jamestlester
Member
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2009
- Messages
- 23
*bee's hive Doh!
What do you mean you think you think you answered the age old question?!?
Well, I hoped to shed some light on both pistols and help people in their decision making process. I chose the Glock to represent the polymer pistol arena because it is probably the best of any of them, but for most of my points you could sub in whatever. Same for the 1911. You could probably sub in a beretta for most of the points as well.
For starters, lets talk cartridge. (edited) A pistol's philosophy of use is this: to serve as a defensive, carryable weapon for use out to 30 yards. It is supposed to INSTANTANEOUSLY put an end to the charging junkie. Him dropping 30 seconds later is him dropping 30 seconds too late. Thus, the bigger, slower, more expansive tumbling bullet with the more stopping power is ideal. Any cartridge that will drop a man instantly is an ideal handgun caliber, but for the sake of this review I will use 45 ACP for comparison.
Now, lets talk about weight. (edited) Straight out of the box, 1911s are going to way more than a Glock 21 or 21sf. Most people don't find weight the deciding factor. Weight doesn't really matter if you can't hit the target. But LEO's with more gear and regular firearm training need every weight savings they can get. Which brings up the next point.
In terms of pointability, the 1911 is more pointable out of the box. But if you have time to train defensively with a Glock, or a 1911 for that matter, it will start to point where you want it to straight out of the holster for either gun. Bottom line: the Glock will take more training to get on the same level of pointability achievable with the 1911.
In terms of accuracy, the 1911 wins out of the box. It has a better trigger pull than that of a Glock. The Glock's trigger pull can be modded to be in the ball park of that of a 1911, but if you mod your gun you better put a few hundred rounds down the barrel to ensure reliability. And if you have to put a few hundred rounds down the new Glock barrel for reliability's sake, then that sort of evens the reliability playing field because a few hundred rounds down a 1911 barrel will certainly bring out any flaws. But, again, the Glock can be accurate, it will just take more training time to have the equivalent accuracy and pointability of that of a 1911. As for barrel rise, it is not a major factor and can be "trained out" of a Glock owner. But for most folks, the 1911 will be easier to shoot accurately than a Glock 21.
As for conceilability, the 1911 wins hands down. It has a slimmer, inline frame whereas the Glock has a fatter and boxier frame, plus the Glock magazines are harder to conceal meaning most people won't have their extra mags in critical situations.
Ergonomically, it depends on your hand. For most people, though, the 1911 will be more ergonomic than the Glock 21 sf. But, again, it depends on the person. Go to your gun store and try both out. (if they don't have both they aren't too good of a gun store. If they say they do, be SURE you ask for the glock 21 AND 21 sf. The Glock 21 sf has a reduced backstrap size to accommodate smaller hands.)
Magazine capacity is a little tricky. 1911 owners feel that they can handle 99% of situations with 8 rounds. And they will be more likely to have extra magazines with them because they are easier to carry concealed. Glock 21 and 21 sf owners feel better with 13 rounds between magazine changes. But a greater magazine capacity adds (a little bit) more weight and really takes away from the gun's pointability. The Glock 21 sf solved some of this by reducing the backstrap size, but a 1911 will still point better out of the box than a Glock 21 sf will. A Glock 21 sf can point as well as a 1911, but again, it will take more training to achieve the same level of proficiency on a Glock 21 sf than that of a 1911. And, a Glock owner is less likely to have his extra mags because they are harder to carry concealed.
Dependability is where the Glock design gets its stars. The 1911 design is dependable, but it really depends on the quality of the gun. The Glock design is more dependable than the average 1911 design, but that not to say that the 1911 design is not reliable. It really boils down to "is my gun going to fail at the critical moment?" If a 1911 owner has put 500 rounds through his new 1911 without a problem then he can say "yes" with confidence. But a Glock owner knows his new or used Glock pistol will work the first time, every time. I would not trust a NIB 1911 in a critical situation, period. But I would defiantly trust it if I had put a few hundred rounds down the barrel.
Looks are completely dependent on the person. Some dudes are "wood and steel ONLY" and others try to be "tacticool", but most folks would say the 1911 is better looking and more imposing. Although, that shouldn't be the deciding factor. DON'T buy a gun based purely on looks.
And as for price, the Glock will probably win, but they are both within the same ballpark. New Glock 21s on gunbroker.com, as of Dec. 2009, cost $475-$500. A new 1911 of good manufacture can cost from $500-$1200 depending on both the manufacturer and the bells and whistles.
The better gun depends on the user's philosophy of use. I would hazard to say that most people would be better suited to the 1911, but it is ultimately up to the person's situation in life (eg line of work, available funds, part of town they live in, ect.)
I hope this has been useful, and I would appreciate constructive criticism. I tried to be unbiased and I, at one time or another thought the 1911 was crap and the 21 sf was the way to go. I now think, for most people, myself included, the 1911 is the better choice. But I've been on both sides of the argument.
Neither the 1911 nor the Glock 21 or 21 sf is an end all, be all pistol. :banghead: Lets shake hands and put some lead downrange instead of using our pistols against one another in duels. (I seriously hope that hasn't happened over the 1911-Glock debate)
What do you mean you think you think you answered the age old question?!?
Well, I hoped to shed some light on both pistols and help people in their decision making process. I chose the Glock to represent the polymer pistol arena because it is probably the best of any of them, but for most of my points you could sub in whatever. Same for the 1911. You could probably sub in a beretta for most of the points as well.
For starters, lets talk cartridge. (edited) A pistol's philosophy of use is this: to serve as a defensive, carryable weapon for use out to 30 yards. It is supposed to INSTANTANEOUSLY put an end to the charging junkie. Him dropping 30 seconds later is him dropping 30 seconds too late. Thus, the bigger, slower, more expansive tumbling bullet with the more stopping power is ideal. Any cartridge that will drop a man instantly is an ideal handgun caliber, but for the sake of this review I will use 45 ACP for comparison.
Now, lets talk about weight. (edited) Straight out of the box, 1911s are going to way more than a Glock 21 or 21sf. Most people don't find weight the deciding factor. Weight doesn't really matter if you can't hit the target. But LEO's with more gear and regular firearm training need every weight savings they can get. Which brings up the next point.
In terms of pointability, the 1911 is more pointable out of the box. But if you have time to train defensively with a Glock, or a 1911 for that matter, it will start to point where you want it to straight out of the holster for either gun. Bottom line: the Glock will take more training to get on the same level of pointability achievable with the 1911.
In terms of accuracy, the 1911 wins out of the box. It has a better trigger pull than that of a Glock. The Glock's trigger pull can be modded to be in the ball park of that of a 1911, but if you mod your gun you better put a few hundred rounds down the barrel to ensure reliability. And if you have to put a few hundred rounds down the new Glock barrel for reliability's sake, then that sort of evens the reliability playing field because a few hundred rounds down a 1911 barrel will certainly bring out any flaws. But, again, the Glock can be accurate, it will just take more training time to have the equivalent accuracy and pointability of that of a 1911. As for barrel rise, it is not a major factor and can be "trained out" of a Glock owner. But for most folks, the 1911 will be easier to shoot accurately than a Glock 21.
As for conceilability, the 1911 wins hands down. It has a slimmer, inline frame whereas the Glock has a fatter and boxier frame, plus the Glock magazines are harder to conceal meaning most people won't have their extra mags in critical situations.
Ergonomically, it depends on your hand. For most people, though, the 1911 will be more ergonomic than the Glock 21 sf. But, again, it depends on the person. Go to your gun store and try both out. (if they don't have both they aren't too good of a gun store. If they say they do, be SURE you ask for the glock 21 AND 21 sf. The Glock 21 sf has a reduced backstrap size to accommodate smaller hands.)
Magazine capacity is a little tricky. 1911 owners feel that they can handle 99% of situations with 8 rounds. And they will be more likely to have extra magazines with them because they are easier to carry concealed. Glock 21 and 21 sf owners feel better with 13 rounds between magazine changes. But a greater magazine capacity adds (a little bit) more weight and really takes away from the gun's pointability. The Glock 21 sf solved some of this by reducing the backstrap size, but a 1911 will still point better out of the box than a Glock 21 sf will. A Glock 21 sf can point as well as a 1911, but again, it will take more training to achieve the same level of proficiency on a Glock 21 sf than that of a 1911. And, a Glock owner is less likely to have his extra mags because they are harder to carry concealed.
Dependability is where the Glock design gets its stars. The 1911 design is dependable, but it really depends on the quality of the gun. The Glock design is more dependable than the average 1911 design, but that not to say that the 1911 design is not reliable. It really boils down to "is my gun going to fail at the critical moment?" If a 1911 owner has put 500 rounds through his new 1911 without a problem then he can say "yes" with confidence. But a Glock owner knows his new or used Glock pistol will work the first time, every time. I would not trust a NIB 1911 in a critical situation, period. But I would defiantly trust it if I had put a few hundred rounds down the barrel.
Looks are completely dependent on the person. Some dudes are "wood and steel ONLY" and others try to be "tacticool", but most folks would say the 1911 is better looking and more imposing. Although, that shouldn't be the deciding factor. DON'T buy a gun based purely on looks.
And as for price, the Glock will probably win, but they are both within the same ballpark. New Glock 21s on gunbroker.com, as of Dec. 2009, cost $475-$500. A new 1911 of good manufacture can cost from $500-$1200 depending on both the manufacturer and the bells and whistles.
The better gun depends on the user's philosophy of use. I would hazard to say that most people would be better suited to the 1911, but it is ultimately up to the person's situation in life (eg line of work, available funds, part of town they live in, ect.)
I hope this has been useful, and I would appreciate constructive criticism. I tried to be unbiased and I, at one time or another thought the 1911 was crap and the 21 sf was the way to go. I now think, for most people, myself included, the 1911 is the better choice. But I've been on both sides of the argument.
Neither the 1911 nor the Glock 21 or 21 sf is an end all, be all pistol. :banghead: Lets shake hands and put some lead downrange instead of using our pistols against one another in duels. (I seriously hope that hasn't happened over the 1911-Glock debate)
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