Chiappa went cha-put

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Pelo801

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I've had a chiappa rhino since April of 2011. I've shot this thing atleast once, usually two or three times a week for almost four years now. Today it gave up on me. The breech shield broke in half while firing. I contacted chiappa through their website but obviously haven't heard back yet. I'm keeping my fingers crossed they'll take care of it, especially considering the price of these things.
 

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Wow that is quite the failure. Any chance it was ammo related? Course if a round goes its gonna take the cylinder and blackstrap but what the hell man.

Sorry to see this.
 
I don't know how it could be ammo related. Bullet fired fine then out of the corner of my eye I saw the broken piece fall. I just don't see how ammo could cause that. Like you said, cylindet or strap failure, yes but this I don't know what to say.
 
The design is like no other so the failure is going to be like no other. To me it shows a potential weak spot in this design, and I"m sure the company would love to see your pic and address this issue.

Thanks for sharing and let us know how this turns out...
 
"The breech shield broke in half while firing"

Whoa! Please take pictures of the crack interface as soon as you can. I want to see if this was caused by an inclusion in the steel, or a fatigue crack. Sure looks like brittle fatigue failure, and I doubt there's a whole lot of guns out there with more rounds than you have obviously put through it. Whatever caused it to finally let go, I'm dismayed the metal is as obviously brittle/over hardened as it is.

I must say the brass deposits on your shield look really strong; do you tend to shoot very heavy/high pressure loads? Even my well-worn MR73 trade-in doesn't have the degree of brass deposit as yours (but the finish is also probably smoother). The hollow-center brass patterns of the adjacent cylinder primers also look like overpressure cratered primers that were then recoiled against the shield umpteen times. I'm not judging or saying "it's your fault" if you do shoot hot loads in this one; rather it's a testament to its ease of shooting hard recoiling loads. But if these guns have power-level sensitivity to large numbers of rounds like other designs *cough-cough* people need to know. Lord knows Chiappa/MKS won't tell us, after all.

I can't tell, is there a piece missing at the cylinder latch hole? [eta: that's the pawl, barnbwt, you dummy :eek:] There's also some sort of divot/crater inside the timing-star relief cut in the photo that looks odd. Also, what's' with the hole at the 12 o clock position; not like you need a firing pin up there (I'd also expect the crack to propagate through there, as well)

Do you carry the gun, or just range shoot it? The finish looks pretty good on the corners in the photo. Especially considering the frame is just aluminum anodized a few atoms thick :cool:. Does the trigger (or cocking lever) loosen/smooth up any after lots of cycles?

TCB
 
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"I don't think it is a design flaw I think it is the metal / metallurgy, just my opinion."

Yeah, I suspect it was a case of "hey, it's just an impact shield and not the load-bearing frame, so we can make it as hard as we want!" Problem is exactly what we have here, that recoil loads the metal around firing pin hole and edge, bowing the part inward imperceptibly, but enough to propagate microcracks over time. In over hardened metal, there is nothing to stop the micro cracks once they start. I honestly can't say if having a much softer aluminum "cushion" behind the plate allows the deflection of the shield to be higher than it would be otherwise (I doubt it, but it's not like I've done the math).

If that recoil shield ever formed a gap from the frame through flex, stretch, or peening, that would allow it to flex enough to destroy itself in short order, though (which hot loads may gradually do, for all we know).

Another question for the OP; how is the end-shake and timing of the gun? I don't think there are many folks with as many rounds through these, so you present a unique opportunity for the rest of us to learn what can be expected of the service life of the guns :) (well, hopefully not too exact an example, but you get my meaning :D)

TCB
 
That's an impressive failure. I'm sure it's not the first to fail, but it's the first I have seen. I hope they fix ya up right with a fresh one.
 
No larger pictures, for some reason, but this is what it's supposed to look like, for reference
xW7428_SI_ChiappaRhinoDetails_9267-150x150.jpg

It appears your crack started at the lower inside corner of the ratchet/pawl slot...which should probably have been radiused, given its proximity to the firing pin hole (and edge of shield on the opposite side of that.)

When fired, the whole breachface is pushed back by the case head, doming the part slightly for a moment. If you look, the relief cut for the timing studs and ratchet notch (which incidentally coincides with the edges of that relief cut) greatly reduces the material thickness and 'meat' of the left side of the shield. At least, compared to the solid chunk of metal on the opposite side. Which means that whatever deflection occurs is disproportionately felt on the weaker side.

This is important for the purposes of fatigue. It's not enough to simply make something strong enough if it's to last many cycles; it has to dissipate stresses gradually, or the areas where it does not will begin shearing at the atomic level --in the form of micro cracks.

The edge of any cutout or hole is a concentrating factor (firing pin and slot)
An inside corner, even round, is a concentrating factor (relief cut)
A sharp inside corner is a severe concentrating factor (ratchet slot)
The coincidence of two or more stress risers is a concentrating factor
The edge of a surface is a concentrating factor (lower edge)
An adjacent area of much greater stiffness is a concentrating factor (opposite side)

An awful lot of things seem to be working in the direction of crack propagation, here. It's still surprising that enough deflection could be delivered to the 3/16" or so thick plate to fatigue it to failure like this, even after thousands of rounds. Steel tends to be much better about cracking than, say, aluminum, but if it is extremely hard there's nothing stopping it once it gets started. I suspect these plates are extremely hard since they are solely an impact surface, and intuition would suggest that is desirable. For a flat plate it is, but that slot with the sharp corners really makes me wonder.

We'll have a better idea when you post a picture of the crack interface; we'll be able to readily see an inclusion (probably), whether the cracks were gradual or catastrophic, and possibly where they emanate from (my money's on the lower edge of the slot)

TCB
 
"That's certainly a serious failure, especially for what they cost"

More like for what would happen if the trigger was pulled and the next round in the cylinder didn't slide to the rear and jam on the crack.

-If the part was missing, as in the OP's case, the case would violently blow out, probably severing your thumb(s) and blinding you (assuming the case head fragments don't shoot through your face)
-If the part was present but misaligned enough, the case would fail into the crack, blowing the recoil shield outward under full chamber pressure into your face
-Plus, whatever would happen from the chamber pressure venting into the action of the frame (probably gas escaping from through the rubber grips like a whoopee cushion :p)

That recoil shield was made of steel in the first place because it is probably the most important part of the gun, with respect to shooter safety (maybe the cylinder, but those tend to blow out, not back). It's all that separates you from the explosion you want going only forward. ;)

Hopefully Chiappa comps the OP a new gun; they need to (and they need to invest in some radiused cutters)

TCB
 
I will take some better pictures tomorrow when I can use natural light. This iPad takes better pics that way.

What looks like brass deposits on the face is actually wear on the finish of the metal, they can't be scrubbed off and looks polished once I clean it up. I would say I generally shoot upper middle loads. Occasionally some pretty warm loads. And it does handle warm, or did make running warm loads easier on the shooter.

I did carry this gun occasionally but generally it was a range gun. The SA trigger was always pretty smooth from right out the box. I don't use the SA option very often. The DA trigger did smooth out over time and became actually quite nice.

The timing of the gun was always on and lockup tight. The ejector rod did start to back itself out recently, but only slightly.
 

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please look againt

at the first two pictures in the thread. its not a broken issue.

the reciol shield that "fell off" is a seperate part. if you look at it closely, thereis a machined recess that it fits into.
 
How does that account for the crack through the firing pin hole?
Pete
 
please look againt at the first two pictures in the thread. its not a broken issue.

the reciol shield that "fell off" is a seperate part. if you look at it closely, thereis a machined recess that it fits into.

Yes, it is a broken issue. Look again.

If you still do not see it, then look yet again.
 
A broken issue.... Weird way of putting it

That is quite a failure. I'm interested to hear what Chiappa says.
 
Hopefully this pic shows enough detail of the crack interface. I'm curious of the opinions more knowledgeable than mine.
 

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Here's the other piece.
The shield is a separate piece that fits into a recess in the frame.
 

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