10mm with light rail for home defense

[eflatminor]

I've decided I want a 10mm full size autoloader with lightrail for home defense. Is anyone aware of a platform offered in 10mm with a lightrail other than the Glock? I have no problem buying the 20 even though I'm an all steel 1911 guy at heart. Nevertheless, I can appreciate the Glock for what it is. Just want to make sure I've explored all options.

Thanks!

 

[Alphazulu6]

HUGE power for a Home defense load and it will penetrate many many walls.... Just remember that you are responsible for that bullet no matter where it goes (even though the BG).

Be Safe!

 

[Jason_G]

I can't think of anything but the Glock offhand. If I had my choice in 10mm, I would like a Dan Wesson Pointman Seven, but there's no rail on it. If you are planning on using the rail to mount a laser, then you can use some Crimson Trace laser grips and you won't need the rail. If you want it to mount a white light then that's a different story.
Good luck with the search

Jason

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

http://marina.fortunecity.com/harbour/347/10mm02.html
There's a list of several 10mms.

 

[Myself]

The Witness polymer series come with a light rail. The only other one I know of is a custom made 1911 by Reeder and that is a deep pockets item.


http://www.reedercustomguns.com/1911/ultimate10.htm

Remembered another fairly rare 10mm which is the laseraim. I believe they were a sequel to the parker arms 10mm which had a spotty quality history. I do not know if the rail on the laseraim 10mm was the standard configuration. There happens to be one for sale on GB right now if you want a look. (not mine nor do I know the seller, etc.)

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=74883188

 

[Quiet]

The EAA Witness polymer series with rails are not offered in 10mmAuto.

AFAIK, the only current non-custom production 10mmAuto on the market with a rail is the Glock Model 20 and Model 29.

 

[leadcounsel]

1. Light rails may be overrated.

2. 10mm may be too much handgun for home defense.

 

[ClarkEMyers]

Try Wilson Combat:"Some full size models are also available in 10mm"

Try Wilson Combat:

Some full size models are also available in 10mm

- and where Wilson leads Nighthawk is likely to go as well.

 

[camslam]

1. Light rails may be overrated.

In my opinion for a home defense weapon there is no way they are over rated. Most law enforcement let alone general citizenry aren't the best when it comes to light and handgun operation or tactics. Light rails are a great option for home defense.

2. 10mm may be too much handgun for home defense.

10mm is a lot of firepower for home defense, but that may be what you are looking for. At least you know it will do the job. As for a shooting platform, my brother in law carries his Glock 20 in his truck for conceal carry and it is a sweet shooting gun.

 

[Onmilo]

10mm can be purchased in factory loaded reduced power versions that all but duplicate the .40 caliber Smith and Wesson ballistics.
There may be better size choices available but the 10mm can be far more versatile than the .40
I wouldn't recommend full power 200 grain TMJ bear loads for personal protection against human attack but you aren't limited to this choice and this choice alone with the 10mm.

Light rails have a place.
It always amuses me when people say lights on handguns are stupid and uneccessary and then advocate having a flashlight on hand when securing perimeters at night, duh.

You can add an accessory light rail to most any 1911 style 10mm, there are aftermarket rails available that will cowitness with about any handgun light now on the market.

 

[10-Ring]

The only one I can think of is the G20, but maybe you could build a 1911 to fit your needs?

 

[finalcut]

CZ makes a great one - but 10mm for home def is about as bad a choice as you can get.

 

[tkarter]

Locks are the best home defense and a 10mm is like using a bazooka in parking lot to get into the car you locked yourself out of.

You will most likely hurt as many as you are protecting by trying that. Not a good option imho.

tk

 

[Mortech]

If he lives in the boonies like I do , use a bazooka . If something goes bump out here it could be a cougar . Not all of us are fortunate (read cursed) to live in the city or over populated suburbs .

 

[bigmedicine]

eflatminor,
The 10mm is a great cartridge. As far as being "too much" gun, I guess the .357 mag has no place in home defense, either. Use your 10mm and enjoy it - if you truly worry about overpenetration, there are several routes you can go to address it (decreased velocity, rapid-opening hollow-points, etc). I would agree that some of the super-hot stuff with hard-cast solids wouldn't be ideal, but that is hardly a 10mm specific issue.
I am the furthest thing from a glock guy, so I cannot really give a fair endorsement. I am a diehard 1911 and recently added a light rail from Novak's. It looks great and works even better. http://www.novaksights.com/novak 1911 tactical light rail.html

Give it a look - opens up all sorts of options for us 1911 guys.

 

[W Turner]

10mm too much for HD?

If that's true, so is the .357 mag, lite loaded .44 mag, and any rifle caliber.

If you are smart in your load selection, a Glock in 10mm is just as good and many would argue better (including me), than many other service calibers or platforms for HD.

Stick with 135 gr. and 150 gr. loads and you will be fine. They are no more likely to blow thru multiple walls than any other commonly recommended HD weapon.

- To answer the original post

The only production 10mm with a rail that I know of is the Glock 20. You could buy a steel 1911 in 10mm and have EGW or similar add a rail if you wanted. A used Colt Delta Elite runs $6-800 depending on condition or a Kimber Eclipse in 10mm runs about $1K. I'm SWAGging here, but having the rail added should be around $200 or so.

Bull

 

[sturmgewehr]

It always amuses me when people say lights on handguns are stupid and uneccessary and then advocate having a flashlight on hand when securing perimeters at night, duh.

I think the reason people say this is because if your light is mounted to your gun, you must sweep people with the muzzle of a loaded weapon to see what's in front of you... this includes your family if you're clearing a house. With a light in one hand and a gun in the other, you are able to see without covering people with the muzzle or otherwise pointing your weapon in an unsafe direction.

If you're walking around your property investigating a bump in the night and you point your weapon at someone (perhaps a police officer on call) you've just escalated a situation you didn't need to had you not mounted your light to your gun. For military/police the light rail is more practical than it is for a civilian protecting their home, but that's not to say they are useless for civilians. You just need to realize the ramifications of using your handgun as a flash light and understand it's not always ideal.

 

[Coronach]

1. If it is too much gun for HD, then it is too much gun for anything else, except maybe handgun hunting. Last time I checked, pretty much all pistol rounds were mediocre stoppers. Overpenetration is always a concern, but bullet selection can ameliorate that, and it is a concern for all rounds that are effective stoppers.

2. Light rails, especially on a defensive pistol, are in no way "overrated". Unless you can see in the dark, or you're so cool that the sun shines upon you 24/7, you need some way to see your target. Rule IV always applies.

Mike

 

[mpmarty]

I live in the boonies and am as likely to face a black bear as a home invader. My HD pistol is a 10mm with WW 175gr Silvertips. My 90 lumen light under the XD45 is wonderful, I just wish SA made it in 10mm and yes, I have told SA that and they respond that they have no plans to bring out an XD in 10mm. With the light rail mounted light on the XD I have the choice of shooting the perp or just blinding him.

 

[sturmgewehr]

2. Light rails, especially on a defensive pistol, are in no way "overrated". Unless you can see in the dark, or you're so cool that the sun shines upon you 24/7, you need some way to see your target. Rule IV always applies.

Did anyone here say lights were useless? No. It helps to read what's written and not make assumptions, or to put words in peoples mouths.

See the Surefire next to my handgun on my night stand? Do you know why it's there? So I may see in the dark. Do you know why it's not mounted to my handgun? Because 99.99% of the time when I reach for my gun to go check something out downstairs it's a cat that's knocked something over, or the dog doing something goofy. If I go outside it's either a raccoon or a neighbor kid playing in my pond... or something similar. I don't need to go from room to room pointing my handgun at everything in the house including pets or even the wife who comes home late every once in a while...

Using your handgun as a flashlight in your own home with family members present is dangerous. Do you see a need to cover family members, neighbors or even pets with loaded handguns just so you can see in the dark when other less dangerous options are available? I mean, I know it looks tacti-cool to have gadgets hanging off your handgun, but is it really the most practical thing to do?

With proper training having a light in your weak hand is just as good as having it mounted under your pistol, plus it affords you more possibilities in safely using it whereas you're quite restricted once you mount it to your handgun.

There are plenty of times I mount a light to a handgun, but I don't see any benefit to doing it with your home protection handgun when other more viable options are available, hence my picture above.

 

[Coronach]

Did anyone here say lights were useless? No. It helps to read what's written and not make assumptions, or to put words in peoples mouths.

1. Light rails may be overrated.

 

[sturmgewehr]

Did he say lights were useless? You assumed that because he thinks rails are overrated that he's saying lights are useless. I didn't see such a statement.

Unless you can see in the dark, or you're so cool that the sun shines upon you 24/7,

 

[Coronach]

To expand...

Did anyone here say lights were useless? No. It helps to read what's written and not make assumptions, or to put words in peoples mouths.

The same might be advised of you. Lightrails were said to be overrated (okay, "might be overrated"). I said they were not.

See the Surefire next to my handgun on my night stand? Do you know why it's there? So I may see in the dark. Do you know why it's not mounted to my handgun? Because 99.99% of the time when I reach for my gun to go check something out downstairs it's a cat that's knocked something over, or the dog doing something goofy. If I go outside it's either a raccoon or a neighbor kid playing in my pond... or something similar. I don't need to go from room to room pointing my handgun at everything in the house including pets or even the wife who comes home late every once in a while...

If you saw a shot of my night stand, you would see a flashlight there as well, for exactly the reasons you mentioned. If you saw a picture of my bedside gun, you'd notice a flashlight on it, too. I have yet to read any rule that says that if you attach a flashlight to your gun you must divest yourself of all other forms of portable illumination.

Using your handgun as a flashlight in your own home with family members present is dangerous. Do you see a need to cover family members, neighbors or even pets with loaded handguns just so you can see in the dark when other less dangerous options are available?

This assumes you only have one light.

I mean, I know it looks tacti-cool to have gadgets hanging off your handgun, but is it really the most practical thing to do?

Yes, it absolutely is.

With proper training having a light in your weak hand is just as good as having it mounted under your pistol, plus it affords you more possibilities in safely using it whereas you're quite restricted once you mount it to your handgun.

Again, this assumes one light. And I assure you that if you do some timed work with your handgun, you'll find that a light attached to the weapon is a lot better than one held in a surefire or harries grip. Is a handheld light a workable solution? Absolutely. Is it the best solution? Absolutely not.

There are plenty of times I mount a light to a handgun, but I don't see any benefit to doing it with your home protection handgun when other more viable options are available, hence my picture above.

What could be a better use of a rail-mounted light than home defense, for 99% of the people on this board?

1. You don't need to find a holster for it.

2. If you're pulling out the gun, it is almost certainly at night.

3. You're probably just waking up, and might have to grab stuff quickly.

4. The light is attached. If you find the gun, you've found a light. For the reasons you mention, you might want to find both, but worst case scenario is a person actually entering your BR. You might only have time to grab your gun...sure would be nice if it could illuminate the threat, too.

5. Redundancy. If your main light is dead or otherwise inoperable, having one on your gun adds a backup (left on the weapon or removed).

Mike

 

[sturmgewehr]

If I lived in Baghdad I might want multiple lights, but as I live in a upper middle class neighborhood with an alarm on my house and a relatively low crime area... I don't feel much of a need to have two lights for personal protection. When I go outside to see what's going on I usually slip the pistol into my right rear pocket (if I don't already have a holster on) and make a modest effort to keep my weapon hidden. Why? Because I don't want to alarm my neighbors or otherwise compromise my advantage to a BG that I'm armed. Rarely will I need to resort to lethal force, and I certainly don't need to get arrested for brandishing a handgun in city limits when I sneak up on some kid in my yard and scare the life out of him.

If you have two lights, more power to ya. I don't see anything wrong with your solution except that it's over kill. If you practice with them as much as you should, I imagine your battery cost is roughly twice what mine is.

To each their own.

By the way, the M&P40 link in your sig line; that's a pretty cool endeavor.

 

[Coronach]

Rechargable CR123As for practice.

It's not really that much overkill. I have a small light I carry with me 24/7 (tactically useful, but more useful in finding dropped objects, performing odd jobs, etc). I just drop that on my nightstand. The light attached to the gun just lives there, so now I have two lights within arms reach of the bed, without putting any thought or effort into it.

And the M&P project is just a publication of the data I keep in a spreadsheet for all of my guns. I figured that everyone was wondering how well the m&p worked, I might as well publish my data.

Mike