Grayrider
Member
Odd. Over on the Clone Club a member posted a while back that MRI told him on the phone the polygonal rifling was dropped. Perhaps they saw the error in their ways...
GR
GR
ArmaLite Pistols: First Pictures!
- Thread starter Grayrider
- Start date
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atblis
Member
As opposed to what?
another sucky 1911 clone
another sucky 1911 clone
The Drew
Member
at least with another 1911 clone there is room in the market for a low priced model...
We're talking about a pistol which the original sells for $350-$450 retail not something that starts at $500 and goes up to multi thousands of dollars...
The only way I see these pistols doing well is if they retail somewhere near $300
We're talking about a pistol which the original sells for $350-$450 retail not something that starts at $500 and goes up to multi thousands of dollars...
The only way I see these pistols doing well is if they retail somewhere near $300
Cliff47
Member
Sarsilmaz is not the only firearms manufacturer in Turkey. Czech (sorry, force of habit) out the offerings at www.canik55.com, for another model called the Canik55, that looks an awful lot like th early Sarsilmaz pistols.
If you can't wait, and have to get your hands on one now, czech (there it is again) out Interordanance for the ArmSport M2000 pistol (I think it's a Salrilmaz from the picture).
If you can't wait, and have to get your hands on one now, czech (there it is again) out Interordanance for the ArmSport M2000 pistol (I think it's a Salrilmaz from the picture).
atblis
Member
You know what's funny
The Turkish thing I think will be a good pistol. It could in fact turn out to be better than the CZ. I dearly love CZs, but I think they could tidy up their operation a bit. Perhaps this could be good for everyone. Competition is seldom ever bad.
I'd have to agree that there probably won't be a market for another 9mm CZ clone unless it is very affordable or much higher in quality. I'll buy one just because I like CZs. What there would be a market for are CZ clones in interesting calibers (Like 10mm hint hint), or 38 SA/9x23, a 45 ACP would work too.
The Turkish thing I think will be a good pistol. It could in fact turn out to be better than the CZ. I dearly love CZs, but I think they could tidy up their operation a bit. Perhaps this could be good for everyone. Competition is seldom ever bad.
I'd have to agree that there probably won't be a market for another 9mm CZ clone unless it is very affordable or much higher in quality. I'll buy one just because I like CZs. What there would be a market for are CZ clones in interesting calibers (Like 10mm hint hint), or 38 SA/9x23, a 45 ACP would work too.
Buck Nekkid
Member
If we're going to suggest unique calibers then how about an "original" CZ caliber (at least in pistols) 7.62 x 25?? A modern pistol in that caliber would give that FN Five seveN a run for it's money!!
atblis
Member
7.62x25
That might be interesting.
That might be interesting.
Grayrider
Member
I threw that caliber at them in my first set of suggestions. Of course it would probably be too long to fit the Tanfoglio pattern large frame. It was on my list along with .38 Super and 10mm. Think of all that surplus 7.62 out there just begging to be double-stacked...
Don't hold your breath though. I would have my work cut out selling the 10mm, and that is my first love.
GR
Don't hold your breath though. I would have my work cut out selling the 10mm, and that is my first love.
GR
atblis
Member
I'd be happy with a 10mm
or a 38SA/9x23
An alternative to EAA would be fantastic.
What about a 10mm/40SW combo? SHould just be another barrel (or a 9x23 and 9x19 set).
In theory the 7.62x25 could work on a 9x23 platorm (the rim is about the same).
7.62Tok oal = ~1.369"
10mm ~1.26 (don't remember what the Tanfoglio mag limits out at).
That might be enough of a difference to be a deal breaker.
or a 38SA/9x23
An alternative to EAA would be fantastic.
What about a 10mm/40SW combo? SHould just be another barrel (or a 9x23 and 9x19 set).
In theory the 7.62x25 could work on a 9x23 platorm (the rim is about the same).
7.62Tok oal = ~1.369"
10mm ~1.26 (don't remember what the Tanfoglio mag limits out at).
That might be enough of a difference to be a deal breaker.
Buck Nekkid
Member
Maybe I'm missing something, not the first time , but I have a CZ 52 converted to 9mm Para. The only change was the barrel. It uses the exact same mags as the 7.62 x 25. So a .30 cal barrel should be all that it would take to make this one VERY interesting firearm!
, but I have a CZ 52 converted to 9mm Para. The only change was the barrel. It uses the exact same mags as the 7.62 x 25. So a .30 cal barrel should be all that it would take to make this one VERY interesting firearm!atblis
Member
OAL is what's missing
Rim is close enough
but 7.62x25 is longer than 10mm/45/9x23/9x19 etc. so it might not fit in the magazine (that's usally what limits OAL). You could in theory handload something shorter, but it would be kinda pointless to mass produce a handgun that can only shoot handloads.
I think also the fact that a lot of the surplus ammo is of dubious quality has something to do with the fact that none of the major manufacturers will make a 7.62x25 pistol. Would you want to support/warranty a pistol shooting that crap?
None the less, a 7.62 pistol would be kool.
Rim is close enough
but 7.62x25 is longer than 10mm/45/9x23/9x19 etc. so it might not fit in the magazine (that's usally what limits OAL). You could in theory handload something shorter, but it would be kinda pointless to mass produce a handgun that can only shoot handloads.
I think also the fact that a lot of the surplus ammo is of dubious quality has something to do with the fact that none of the major manufacturers will make a 7.62x25 pistol. Would you want to support/warranty a pistol shooting that crap?
None the less, a 7.62 pistol would be kool.
Buck Nekkid
Member
There is just as much old .223, etc. out there that I don't think that should be an issue. S&B and Winchester both load 7.62 x 25.
atblis
Member
Sorta similar
There's no corrosive 5.56/223 though. Most of the 7.62x25 is definitely corrosive
I've been shooting surplus 5.56 from the early 70s, and it shoots great (and is definitely not corrosive).
Some of the 7.62x25 I've shot is bordering on dangerous.
From what I can gathe the S&B, and Winchester are actually the same ammo.
There's no corrosive 5.56/223 though. Most of the 7.62x25 is definitely corrosive
I've been shooting surplus 5.56 from the early 70s, and it shoots great (and is definitely not corrosive).
Some of the 7.62x25 I've shot is bordering on dangerous.
From what I can gathe the S&B, and Winchester are actually the same ammo.
dleong
Member
That was most likely yours truly. My full-size 40S&W "Baby Eagle" was purchased new in late-2004 (test-fire date of 02/04/2004) and came with a barrel sporting standard "land-and groove" rifling. I telephoned MRI about it, and was informed that IMI had gone back to that "for accuracy reasons."
Here is an image of my BE; if you look closely, you can see the beginning of the barrel rifling.
revolvergeek
Member
If the price was stayed <$400 I would have to have one in 7.62X25 for a play and car gun. That would just be too cool.
Ivy Mike
Member
While 7.62x25 would be cool in a modern firearm, some of that stuff is really dirty, really hot or both. I'd really hate to have my shiny new Armalite explode in my hands because someone tucked a hot 7.62x25 into the wrong crate.
I will throw my hat in for 10mm though. If I could get 10mm in a compact version, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. I'll bet that many people would and with the Armalite name behind it, you could see a jump in the popularity of 10mm AND be the only major manufacturer chambering for it other than Glock.
Can you imagine a quality compact steel 10mm? Better power and capacity than .45 and at a reasonable price.
somehow, this smilie just doesn't do it justice.
I will throw my hat in for 10mm though. If I could get 10mm in a compact version, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. I'll bet that many people would and with the Armalite name behind it, you could see a jump in the popularity of 10mm AND be the only major manufacturer chambering for it other than Glock.
Can you imagine a quality compact steel 10mm? Better power and capacity than .45 and at a reasonable price.
somehow, this smilie
just doesn't do it justice.atblis
Member
The Turks
The Turks have their own agenda. What that is? THey aren't really are friends, but I wouldn't call them enemies either.
I'd rather give my money to the Turks than the Chinese.
I suspect the Turks would be more cooperative with us regarding the "war on terror" if we were to let them have their way with the Kurds.
The Turks have their own agenda. What that is? THey aren't really are friends, but I wouldn't call them enemies either.
I'd rather give my money to the Turks than the Chinese.
I suspect the Turks would be more cooperative with us regarding the "war on terror" if we were to let them have their way with the Kurds.
In case you haven't noticed, Turkey is a NATO country. They have participated in pretty much every NATO action since Korea (where my own grandfather died).USGuns said:
Turkey's lack of support for the war in Iraq has little to do with the Muslim majority...all of whom are Alevi and all of whom dislike the Wahhabi as much as anyone. Wahhabi Arabs hate Turks almost as much as they hate Americans. They hate Kemal Ataturk for turning the Ottoman Empire into the secular Republic of Turkey in 1923 and for stamping out any vestiges of Islamic law. Do your homework.
Turks don't support the war in Iraq because they don't believe that Iraq ever posed a significant threat to the USA or any other NATO ally. They were unwilling to sacrifice their own security to support an ill-conceived, aggressive act of war in the face of little/no evidence of an immediate Iraqi threat.
FWIW, it looks like they were right. It certainly doesn't look like Iraq had anything to do with 9-11. And we have failed to uncover evidence of any "weapons of mass destruction" in the hands of the Iraqis.
I'm more ticked off at the Turks for failing to acknowledge the Armenian genocide of 1915. They've used their status as a NATO country in the Middle East to pressure other NATO countries into not recognizing it as well.
And it's Istanbul. Not Istambul.
And it's Istanbul. Not Istambul.
yeah I know...now
I went and listened to the song and saw my mistake. There is a good video of the song on you tube.
The novel A Coffin For Dimitrios by Eric Ambler has a section set during the Armenien genocide. There are many state sposored or allowed mass killings that are not recognised due to the ideology of the participants ie The Ukraine or Pol Pot or Darfur now.
pete
I went and listened to the song and saw my mistake. There is a good video of the song on you tube.
The novel A Coffin For Dimitrios by Eric Ambler has a section set during the Armenien genocide. There are many state sposored or allowed mass killings that are not recognised due to the ideology of the participants ie The Ukraine or Pol Pot or Darfur now.
pete
CZF
Member
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2003
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- 2,034
Getting back to Armalite and the new line of pistols. I would have to agree with those that think that these new guns have no definite advantage over a real-deal CZ. In 9mm or .40 and even 45 ACP. My vote will be CZ.
I own a Tanfoglio 10mm only because Cz doesn't make a 10mm and never will at this point. While I have never had any problems with it, save a crappy Clintonized magazine splitting on me after 3 or 4 years of useage.
My success at having such a good pistol is testament to the superb Cz75 design, others have not been so very lucky.
Given the spotty track record of the people who import Witness pistols at
present.
My hope would be that the Armalite customer service is beyond that of the
much discussed (and cussed) EAA.
I own a Tanfoglio 10mm only because Cz doesn't make a 10mm and never will at this point. While I have never had any problems with it, save a crappy Clintonized magazine splitting on me after 3 or 4 years of useage.
My success at having such a good pistol is testament to the superb Cz75 design, others have not been so very lucky.
Given the spotty track record of the people who import Witness pistols at
present.
My hope would be that the Armalite customer service is beyond that of the
much discussed (and cussed) EAA.
Buck Nekkid
Member
There's a review of the Armalite pistol in the current "Gun Digest Magazine", formerly "Gun List". The author has a lot of positives to say, but failed to mention the heritage of the pistol or where it was manufactured. He almost gave the impression that Gene Stoner rose from the grave to invent it.
He says the trigger isn't much to brag about--but he likes it, go figure! The guy really needs to shoot some CZ's to know that a clone is a clone is a clone.
He says the trigger isn't much to brag about--but he likes it, go figure! The guy really needs to shoot some CZ's to know that a clone is a clone is a clone.
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