is that xd grip safety really necessary?

Boats said:

Your experience is individual. There's plenty of documentation out there that with Glocks, mileage varies greatly as to getting unwanted red racing stripes.

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...because there are a hell of a lot of Glocks out there!!! It's just the numbers.

The vast majority of people are happily going about their day with their Glocks, and they aren't as vocal as me.

I'm a below average shooter, and I'm kind of lazy. My Glocks have been no problem in the safety department. I trust my life with these tools without a second thought.

...because there are a hell of a lot of Glocks out there!!! It's just the numbers.

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Yep. 65% of American LE use Glock's.

"There have been way too many ND's over the years with Glocks due to careless re-holstering, clothes or fingers in the trigger guard, etc. that a grip safety would have prevented."

Unfortunately I know first hand of one of these incidents. While not a glock, an officer had a ND with a SW M&P. While the officer claims the gun "just went off in the holster." THe working theory is that upon reholstering (why the gun was out of the holster in the first place I have no idea) his finger may have incidentally been in the trigger gaurd and it went off. Regardless, something inadvertantly pulled the trigger, which could have been prevented with a backstrap safety.

Frankly I don't care one way or the other, I don't own a glock or xd and likely never will.

I have no skin in this game.

I will say, I am consistantly turned off on glocks or xd mostly because their fan community is both argumentative and juvenile.

As this thread portrays.

Kool aid drinking has no place in the serious business of self defense.

Reality needs to take precedance and there are no opposing teams.

I will say I have noticed the M & P crowd seems very mature and level headed.

CZ people are the best however

But to say that a safety mechanism has no place is frankly silly.

4 rules, great. What's going to save you when you screw up one of them?

A safety. Owning a glock does not make you a perfect shooter who always follows the rules.

It's was put there for the all of thre athletes that want to stick it in their sweatpants when they go to a stripper club. Then when it goes sliding down and you grab it in a hurry.......

Maybe not Necessary but a recent poll here on THR showed that something like 70% were in favor of it.

I guess since i love my 1911's i enjoy the grip safety on all 6 of my XD's.

JOe

There have been way too many ND's over the years with Glocks due to careless re-holstering, clothes or fingers in the trigger guard, etc. that a grip safety would have prevented.

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Paying more attention to the pistol and what the user was doing may have prevented them as well.

needed? no, a good addition? in my opinion, yes

it is a neverending argument that will never be settled as many people think there is no need for such a thing on any gun. Until a gun is somehow wired into your head and the trigger is lost for a mental trigger, there will always be what people will call accidental discharges... who is to say where the line of accidental v negligent is drawn? is it negligent if the gun fires while holstering, finger off the trigger? We fall into routines and things happen at times to cause something to throw that off and accidents happen. that is where something like the xd's grip safety comes in to play. In no way a replacement for caution or awareness but helpful all the same.

is that xd grip safety really necessary?

Apparently not, if it does not even prevent drop fires.
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=9810809

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Leon the XD has a striker block that does not disengage unless the grip safety is depressed & the trigger pulled at the same time. The article did not say the gun was dropped. It said it was either the result of the gun being dropped or mishandled. I would lay odds on operator error. The fact this guy was trying to check a firearm with a chambered round doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in his competence level for me. No matter how many safeties a gun has there can still be a negligent discharge if the operator is not competent.

Quote:
is that xd grip safety really necessary?

Apparently not, if it does not even prevent drop fires.
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=9810809
Leon the XD has a striker block that does not disengage unless the grip safety is depressed & the trigger pulled at the same time. The article did not say the gun was dropped. It said it was either the result of the gun being dropped or mishandled. I would lay odds on operator error. The fact this guy was trying to check a firearm with a chambered round doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in his competence level for me. No matter how many safeties a gun has there can still be a negligent discharge if the operator is not competent.



+1

I have no opinion, safety or not. But as an outsider to the discussion, there is simply no way that this news story 'shows' an XD goes off when it's dropped.

I am an experienced shooter, not a newbie. Let's just leave it at that.

The primary reason I went with the XD over Glock was the grip feel and handling, the XD felt right, the Glock did not. The grip safety was a very close 2nd as a deciding factor.

With well over 10K rounds total through my 3 different XD's, I've not had a single safety related malfunction. In fact, the only malfunction I've had were related directly to my crappy reloads.

Wow. There's so much disinformation in this thread it makes my eyes hurt.

Straight Shooter - I pretty much agree with ya on every point you made, except one: GENERALLY, when someone experiences a "Life or Death" situation, the autonomic nervous system overrides the peripheral, resulting in a myriad of physiological abnormalities. Auditory exclusion ("I didn't hear the shots!"), tunnel vision, loss of coordination, digestion/peristalsis stops momentarily, and the blood shunts from your extremeties to your core. These factors can result in diminished manual dexterity and weakened grips.

Weak enough to fail to disengage a grip safety? I don't know. Personally, I like the idea of a grip safety. Like it's been said, it may prevent a ND when reholstering.. and YES, I reholster my DA/SA weapons with my thumb over the hback of the hammer and "push" it into the holster... so it is VERY possible to reholster a firearm without a firing grip on it. Still have the same three fingers wrapped around the handgrip, too... index finger along the side of the frame/holster.

it may prevent a ND when reholstering.. and YES, I reholster my DA/SA weapons with my thumb over the hback of the hammer and "push" it into the holster... so it is VERY possible to reholster a firearm without a firing grip on it. Still have the same three fingers wrapped around the handgrip, too... index finger along the side of the frame/holster.

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ding ding ding....

The primary reason I went with the XD over Glock was the grip feel and handling, the XD felt right, the Glock did not. The grip safety was a very close 2nd as a deciding factor.

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I agree. I’ve never had a a problem with the XD grip safety nor the grip safeties on my 1911’s. When I first learned to shoot with my weak hand, that weak hand didn’t engage a bone stock colt grip safety. My issue, and it helped me correct my grip issue. Other than that, grip safeties are a non issue with me. I don’t care if they are there or not. If you take the time to become proficient with your weapon, muscle memory will take care of the rest. My thumb flips my thumb safeties on and off when drawing and re-holstering while without me really having to think about…a grip safety is no different imo.

If grip safeties are so unnecessary, poorly designed ideas or render weapons useless in stressful situations….why do so many military specialists and swat teams use 1911’s?

I love my 1911’s, glocks and I’m contemplating getting an XD 3.8. I hate these freaking “my gun is the greatest and yours is stupid because of XXXXXX reason” threads. You don’t like a grip safety? Stick to glock or m&p or whatever. If you’re like me and enjoy shooting anything that goes bang, you won’t really care about why grip safeties suck.

I’m not a glock hater either. I just bought my first one. I’m currently drawing and dry firing my new Glock as much as possible because I draw and my front sight automatically goes on target ½” higher than the rears. Doesn’t mean the the grip angle sucks, it just means I am not used to it. I’m uncomfortable with that and the trigger pull, but I’ll get used to both and possibly modify the trigger pull after 1-2k rounds.

hankdatank1362,

Well stated.

I am basing my opinion on what I have read about the physiological response to a defensive shooting, not from personal experience (thankfully).

From everything that I have been told and read I would expect a loss of fine motor skills. That is why trainers teach racking the slide by palming it instead of using fingers or instead of using the slide stop during a reload for example. I would say that gripping the gun would be a gross motor skill.

There will be an adrenalin dump which is pure energy.

Also, based on my experience, during stressful (non lethal) situations, a car accident for example, people tend to clamp down on whatever they are holding.

This is the reasoning behind my opinion.

You Glock fanatics are sounding like you have to hold on to that XD with a steel crushing death grip to deactivate that cursed grib safety.After reading this thread I did an experament with my XD45 and my dad's HS2000. In fact it takes hardly any pressure at all to deactivate it. I held them both to where the only pressure I was giving was pulling the trigger and it still dropped the stricker. I didn't even have to depress it halfway. They probably would of jammed from limbwristing but so would a Glock and most other handguns. I do not currently own a Glock but that does not Make my a Glock hating fool. In fact I don't hate any firearm as long as it owned by a fellow freedom loving gunowner. I purchased the XD45 because I wanted a double stacked .45 and could not find a Taurus 24/7 in stock, the G21 just did not fit my hand, but the XD was used for $450 with three mags and to fit my hand better then the G21. I have fired a friends G17 and loved it. If given the chance on a G17 or 19 I would jump on it and would look back.

I personally fail to see the problem with the grip safety, it's inclusion assures you'll have a proper grip on the weapon to fire it. And has been said prior here, it hasn't seemed to be an issue with the 1911's all these years. Actually, since the first handgun I ever shot was a 1911, the Springfield XD seemed like an old friend to me from the first time I shot mine.

I have an XD45acp and I actually like the grip safety, just my opinion. It's like the beautiful bastard child of a 1911 and a glock.

the Springfield XD seemed like an old friend to me from the first time I shot mine.

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I shot a friend's XD 45 today on some of my father's land while at a family get together. He never shot a 1911 and I've never fired an xd45. I let him fire off a few from my Kimber that I ccw. He loved it.

He complained about his XD's accuracy, or at least the fact that he had not learned to shoot it well. When I grabbed it and squeezed off a few, I'll freely admit that I loved it better than any glock I ever shot or the glock I own. It came to point of aim rapidly and I was hitting a coke can every shot from 15 yards from the first trigger pull ever. I can forsee an XD 3.8 being my next possible addition. Being a 1911 guy trying to adjust to my new glock, the XD just came on target for me and felt like an old friend as you put it. He had straight 8 heine shots that I fell in love with on that gun. I may grab a set of those to replace the meprolights on my Pro CDP II.

It would be much safer to mandate everyone carry ammo separate from the gun and to make the loading of firearms illegal.

:banghead:

I will say I have noticed the M & P crowd seems very mature and level headed.

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Yeah, but that's because there's only two of them.
They just sign up on the forum using lots of different names.

CZ people are the best however.

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They're too tired to argue after lugging their heavy 75B's around all day.

Not needed, and aside from a range toy 1911, I won't own a gun with one

Glocks very often fire without the finger pulling the trigger.

I saw it happen, about 10 rows in front of me, at the ACC BB tourney about 5 or so years ago.

An off duty LEO was "adjusting" his sitting position when his Glock got caught on a piece of cloth or something and "BANG."

His finger never touched the trigger.

Texshooter said:

Glocks very often fire without the finger pulling the trigger.

I saw it happen, about 10 rows in front of me, at the ACC BB tourney about 5 or so years ago.

An off duty LEO was "adjusting" his sitting position when his Glock got caught on a piece of cloth or something and "BANG."

His finger never touched the trigger.

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I hope that this was a sarcastic post.

Obviously if something gets caught on the trigger and pulls the trigger it will go off. The Glock does not know what a finger as apposed to any other object feels like.

Glocks very often fire without the finger pulling the trigger.

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O'rly?

An off duty LEO was "adjusting" his sitting position when his Glock got caught on a piece of cloth or something and "BANG."

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It is not Glock's fault people buy crappy holsters.