Has open carry ever been PROVEN to be a bad idea?

Status
Not open for further replies.
B

Beethoven

member
Joined
Feb 23, 2005
Messages
404
Invariably when open carry is discussed on forums, there are people talking about how it will make you a target instead of having the desired effect of people leaving you alone.

Has this ever been PROVEN to be true?

Can anyone provide factual evidence for even a single case in which a civilian was actully targeted by thugs because he was openly carrying?


Thanks
 
Ahaha - I see you are on an open carry kick today ;)

I do not personally know of a case where this would apply - and not sure if such would be documented anyways. In principle I think our consideration of ''being a target'' has some logic - way better the surprise factor IMO.

If open carry was implemented a lot more, and without BlissNinnies bleating here and there - it would I think be so ''normal'' that BG's would be not influenced - there'd be too many folks with obvious firearms.

I'll just say, these days with so many gun-shy folks around - discretion is the better part of valor - and, I'll keep the BG's guessing :D
 
One surefire way to make them less gun-shy is to expose them to firearms all the time without incident. It starts to seem normal after a while.
 
One surefire way to make them less gun-shy is to expose them to firearms all the time without incident. It starts to seem normal after a while.
Click to expand...

That has worked with other things in the past, ie: cars, planes
 
Can anyone provide factual evidence for even a single case in which a civilian was actully targeted by thugs because he was openly carrying?
Click to expand...

Well, it just stands to reason the streets would soon run with blood.

Seriously: I carry openly about a third of the time. Virtually no one notices. I'm sure most criminals are still less attentive than the law-abiding.
 
Beethoven said:
Invariably when open carry is discussed on forums, there are people talking about how it will make you a target instead of having the desired effect of people leaving you alone.

Has this ever been PROVEN to be true?

Can anyone provide factual evidence for even a single case in which a civilian was actully targeted by thugs because he was openly carrying?


Thanks
Click to expand...

The Clantons and McLaurys, Tombstone, 1881.
 
When I am wearing a shirt and tie with no coat I sorta open carry...I mean its a full size gun in a IWB rig. I get looks, but no one, save one curious guy at Sportsman's Warehouse, has every said anything. I guess in a shirt and tie people probably assume I am a cop, because when I am in shirt and tie I am clean shaved and have no visibal tattoos or piercings. I notice the opposite at the gun shop I frequent, when concealed in my everyday clothes no one wants to help me, when open carrying in shirt and tie everyone seems nice and eager to assist. I wonder if they will ever realize that some people save money to buy guns by not buying cloths more than once a decade and save money for ammo buy not washing those clothes. People are strange.
 
This is a little bit of a stretch, but the Miami shootout perpetrators were known to acquire firearms by frequenting remote shooting locations and taking them from the owners who were generally rendered unable to object. Not exactly open carry, but it's related as it's criminals targeting people known to have guns on or about their persons.

There has been at least one instance discussed on this forum of a robbery in progress that was interrupted briefly to kill a person who's girlfriend/wife effectively turned his concealed carry into open carry by whispering loudly something along the lines of "Doooon't go for your gun!"

There was also a thread posted either here or at TFL about a gun range employee who shot a violent criminal after the criminal took the employees hostage. He succeeded largely because his concealed weapon allowed him to pick the most advantageous moment to resist. I guess you could argue that the criminal might have gone to another range if he had seen an armed employee, but I think it's just as reasonable to argue that he might have instantly killed the armed employee had he known he was armed.

My objection to open carry is that if it doesn't deter the criminals, then you can't pick your time and place to respond. You are forced to either respond immediately or you face being disarmed or killed. I'd rather have the option to decide after assessing the situation rather than be pushed into immediate action.
 
Last edited:
Only state you can carry OPENLY is MN

I just got my CCPermit and we were told by the instructors, SWAT officers, BCA, and the Gun Shop that the only state that allows you to openly carry a revolver under the conceal carry permit is MINNESOTA. However LEO's CANNOT as their Union does not allow them OFF DUTY to OPENLY CARRY their weapon. It is a liability they don't want for the people they represent...cops.

this and common sense may answer your question.
 
Its not directly on point, but every single cop and/or security guard/armored car operator who has ever been shot in that back is pretty good evidence that being an obvious 'good guy' can buy you trouble.
 
mindpilot,

I think, well I know, you are mistaken. There are numerous states that allow open carry. I don't have a comprehensive list handy, but you can check out individual states at packing.org.

Just a bit of termage, to borrow one of my little sister's favorite words. Minnesota's permit is a "Permit to Carry." At least that's what mine says. That's why you are allowed to open carry; there is no concealed requirement.


EDIT:

I spoke too soon. It's amazing what a little work with Yahoo! will do...
opencarrymap.png


Courtesy of opencarry.org.

Gold means you can open carry w/o a permit, green means you need a permit, and orange means some cities restrict open carry. Red means no open carry.
 
New Mexico allows open carry, too. I can think of 2 different instances that I've seen people carry openly and I didn't observe any negative reaction to the carried gun.
 
mindpilot,

Your Gun Shop, BCA [whoever they are], SWAT officers, and instructors are WRONG. (Suprise, no?)

In Georgia, to carry at all, open or concealed, I must have a Georgia Firearms License, which I do. The only un-licensed carry is on one's property or vehicle.
 
I've open carried in Arizona twice now, once in Yuma, and once from Yuma to the Grand Canyon (where is disarmed) and back to Yuma. No odd looks, no complaints, no dead children, no blood in the streets, no being targetted by a thug for elimination, one nice "hello, how are you sir?" from a deputy.
 
I used to live in New York, where you wouldn't think you'd see a lot of open carry by anyone but a uniformed cop, but on a number of occasions you would see someone who was dressed normally other than wearing a T-shirt with BRINKS or something like that on it, and they'd be in a deli or pizza place getting lunch while carrying openly with a service style holster and no one looked twice. Obviously the argument that this will invariably cause general panic among the sheeple is false. BRINKS guys are not cops, and apparently no one was calling 911. Why? Because people are accustomed to seeing BRINKS guys carrying openly. Why? Because it is something they see every once in a while. If they saw people not wearing a BRINKS T-shirt carrying enough, they'd stop calling 911 every time they saw that too.
 
kngflp said:
When I am wearing a shirt and tie with no coat I sorta open carry...I mean its a full size gun in a IWB rig. I get looks, but no one, save one curious guy at Sportsman's Warehouse, has every said anything. I guess in a shirt and tie people probably assume I am a cop, because when I am in shirt and tie I am clean shaved and have no visibal tattoos or piercings. I notice the opposite at the gun shop I frequent, when concealed in my everyday clothes no one wants to help me, when open carrying in shirt and tie everyone seems nice and eager to assist. I wonder if they will ever realize that some people save money to buy guns by not buying cloths more than once a decade and save money for ammo buy not washing those clothes. People are strange.
Click to expand...
Funny you should mention that. I've noticed that too. And it almost doesn't matter how much money I spend there. Where I used to live, up North, the gun store people almost all knew me well, and that I was a customer to be taken seriously and treated with respect because, partly at least, I bought a lot of guns, etc., over a period of few decades. Then I moved to northern Florida, to a rural community where there is just one gun shop nearby. Not that they aren't nice, but they hardly give me the time of day, even though in the last year and a half I must have spent over two grand there. I don't dress like I have any money to spend, so I guess they are slow to learn, even after repeated exposure to me spending money there.

Could also be that they just don't like Northerners, no matter how much money they spend in their store. Not sure yet which it is.

P.S. Rather than being happy to see me there browsing, I get the distinct impression that if I mosey on to the back of the store where the used guns are, they send someone rushing over to keep an eye on me. They ask me if I need some help in a tone of voice that suggests suspicion rather than a real desire to be helpful, and this is AFTER spending over two grand in the store in the past year and a half. Can't trust a Northerner, I guess. We did do quite a number on them a while back.
 
Last edited:
i live in arizona, where open carry is legal, but in the city i live in, it's not very common. i do it on occasion, mostly when i am on my way out of the city for a hunting or fishing trip. i also carry open when i have to drive to a nasty part of town.

some people don't even notice, some people get very nervous, some people make taunting gestures. it all depends.

one of my neighbors is a police officer, and since the first time he saw me with a gun on my belt, he's always looked at me very suspiciously when i pass him in the hall. other police have mentioned how they like seeing good law-abiding citizens legally owning and carrying guns. it all seems to depend on who you encounter.

that's my experience anyway. there are many other parts of arizona where open carry is much more common, and some areas where it almost seems part of the dress code.
 
Could also be that they just don't like Northerners, no matter how much money they spend in their store.
Click to expand...

That is probaly it, either that or like you said, they are slow to learn.
 
bad idea?

It is not a good idea unless you're trying to draw attention to yourself.In the world of human predators you are being sized up continually.When you look like easy prey you will be attacked, gun or not. If you are trying to NOT draw attention to yourself conceal it.
 
It is not a good idea unless you're trying to draw attention to yourself.In the world of human predators you are being sized up continually.When you look like easy prey you will be attacked, gun or not. If you are trying to NOT draw attention to yourself conceal it.
Click to expand...
Yes, that is what everyone always says. But the question this thread is dealing is: "Has open carry ever been PROVEN to be a bad idea?"
 
Phantom Warrior said:
mindpilot,

I think, well I know, you are mistaken. There are numerous states that allow open carry. I don't have a comprehensive list handy, but you can check out individual states at packing.org.

Just a bit of termage, to borrow one of my little sister's favorite words. Minnesota's permit is a "Permit to Carry." At least that's what mine says. That's why you are allowed to open carry; there is no concealed requirement.


EDIT:

I spoke too soon. It's amazing what a little work with Yahoo! will do...
opencarrymap.png


Courtesy of opencarry.org.

Gold means you can open carry w/o a permit, green means you need a permit, and orange means some cities restrict open carry. Red means no open carry.
Click to expand...
I will tend to believe a Law enforcement officer in front of me, and others that KNOW the Statues that have changed over a Yahoo map that has LEGAL DISCLAIMER on BOARD

All advice posted on this board should be considered nothing more than hearsay. Even if a poster identifies themselves as an attorney, law enforcement official or expert in a given field, there is no way to verify that fact. Therefore, any and all advice you glean from this forum should be independently verified

( 2 guys opinions) and no publications supporting their cute little map
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

K
  • Locked
Open Carry?
2 3
Replies
50
Views
2K
psyprofessor
P
S
  • Locked
Open carry activist at Dallas shooting
2 3 4
Replies
81
Views
5K
pockets
P
Mainsail
  • Locked
The Open Carry Argument
2 3 4 5 6 7
Replies
167
Views
11K
Art Eatman
A
C
  • Locked
Why I Open Carry!
2 3
Replies
53
Views
3K
Eric F
E
S
  • Locked
A proven method for reducing gun violence
2 3
Replies
53
Views
2K
Whats-his-name
W
Back
Top