40 and .45

[Deersniper]

Oh no, not this again....

I currently have a GLOCK 23 but a buddy of mine has a G30 that I really liked. I was thinking about getting a .45ACP pistol. So I was looking at some loads and was surprised to find that with Winchester, their FMJ (and silvertips too, I believe) cartridges in .40 S&W have more velocity and energy than the .45ACPs. It seems to me that the .45 is actually weaker than the .40 S&W. Am I missing something?

 

[MachIVshooter]

Am I missing something?

Yeah. .40 is loaded to very high pressures and there is not much room for improvement, whereas .45 ACP is loaded to very moderate pressures and, in a sturdy gun, energy can be increased by as much as 65% with +p loads. Cor-Bon sells some stuff that will put the .45 ACP over 600 ft/lbs from a 5" gun.

 

[GunGoBoom]

Some .40 loads have as much or more energy than .45 acp. But none have the momentum or so-called 'knock-down power', and still, the .45 makes a larger hole.

 

[Edmond]

Get that G30, you won't regret it!

 

[Alan Fud]

in a sturdy gun, energy can be increased by as much as 65% with +p loads. Cor-Bon sells some stuff that will put the .45 ACP over 600 ft/lbs from a 5" gun

What production gun could handle a regular diet of this stuff? 4506 maybe?

 

[halvey]

It seems to me that the .45 is actually weaker than the .40 S&W. Am I missing something?

Shoot a bowling pin with a .40 and then a .45. See which one flies off the table and see which one just kind of falls over.

 

[MICHAEL T]

Ive owned both I still have my 45"s I do have 3 or 4 40 cal. rounds left in my Box. So I guess you can say I still have 40.

 

[TheStook]

LOL sorry but the bowling pin thing doesnt make sense.

It is VERY hard to tell the difference between a .40 and .45 hole in a bowling pin. Also the pin does not fly or spin or knock over faster by a .45 rd as seen with a naked eye. I have shot all sorts of .45 and .40 ammo at bowling pins also so do not go trying to say i wasnt using the right ammo.

The .45 acp is great. It has been around a long time and it is not going anywhere.
The .40 S&W is newer, has a much different feel. It has pretty much proven its here to stay aswell.

They both have their pros over one another, they both have their cons. Shoot what you like. Just don't buy into internet hype, except for mine

 

[halvey]

It is VERY hard to tell the difference between a .40 and .45 hole in a bowling pin. Also the pin does not fly or spin or knock over faster by a .45 rd as seen with a naked eye. I have shot all sorts of .45 and .40 ammo at bowling pins also so do not go trying to say i wasnt using the right ammo.

You can shoot holes in bowling pins? Whatever. And yes, all the top shooters use .40 on pins.

 

[Dave Dembinski]

G30 is a good gun. It was my first centerfire pistol, actually, and I was able to shoot it without much problem.

One thing to remember that the .45 afficionados often trot out is the idea that the .45 isn't expected to penetrate fully, thus dumping all of its energy into the target. A .40 would probably continue on through, as would a 9mm. What bearing this has on defense use is another discussion, and one I'm not really interested in.

 

[mete]

Missing something? Yes , since you're looking at numbers. The point is that on the street the 40 and 45 are equivalent .So pick one and get on with your life.

 

[TheStook]

Yes holes in a bowling pin, when you shoot one it leaves a hole in the plastic outer coating usually surrounded with heavy leading even from a fmj round. BTW no where in my post did i even vaguely hint at the .40 being a better choice for pin shooting, i just said its hard to tell the difference between a .40 and a .45 hitting a pin and i stand by that.

Now shoot a pin with a 12 ga. slug and you get a much bigger hole and if you hit near the neck it has a nice big nasty looking exit wound in the wood. I say this because it leads into a anecdote about how hyped the .45 is.

Me and buddies where shooting bowling pins at the range with .38 sp, .357 mag, .40, .45 and a 12 ga slug. Well being the nice guy that i am i told the stranger at the next lane over he could shoot at a bowling pin of ours. The one i gave him to shoot had been hit by a slug and atleast one round of each listed above. The slug had tore a large hole through the neck of the pin. The stranger began firing at this pin and eventually knocked it down with his .45. When we had a cease fire we all wandered out to put pins back up and check targets. This stranger picked up his pin and exclaimed to his buddies "Oh my gawd, guys check out what my .45 did to this pin" and he pointed at the slug hole. My friends and i lacked the heart to tell him it was a slug hit. I share this to point out that the .45 is a handgun round. It is not some sort of magical handcannon capable of ripping a man in half. Yes it may perform better than a 9mm or a .40 in some situations, but it is not going to be very noticable at all in a bowling pin or on paper targets.

 

[halvey]

but it is not going to be very noticable at all in a bowling pin or on paper targets.

 

[Double Maduro]

Alan Fud,

What production gun could handle a regular diet of this stuff? 4506 maybe?

Probably several, but one for sure is the Ruger P90.

DM

 

[MachIVshooter]

What production gun could handle a regular diet of this stuff? 4506 maybe?

Yes, my 4506 handles +p fine. Springfield will also tell you their guns can handle any factroy load, as will Ruger. HK and Sig are very stout, too. The USP was specifically designed to digest +p.

 

[chopinbloc]

Shoot a bowling pin with a .40 and then a .45. See which one flies off the table and see which one just kind of falls over.

thank God i've never been attacked by bowling pins.

 

[TheStook]

Never been attacked by pins? Man down here we are infested. Not a night goes by that i don't hear those lil bastards digging in my trash. And just last week three of the hungry pins tried nipping at me when i got out of my car. I had no choice but to kick one and make a break for the front door.

Damn wild pins, if it wasnt the suburbs id shoot them.

 

[pauli]

never take a bowling ball to a knife fight, never take a knife to a gunfight, and never take a gun to bowling night (well, you get the idea).

measuring the effectiveness of a gun on a human by the ability to move a bowling pin or steel plate is disingenuous, at best.

 

[MachIVshooter]

measuring the effectiveness of a gun on a human by the ability to move a bowling pin or steel plate is disingenuous, at best

Agreed 100%. My Desert eagle .50 or SRH .454 knocks the pins back a good 15-20 feet, but I bet my 10mm or 45 would be more effective on a human threat simply because of bullet design. The two hand cannons I mentioned will simply drill a 1/2" hole through and through (and through and through the next 4 people).