Would you call the cops?

[pockets]

You are in college, and on the way to class you see a man walking down the road with an AR-15 strapped across his back. Not doing anything abnormal (besides the obvious gun toting), and his dress or demeanor do not alarm you. You live in a state that doesn't allow carry on a college campus. Do you call the cops?

As others have pointed out, there is not enough information here.
* "He's not doing anything abnormal" on a road which you can see while you are "on the way to class".
Seems like a non-issue with only those facts to go on.

We bemoan the so-called nanny state and all the anti-gun groups poking their noses into our perfectly legal business.... yet we can't resist doing so ourselves.

I really do miss those days when I could ride my bicycle down the road with a rifle on my back and no one would bat an eye. Or ride the city bus to take a rifle downtown to a gun shop... and not have 47 cell phones dialing for the SWAT team.

 

[M-Cameron]

Isn't this a forum about guns and gun rights? There seem to be a lot of people here who would call the police on someone who's just walking around with a gun. Would you guys call the cops if the gun was in a case? It's simply ridiculous that when you see someone carrying a rifle you assume he's going to start murdering people.

This is in fact a forum about gun rights......AND responsible gun ownership.......and unfortunately, part of being a responsible gun owner, is knowing the laws and regulations, AND ABIDING BY THEM.

hell, go over to the NFA section on the forum and ask them how to make your AR-15 full auto "without paperwork"..........i can guarantee no one will tell you how to do it, and you will receive a bunch of replies telling you it is illegal.........how come we follow and abide by that law??

So...let me get this straight: 80 million gun owners vs. a statistically insignificant number of folks who commit mass murder. But you see a guy with a rifle and you're more comfortable assuming that he's one of the handful of whackos, not one of the millions upon millions of good guys? Even given his less common choice to travel from point A to point B with his rifle slung instead of slipped into a cloth bag, I can't see the logic.

the flaw with this logic........there are no "good" and "bad" guys.........im sure you know life is not like a movie where "good" guys are clearly defined and can never do any harm, and "bad guys" are instantly identifiable and their actions are always devious.

people are capable of actions ranging from incredible good....to incredible evil. you cant try to predict a persons actions because they are "probably a good guy" or " probably a bad guy"

 

[Sam1911]

This is in fact a forum about gun rights......AND responsible gun ownership.......and unfortunately, part of being a responsible gun owner, is knowing the laws and regulations, AND ABIDING BY THEM.

Abide by these useless and unjust laws, yes. But that is a completely different thing than assisting with, aiding, promoting, and enabling the prosecution of others by them. One is a necessary evil. The other is despicable.

hell, go over to the NFA section on the forum and ask them how to make your AR-15 full auto "without paperwork"..........i can guarantee no one will tell you how to do it, and you will receive a bunch of replies telling you it is illegal.........how come we follow and abide by that law??

Agreed, however, no one here would be expected to call the police and report on someone who did. We don't caution people against illegal conversions and unregistered machine guns because such weapons are EVIL, wrong, or bad. We do so to keep people out of trouble with these laws, while we work to change them.

the flaw with this logic........there are no "good" and "bad" guys.........im sure you know life is not like a movie where "good" guys are clearly defined and can never do any harm, and "bad guys" are instantly identifiable and their actions are always devious.

But here, there is a person who is either a) going someplace while carrying a rifle, with no intent of harming anyone, or b) a psychotic who's about to murder people. Really, there's no middle ground. He either needs to be removed right away or he's of no concern to anyone and should be left alone. No other possibility really is relevant to this conversation.

people are capable of actions ranging from incredible good....to incredible evil. you cant try to predict a persons actions because they are "probably a good guy" or " probably a bad guy"

BUT many here ARE doing so. They are making a choice that this is probably someone who needs to be taken off the streets and locked away for a long time -- and then denied any firearm rights for life -- because they are probably up to no good. If we're going to go assuming, MY assumption is by VERY FAR, the more statistically likely.

 

[cambeul41]

I would probably not call the law.

Years ago, when I was still a student, it seemed that about once a year, a student determinedly marched across campus with a rifle or shotgun clutched to his chest. When asked where he was going, the answer was often "To kill professor so-and-so."

Rather than calling the law, he would be disarmed by other students, taken to a beer hall (legal at age 18 then and there), filled with beer, and encouraged to weepingly purge himself of his woes. The gun would be returned to the owner (sometimes it had been borrowed) days later when the crisis seemed to be past.

To the best of my knowledge, no problems resulted from so doing.

Now I teach in Detroit. Guns are legal on campus -- just not in the classroom, but neither students nor LEOs are universally aware of that. Occasionally I have reason to ask a student if he or she is carrying in class. Of course the answer is always, "No." I then say that if he or she was, I would ask them to go lock it in their car. Sometimes, the student feels the need to go to the restroom. I feel no need to report my suspicions.

 

[jerkface11]

go over to the NFA section on the forum and ask them how to make your AR-15 full auto "without paperwork"..........i can guarantee no one will tell you how to do it, and you will receive a bunch of replies telling you it is illegal.........how come we follow and abide by that law??

I didn't suggest walking around a school with a rifle is a good idea. I didn't tell anyone to do it. I said I WOULD NOT CALL THE POLICE ONE SOMEONE FOR IT. I also would not call the police on someone for having an unregistered machinegun. It simply is not my responsibility to help enforce laws that create victimless crimes.

 

[BSA1]

Judging from some of the responses it looks like we have a loooong way to go to convince only gun owners that merely openly carrying a firearm is not a crime or indiction to commit a crime.

The larger premise of the question is what is the difference between social responsibility and being a agent for the government? Or put more bluntly when do I feel justified reporting a activity that may be illegal but is harmless because I don't approve of it?

The O.P. chose to use a black rifle in is example probably because of the strong anti-gun feelings it provokes even among gun owners. I wonder if he would feel the need to report the individual if he was carrying a flintlock rifle?

Much work and education has been required to convince lawmakers, the public and other gun owners that citizens wanting to carrying a concealed weapon is not a mentally unhinged individual looking for the chance to engage in a gun battle.

That work has laid the groundwork for concealed carry without the approval of Big Sis.


It sounds like open carry has a even tougher battle.

 

[JustinJ]

A guy walking down the street with what appears to be dynamite strapped to his chest may also just be walking to a job on a movie set. I'd err on the side of caution.

 

[M-Cameron]

Judging from some of the responses it looks like we have a loooong way to go to convince only gun owners that merely openly carrying a firearm is not a crime or indiction to commit a crime.

Much work and education has been required to convince lawmakers, the public and other gun owners that citzens wanting to carrying a concealed weapon is a mentally unhinged individual looking for the chance to engage in a gun battle.

It sounds like open carry has a even tougher battle.

according to the hypothetical scenario in question........it is in fact a crime, that is the matter of this discussion.

i dont think anyone here has a problem with people legally OC a firearm.......its when the person intentionally OCs in a prohibited area that cause people to question his motives.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Call the cops? Heck no! It wouldn't even cross my mind to do so. I have no idea how or why this hypothetical person came to be there with his rifle(car broke down on the way to or from a range,had to walk didn't want to leave the rifle in the unattended car? etc..?) Too many lives have been disrupted by "concerned citizens" calling police on a perceived "crime".

 

[BSA1]

Good point.

What about people who conceal carry in prohibited and areas posted no guns?
They are intentionally violating the law.

 

[zxcvbob]

i dont think anyone here has a problem with people legally OC a firearm.

If you believe that, just check out any of the "OC vs CC" threads.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

What about people who conceal carry in prohibited and areas posted no guns?
They are intentionally violating the law.

Nope wouln't call the law on them either. First off if they are carrying concealed(and doing a good job of concealing) I wouldn't even know they were carrying in violation of the prohibition.

 

[Sam1911]

What about people who conceal carry in prohibited and areas posted no guns?
They are intentionally violating the law.

"Ohhh hall monitor! Jimmy's chewing gum in line again! Shouldn't he get sent to the Principal's office?"

 

[CoRoMo]

I walk around everyday trying to find people who are making mistakes. Then I point a finger of accusation at them and let it be known how poorly they are behaving and I highlight their mishaps for everyone to see.

Poking my nose in other people's business makes me feel like a real big man.

 

[fallout mike]

Bsa, just bc there is a "no guns" sign doesn't mean its the law. I could put a no guns sign in my yard. Doesn't make it the law.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Jimmy's chewing gum in line again!

Hey! Chewing gum keeps me from getting OUT of line!

 

[Ashcons]

but common sense dictates

Ah yes, common sense, the good old fall-back discussion killing trump card and gold-paved path to malum prohibidum. To some people, it's common sense that guns are scary and bad (especially EBRs and handguns) and should be outlawed or at least registered and limited in capacity to 1 round, since anything more is excessive; those rounds should also be microstamped because firearm crime could be traced back to the gun owner as an effective and efficient way to fight violent crime. Think of the children!

In the hypothetical OP, I don't see a reason for calling the police, but possibly (is there any reason on observation to be concerned) the campus security to keep an eye on him. In all likeliness, 911 is already fielding multiple hysterical MWAG calls.

Back around '03 or '04, I got stuck in the student union building after work for an hour because a student called in MWAG on campus. My buddies and I were in a building with a wall of windows and glass doors comprising the front of the building. We were instructed to stay out of sight, so we chilled behind a reception desk area and BSed while we wondered when we would get to leave.

The police could not find anyone, but eventually the MWAG went to talk to them as he had been inside the dorms by the time the building was locked down. Turns out he had taken his paintball gun to some communications class for a paper/speech. On his walk back to the dorms around dusk, some girl thought it was a handgun, so she called 911.

I'd be more worried about a fatality occurring due to an MWAG on campus call to the police than a campus shooting event.

I've called 911 twice in my life. In both events it was for reasonable suspicion that emergency workers were needed immediately.

 

[InkEd]

Yes, I would report it. It is not normal to walk around a metropolitan area with a rifle sling over your shoulder in the United States. Furthermore, it should be carried in a bag or hardcase, if not need for possible immediate use. I support both open and concealed carry. Moreover, I support responsible gun ownership.

 

[Sam1911]

Moreover, I support responsible gun ownership.

And you're willing to enforce your opinion of what's "responsible" by having someone arrested and stripped of rights & freedoms?

 

[Bobson]

And you're willing to enforce your opinion of what's "responsible" by having someone arrested and stripped of rights & freedoms?

I'm willing to "enforce" my opinions by informing authorities of a possible crime in progress. He may or may not be arrested, but he wouldn't be stripped of any rights or freedoms (eg, he wouldn't be prosecuted) unless he had broken a law. Therefore, if he does lose any rights or freedoms, he deserved to. Ignorance of the law isn't an excuse.

 

[JustinJ]

And you're willing to enforce your opinion of what's "responsible" by having someone arrested and stripped of rights & freedoms?

I don't see calling police as "enforcing" anything. The police do the enforcing, hopefully based on law. We must all operate and make decisions by what we consider reasonable. Some people, and even cultures, may believe it reasonable for a man to smack his wife. Would one be "enforcing their opinion of whats reasonable" by calling the police if they witnessed a man smack his wife in the street?

 

[Sam1911]

Therefore, if he does lose any rights or freedoms, he deserved to. Ignorance of the law isn't an excuse.

Well, here we are again with what this person "deserves." I don't believe anyone "deserves" to lose their freedom and property for this unconstitutional law. Ignorance of the law is no excuse when you're charged. I have no interest in helping put someone in front of a judge because they didn't know the law -- or really for any victimless nada-crime.

 

[Agsalaska]

I cannot decide if this is a great thread or not but some of the responses are absolutely killing me. Maybe he didnt know he was breaking the law. Really? I wouldnt infringe on his rights. Really? I can think of lots of reasons he might be carrying that gun. Really? It could be a toy? Really? I wouldnt call but I might call campus security. Really? And last but not least, I would not call because I dont agree with the law. uhuh.

 

[tacdad]

Perfect scenario why concealed carry should be ALOUD on campus with a state issued permit. V-Tech would not have gone as bad if a willing citizen would have whipped out his CCW and shot the guy. End of story! It's this "protectionist" attitude that gets us and our kids killed in situations like that not the "law abiding" people who should have EVERY right to protect themselves.

"When seconds count the cops are minutes away."

 

[Claude Clay]

the scenario--well, id be weary of him but not call anyone.
id also think him not to bright to present himself openly in that manor
given the perceptions of many today. at the least--case it.

that will not change his intent, just our perception.