 20 yards or more. Heck I've shot groups like that with my Taurus.
That's why a P220 is a better SD gun IMO. It is plenty accurate out to at least 50 yards. But it is still dead reliable.
But these are general guidelines. I do know I saw a torture test of a P220 that was just incredible. It was posted online but it's gone now. Part of it is still available I guess. You can read about what they did here on the Internet Archive but the photos won't be there. Still you'll get the idea. What they did to that pistol was incredible. It would have helped to see the size of the crane they used to run over the pistol and how far up they were in the helicopter when they dropped it. Plus the drop onto concrete from the top of that building was really impressive too. But shooting it with another pistol and it still working was the real proof of just how tough they are. The photo showed how much damage was done to the gun but it still fired. I'm telling you it was an incredible torture test and by far the hardest treatment I've ever seen any gun survive.
Anyway that's what you get when you buy a Sig. Plus Sig guaranteed the P210 to shoot a 2" group from 50 yards and that was before the P220 was designed and produced. The new P210's are guaranteed to shoot a 1" group at 50 yards. That's mighty impressive for a combat pistol IMO.
The P220 is a fairly big gun but people forget that the frame is aluminum. It's not as heavy as a full steel pistol. That certainly doesn't keep it from being tough though.
There are some other guns I think are great combat type handguns that are really good for SD. The HK USP is a great choice. And truth be told most of the 1911's are going to work very well too. I just don't think you need to spend $2000 to get a top notch defensive handgun. I think the Sig P220 is as tough and reliable as it gets and they are about half that $2000 price. I've had mine a good while so I didn't pay that much for it. I've got at least 15,000 rounds through it and it still runs great. I keep it in my desk drawer just in case. Of course I have guns all over the house but I sit at the desk a lot. I keep a bunch of mags though because like 1911's they just don't hold as many rounds as I would like. That's where the Springfields come in. I have a XDm .40 that holds 16 + 1. I know that's not a .45 but I bought it before the XDm .45 came out. Those hold 13 + 1 rounds which is great IMO. Heck I have a Taurus PT-145 that is much smaller than my Sig that holds 10 + 1. That thing is amazing how they squeezed so many rounds in such a small space. It's never had the slightest problem as far as firing but it is no Sig. Neither is the XDm. Sig makes a freaking nice pistol IMO.
BTW that $2000 could buy you a new P210 Legend which is a remake of the original P210. That is probably the best pistol ever made IMO. But it isn't a .45. It's a 9mm but it's been called the perfect pistol by some. It can be bought for under $2000. That guy talks about getting 1" groups with any ammo. I don't know if that means the claims of 1" groups at 50 yards is bogus or it takes special ammo or the guy just can't shoot that well. I've shot 2" groups with my P220 plenty of times at 20 yards or more. Heck I've shot groups like that with my Taurus.
Fisherman12
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That's a nice Government Model! I'll have to keep an eye out for one. I've been hearing that the new Colts these days are very well made.
I have a Colt Commander 1911 .45ACP that I love. Never had a problem. I inherited it from my dad when he passed and he guesses it was purchased 25-30 years ago. It had a trigger job, ramp polishing etc. It has a 4lb trigger.
I love it. I use it off duty. My XD .40 is just to big to hide, the Commander hides quite well in my IWB holster from Blackhawk.
$2,000 bucks is a good budget.
Some indoor ranges have guns to rent if you have one near you, rent a few and see what you like!
Happy shopping!
I love it. I use it off duty. My XD .40 is just to big to hide, the Commander hides quite well in my IWB holster from Blackhawk.
$2,000 bucks is a good budget.
Some indoor ranges have guns to rent if you have one near you, rent a few and see what you like!
Happy shopping!
$2000 gets you a Kimber Gold Combat, and I suspect discounted with a weapons light. I like lights on all my home defense guns. It's full size, bushing-less bull bbl. with night sites. Since you're not looking for a carry gun, I would suggest full size. Might as well have a longer bbl, and heavier frame to reduce muzzle flip and shoot more comfortably at the range. You might be able to find a Les Baer Thunder Ranch or Dan Wesson Specialist for that price too. Broken in properly a 1911, will be as reliable as any gun, and they will spoil you at the range.
If you don't go 1911, my first choice would be the FNP-45 (FNH) which comes with three 14 round magazines and the option of carrying cocked and locked, or de-cocked as a DA/SA pistol. But their are plenty of other great .45 ACP alternatives, the HK USP tactical, I've also heard great things about the S & W M & P platform in .45. I love Glocks, but especially with your budget, I'd spend the extra money for a gun I feel is a better platform in .45 ACP.
If you don't go 1911, my first choice would be the FNP-45 (FNH) which comes with three 14 round magazines and the option of carrying cocked and locked, or de-cocked as a DA/SA pistol. But their are plenty of other great .45 ACP alternatives, the HK USP tactical, I've also heard great things about the S & W M & P platform in .45. I love Glocks, but especially with your budget, I'd spend the extra money for a gun I feel is a better platform in .45 ACP.
For $2k you could get an HK P9S...
Or a solid Colt and a bunch of ammo.
That's a lot of budget.
Or a solid Colt and a bunch of ammo.
That's a lot of budget.
Yes it is. It's way more than is needed to meet his requirements. I know he has a problem with double stack grip thickness. That's why, again, I think the Sig P220 is plenty enough gun for his needs. In pretty much ever online poll I've seen where people can pick their own .45, the P220 is either #1 or #2 behind the HK USP. More than $1100-$1200 will get you more accuracy if you buy the right gun but it might get you less reliability because accurate guns are built to be accurate instead of reliable. Accurate enough is the point you want to look for IMO. Then you can have rock solid reliable and very accurate in the same gun. And that is what a P220 is.
StrikeFire83
Member
THIS Glock guy went Xdm-Compact when it came time to buy a .45 ACP and I haven't looked back.
Smith357
Member
When I went to add a modern combat .45 to my gear list, my first gun on the short list was the Glock 21. I found the Glock too big for my girlie hands so I went with my number 2 on the list, the M&P45. So far its been dead reliable, though in all honesty I only have about 2000 rounds of handloads through it. Accuracy is OK but not great, 6" groups at 25 yards, and darn sure not as good as my wheel guns, but then I did not buy it to be a target pistol.
Dr_B
member
That M&P .45 in post #33 will definitely get the job done. I knew someone who found themselves on the wrong end of one. I also knew the person on the other end of the gun. That gun, filled with Remington Golden Sabres, ended a life in less than one minute.
Cocked & Locked
Member
This...
Zerodefect
member
I suggest :
XD single stack
Dan Wesson CCO, ECO, Valor
Ed Brown Molan (or any)
Colt CCO, New Agent, 1991, Series 70
Les Baer (any)
If you're budget goes to $2000, take a good long look at the Dan Wesson threads over at 1911forum.com. They are making really nice 1911's right now.
Don't spend more than $800 on a Kimber. Those days are gone. Kimber Gold Combat? Bwaa hahahhah!
XD single stack
Dan Wesson CCO, ECO, Valor
Ed Brown Molan (or any)
Colt CCO, New Agent, 1991, Series 70
Les Baer (any)
If you're budget goes to $2000, take a good long look at the Dan Wesson threads over at 1911forum.com. They are making really nice 1911's right now.
Don't spend more than $800 on a Kimber. Those days are gone. Kimber Gold Combat? Bwaa hahahhah!
Last edited:
76shuvlinoff
Member
some guys don't like em... but
For EDC I use .40,9mm, or .380 because they fit my clothing and stature.
I stopped counting at 1200 rounds with this .45, (and no it wasn't all ball) contrary to all the "information" I read at a certain gun related websites I have never had a misfire stovepipe or any other failure with it so it earned nightstand duty. Back then $2000 would have bought this pistol and $900 in ammo.
For EDC I use .40,9mm, or .380 because they fit my clothing and stature.
I stopped counting at 1200 rounds with this .45, (and no it wasn't all ball) contrary to all the "information" I read at a certain gun related websites I have never had a misfire stovepipe or any other failure with it so it earned nightstand duty. Back then $2000 would have bought this pistol and $900 in ammo.
Wow yours looks almost identical to mine. The only difference is the serial # and it's not off that far. Do you happen to know how to date these pistols? My serial # is a smaller number than yours so I'm guessing mine is older of course. Mine has some holster wear but it's nothing serious. It was like that when I bought it many years ago.
texagun
Member
German-made Sig P220
CommanderCrusty
Member
My S&W M&P .45 has never jammed or malfunctioned. It has a comfortable grip and excellent night sights from the factory. I think it is an excellent choice.
My Para single stack, on the other hand, malfunctioned and had to be sent back for warranty repair. Since then, it has also been 100% with everything from 200 grain semi-wadcutters, to ball to 230 grain hollow points. The 1911 also has a nice grip, great sights and an excellent trigger.
Both are available in compact versions. Good luck with your shopping.
My Para single stack, on the other hand, malfunctioned and had to be sent back for warranty repair. Since then, it has also been 100% with everything from 200 grain semi-wadcutters, to ball to 230 grain hollow points. The 1911 also has a nice grip, great sights and an excellent trigger.
Both are available in compact versions. Good luck with your shopping.
HorseSoldier
Member
In the OP's $2000 budget, I'd be another vote for a 1911 -- that budget allows for a lot of options in the higher end production end of the pool. More than bare bones models from Kimber, Springfield, S&W or Dan Wesson (my vote) are all in that price range.
ColdDayInHell
Member
I have a Glock 36 and I have grown to love it. Check out the Springfield XDs too. If you want more capacity, go for the G30.
I have the sig p220 carry.
http://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p220-carry.aspx
I picked it up with night sights for about 850.
http://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p220-carry.aspx
I picked it up with night sights for about 850.
stinger 327
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In that price range you could get a few of those RIA .45 ACP's.
stinger 327
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That's quality and accuracy right out of the box and it's SA/DA too in the $800 range.
A Glock works for me but you might want to check into the baby Glock (I forget which model number) if the regular size glock doesn't fit your hands well.
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