Have you lost any "friends" because of your interest in firearms?

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Nope.
There are a lot of things in life that I have no control over, but the one thing I do is who I am friends with. It's not just the fact that they have differing views than me, I welcome that. It's the pure ignorance, bordering on stupidity that is encountered by rabid anti gun people that I couldn't deal with. The fact is, people with those viewpoints would turn me off to the point of not wanting to be around them long before the conversation turned to guns.

Don't get me wrong, I have friends who are not gun owners. They simply are not into them and don't want to own one. That's fine.
I have friends who are very liberal and do own guns, yet they would vote for stricter gun laws in a heartbeat. I don't agree with them, but we're fine with each other.

What I'm saying is that if I refuse to be friends with someone, it is because of a mindset and a overall view of things, not simply one issue.
 
I got reacquainted with a high school friend recently (50 years absence) on FB. We were messaging back and forth, catching up, and he asked me what I was doing with myself since I retired. I told him I was a gun collector and shooter, had my own range and was a member at another range. That was the last message. Even a few "new friends", after chatting a bit and mentioning my hobby, sort of fade out.

On the other hand, I have made a few new friends whom I met because of my hobby, so I guess it's all a bit of give and take, ebb and flow.

I won't abandon my hobby, or my principles, just to appease some conditional friendship.
 
Trent said:
"As a Buddhist, shouldn't you shoot to wound or not shoot at all, because all life is sacred?"
Click to expand...
You might remind them that a great many of the classic eastern martial arts originated from within the walls of Buddhist monasteries. Even the monks of 1000 years ago recognized the need to defend themselves.

As a Buddhist myself, I can't say I've ever experienced such a conversation with anyone. It's a shame they've decided to spout about a belief they clearly know nothing about. "All life is." would have been sufficient.
 
I have. My mother and one of my best friends in high school. He changed dramatically over the years and I’m not sure my mother and I ever agreed on much. We disagreed on many things but firearms was a big one.

I decided it just wasn’t worth trying to maintain a friendship/relationship with someone who hated most of the things I stand for. There’s not much point in hanging around people who hate you if you have any choice in the matter.

I should probably say it’s a shame or something but I honestly don’t feel that way.

I find firearms can be a useful barometer. If someone is rabidly against them it’s usually a good sign we won’t have much in common. Not that my friends need to be into firearms, but just as a general sign of our personal philosophies meshing. Conversely, like many who have replied I have made a friend or two because of them.

Of course, the older I get the fewer true friends I find I have or need.
 
I'm a carpenter and lost a customer who I thought was a friend.

I'd been doing remodeling jobs on his summer cottage for 10 years and we had a great working relationship. No estimates needed, bills paid without a peep.

One day his wife noticed the NRA sticker on my truck and said, "Ohhh, I didn't know you were one of those people!" You'd have thought I was a child molester.
I just said, "Yes, I am" and they never called me again. No loss. The weirdest thing is they were from Vermont.

Tinpig
 
I lost a "friend" of about ten years after I moved from NY and got into firearms. We'd email and talk and the only thing he could bring up is "thugs who rob people" and "firearm mishaps" because that was all he knew... then one day he just stopped returning my emails and phone calls... it only took about two left messages to realize what was going on.

I'd helped this guy out through so much stuff (like him moving FAR away from home to move in with a woman only for her to flip out and kick him out onto the street. He'd call me everyday to boo-hoo about his situation and I ended up going to visit him to make sure he was OK) - that was pretty messed up but that was just how things happen sometime.
 
I wouldn't call them friends, but after an extended dinnertime discussion/argument about 2A with a dinner party that included two all-knowing nanny-state gun grabbers, (while their shooting husbands sat by quietly and silent) my son and I haven't been invited back again!
 
no, most of my friends are gun owners anyway, and we often discuss guns and go to range together.
However, for the ones that are not fond of guns, I don't try to shove my ideas/hobbies down their throats.
If somebody asks me "what do you really need your AK for?", I usually ask them back , joking, "what do you really need your pick-up/SUV for ?"
I can still have a lot of other things in common things with them, and as somebody said, I am looking at the "overall package".
 
right of association

Having read everyone's comments the past two days, what I see this boiling down to is we all have a right to associate with like-minded people.

I "purged" my FB page twice in the past year. Once over the marijuana legalizations/attempted legalizations in AK and FL, and once over the recent court decisions on marriage. Likewise, I've been purged by others. I may have to respect the opinions of others, but I don't have to see those opinions on my home page every time I turn on the computer.

At work, I avoid these discussions like the plague. I don't have anything on my vehicle or on my job site (stickers, decals, logos, reading materials, etc.) that would reveal any of my political or religious ideas/beliefs, and I don't discuss them, or I discuss them very little. I had to learn that lesson the hard way.
 
Yes. Just one, and oddly, she was a gun owner. It really wasn't totally about guns. She was a strong advocate of late term, and even partial birth abortions. We had argued over that several times, but it was an argument over "assault" rifles that broke the camel's back for her. She didn't understand how I could possibly NOT be in favor of banning so called assault rifles, if I was pro-life. I pointed out that there were 110 million rifles in the US, which kill about 315 people annually. There are just under 1,800 abortion doctors which kill over 730,000 people annually, and that to my knowledge, abortions had never been successfully used to stem an invasion or defend freedom, whereas "assault" weapons were designed for that very purpose.

She didn't respond, but she not only "unfriended" me later that day, she blocked me. I guess she didn't like my response.
 
PJSprog said:
You might remind them that a great many of the classic eastern martial arts originated from within the walls of Buddhist monasteries. Even the monks of 1000 years ago recognized the need to defend themselves.

As a Buddhist myself, I can't say I've ever experienced such a conversation with anyone. It's a shame they've decided to spout about a belief they clearly know nothing about. "All life is." would have been sufficient.
Click to expand...

Oh they SHOULD know that. The wife is a karate student in our dojo, and the husband is a fellow instructor. Firearms are a recognized tool for defense in our instruction - our chief instructor and several other instructors and students in our dojo have been through my concealed carry class, and 4 of the instructors are regulars at rifle competitions. Our senior instructor is a cop, and is also a firearms instructor. I've got the blessing from the organization to promote my concealed carry classes to students.

So .. yeah. Guns are prevalent in our culture of martial arts.

Which is fundamentally valid from a logic and legal perspective.

There are situations where - presented with non-lethal force, one has to respond with non-lethal force. We can't escalate to deadly force in Illinois unless we're attacked with a level of force that justifies it. If a guy my size wants to try to beat the crap out of me, the gun is a useless instrument until the tables have turned so far against me that I have no choice (e.g. head getting bashed in to pavement, getting strangled, etc). Which means my only legal option until that line is crossed, is to respond with non-lethal force.

There are two levels of threats we have to deal with and the transition between normal force and lethal force, is a moving target, depending on our age, physical capability, gender, number of assailants, etc. All boils down to what a jury would feel a "reasonable man" would consider a level of force that would result in death or serious bodily injury to the victim.

The laws in my state are well codified on this, and in no uncertain terms we have the right to carry and use a firearm in self-defense of life.

Yet.. you just can't hammer that point home to some people.

The two (the couple) were fine until they got involved with this new anti-gun new-age hippy church. That's when things started getting weird.

I'm all for religious freedom, don't get me wrong. I just find it unsettling when this church seems to promote nothing but liberal politics as "truth and enlightenment" without any basis. I mean, they don't follow any traditional religion doctrine. They don't have spiritual texts, codified ethos, etc.

It's ... just frigging weird. Like, cult weird.

They sure do like to take donations to put up more anti-gun posters and billboards around town and fund these gun-buybacks, though.
 
There are situations where - presented with non-lethal force, one has to respond with non-lethal force. We can't escalate to deadly force in Illinois unless we're attacked with a level of force that justifies it. If a guy my size wants to try to beat the crap out of me, the gun is a useless instrument until the tables have turned so far against me that I have no choice (e.g. head getting bashed in to pavement, getting strangled, etc). Which means my only legal option until that line is crossed, is to respond with non-lethal force.
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This is the part that's never quite made sense to me. If my head is being bashed into the pavement, or I'm being strangled from behind, then it seems too late. How am I going to pull my weapon from an OWB and get off a shot as my head is being pummeled into a sidewalk, rendering me unconscious or nearly so?

I'm not contending that you agree with that, but it seems policy makers seem to think that's ok.
______

Now, in terms of whether I've lost friends because of my interest in firearms. I've been thinking about it. I think I can say, yes, maybe a few, especially on social media like Facebook -- where I increasingly openly discuss my interest in firearms. But that's OK. If people can't accept me as I am, then I'm not interested in being friends.

AND, I think I've actually made more friends because of my interest in firearms. How many thousands of people are on this forum? I feel that even if we are different in spiritual and political views, our bond around firearms will facilitate friendship -- as long as we steer clear of discussions of religion and politics -- which I tend to do anyway.
 
No. Worst I know is my sister who just doesn't like them. Not enough to vote to get rid of them, just doesn't want to use them herself. Strikes me as the type that might like them if I can ever convince her to go to a range. Which I doubt I'd be able to convince her to go. My mother or one of my aunts would probably be able to but our family holds the opinion that if she doesn't like 'em, don't force 'em on her.
 
I'd forgotten about one. He wasn't so much a "friend" as an "acquaintance." He was a lawyer who worked in this office. I'm the self-proclaimed Gun Lawyer here. He claimed that he didn't have anything against guns, but that his wife really didn't want them in their home. He and I had even planned to buy a case of .223, and I was going to borrow an AR (I don't own one) and take him to the range. We never got around to it.

Then the Sandy Hook shooting happened. The next day, he walked into my office and said, "That's it. I'll never own a gun." I looked up and said, "I'll never be without one." He left this office for a better job a few months later. We stayed friends on FB for a while, but eventually he disappeared from my newsfeed. When I went to looking for him, I found I'd been blocked. We have a very small legal community here, with a very active grapevine. I mentioned him having blocked me to someone, and word got back to him. He has apparently told some people that he doesn't have me blocked, but I don't buy it.

Oddly enough, I'm still friends on FB with his wife. . .
 
I think I may have a skewed perspective and a set of circumstances, though certainly not unique, that have made this a bigger issue in my life than others.

I grew up in a non-hunting, non-shooting, house of folks who were content to go through life assuming that locking your house and vehicle doors would be enough to keep us all safe. It was in a blue state to boot. I distinctly remember my dad reading the headline in the paper in 1994 when Clinton signed the assault rifle ban and hearing my dad say "Good! What do people need assault rifles for anyway? People shouldn't have machine guns." :rolleyes: And I remember thinking, "YEAH!" :uhoh::uhoh::uhoh: I was only a young teen at the time, so I wasn't exactly thinking for myself. My parents weren't anti-gun per say, they were just ignorant and apathetic.

Then I went to high school, and realized there were some pretty rough individuals out there. My very first day in that high school someone offered to sell me dope. Then I went off to college where I was told the world was my oyster and everything would be ok if I just went to class and paid a lot of money for a piece of paper. I was of coarse very much in favor of the democratic agenda back then because I was broke all the time.

Then I used my degree, moved to a very small republican town at the age of 25, that was out in the woods, where guns were everywhere and seen as sporting equipment, and not just a way to kill. My attitudes changed and swung completely in the direction of the republican side of things, I started getting pissed at people taking advantage of the system and not working for a living, and I took personal responsibility for my wellbeing and safety.

However, my entire family is still pretty liberal, living in the same blue state they always have, and so are most of my old friends, and I can see when I talk casually about a range trip or the purchase of a new gun they all look a little concerned because “Why do you have so many?”

Some friends have outright started yelling at me because
“YOU CARRY A GUN!?!?!?!”
“Yes.”
“LOADED!?!?!?!?!”
“Well, it wouldn’t be much good to me if it were empty, would it?”
“THAT’s UNBELIEVABLE! !!!!! Rant rant rant rant” :cuss::cuss::cuss:

And that’s when I cut those people out of my life completely. I never preach or purposefully get into debates about gun control or 2A rights. If I hear an ignorant comment, I will ever so gently try to point out that the reasoning is flawed and/or illogical.

However, I find that people who have such strong unfounded negative feelings towards guns are frequently people who don’t take responsibility for their own lives, wellbeing, decisions, or life circumstances at all, and they aren’t the type of people I want to be around. So there is no big loss.

Face Book friending and unfriending is such a ridiculous and weird set of interpersonal politics, I don’t know where to start. I’m close to blocking most of my “friends” and coworker/friends, and keeping it to family and long distance “real friends” only.

I guess firearms serves as a filter for me for who I actually care about keeping in my life, because they accept me for who I am. I’m a guy who lives and works in the woods, has a reason to own firearms like every American, and has found a hobby and sport I am passionate about. Those who don’t accept that…….. well, I guess I don’t really need them in my life.

On an up note, I have made some friends as a result of my interest in guns as well. Relationships change and dissolve over time, but I find it interesting how firearms have served as a catalyst in my life to speed up those changes.
 
NO, in fact, just the reverse.

Began shooting in a local BE league and made A LOT of great friends.

My sister lives in NY. Liberal, fairly anti- gun. Whenever she comes to visit, the first thing she wants to do is go to the range! BIG smile on her face whenever she gets my SIG 226 in her hands. LOVES IT.

Met a gentleman from Australia a couple years ago. Rabid anti gun. Argued for some time, that no one needs a gun. Took him to the range. What a transformation. Grinning ear to ear, like a kid at Christmas. Insists I take LOTS of pics of him shooting. Said he is going back to Aussie land to tell people who wrong they are. He was coveting my SIG 228, like you would not believe.

MANY women I meet casually are interested in learning to shoot. Most of the ones I have shown have gone on to buy guns.


Thanks
J
 
AStone said:
This is the part that's never quite made sense to me. If my head is being bashed into the pavement, or I'm being strangled from behind, then it seems too late. How am I going to pull my weapon from an OWB and get off a shot as my head is being pummeled into a sidewalk, rendering me unconscious or nearly so?

I'm not contending that you agree with that, but it seems policy makers seem to think that's ok.
Click to expand...

More of a S&T or legal tangent, but it's a question that comes up at least once in every class I teach. It's not exactly straightforward to answer, either!

In Illinois (my reference state), we have pretty strong self-defense laws. You are allowed to use force to defend against force. You are allowed to use force which can cause death or serious bodily injury, to defend against force that is likely to cause death or serious bodily injury.

Where that line is drawn, that separates the two, is not at all clear cut, and depends on aggressor and victim. Where that line gets *crossed*, is also not clear cut.

Take a 200 pound, 6' tall 25 year old male, attacking me with nothing but fists - I am a 180 lbs, 6' tall, 38 year old male. If I draw and shoot the man without attempting to defend myself with non-lethal force, a jury of my peers could rather easily decide using the "reasonable man" proxy that a person of my size would not be in fear of death or serious bodily injury (which is rather loosely defined as "requiring hospitalization"). Compounding this is 30 years I've spent training in martial arts. If that were discovered, my laywer may very well have a VERY hard time convincing a jury that I was in fear of death or serious bodily injury against an attacker my approximate size, given 3 decades of training and teaching martial arts!

Now replace me, with my 125 pound 5'6" wife. Same attacker. Would a reasonable "man" (woman), *her* size and stature, potentially face death or serious bodily injury from a man nearly twice her size and strength?

Youbetcha! She could very easily justify drawing and putting shots center of mass without any attempt to use "normal force" to defend herself.

Replace my wife with my 83 year old grandfather. Could a 25 year old, 200 pound, 6' tall attacker kill or cripple my grandfather?

Youbetch! With one solid blow, my grandfather could be dead or permanently crippled. He could draw and shoot, without attempting to defend himself with "normal" force, and still be on very solid legal footing.

So those are pretty clear cut, but now comes that nasty gray area. :)

Reverse the roles. If the attacker is a 180 pound, 6' tall male who has spent 3 decades fighting and training to fight, and attacks a 200 pound 6' tall male who has not, it's VERY likely that the attacker will put a world of hurt on the victim. HOWEVER, the victim isn't going to KNOW that until the engagement is started. He has a legal obligation to defend himself using normal force, but once the discovery is made that he's facing an overwhelming amount of force, which he CANNOT defend against, and that "fear of serious bodily injury or death" kicks in, well, now you have legal footing to draw and fire.

Therein lies the catch-22.

You don't KNOW until it's too late, or very nearly so.

Which is why I always recommend to my concealed carry students to go get at least SOME training in hand to hand combat, weapon retention, and close quarters firearms deployment. It helps to de-blur those lines if you can more effectively defend yourself and know how and when to properly transition from "normal force" to "deadly force."
 
Trent, that's a very fine, informative post. I've been through only one basic defense handgun class (to get my CCW certification; even though I'll finally do more this year pursuant to CCW licenses in my two new states), and read a lot on the intrawebs about this issue, but that's the best I've read. You did a good job defining black, white, and gray areas. Thank you for taking the time to explain it.
 
Friends, no,,, but colleagues, yes.

Friends, no,,,
But colleagues, yes.

I man a small tech help office at a state university,,,
I obtained my carry permit back in 2011,,,
By now my friends all know I carry.

There are two professors who refuse to come to my office,,,
They told my supervisor they "feel threatened" by me.

The truly funny part of this is that my supervisor,,,
Thinks it is my responsibility to somehow allay their fears.

So I asked him,,,
"Exactly what should I do?"

Her response was,,,
"I don't know but you have to do something."

Again I said,,,
"Okay, exactly what should I do?"

It was like an Abbot and Costello comedy skit,,,
I finally told her that when she had a firm plan of action to let me know.

I'm golden here,,,
Even the two profs admitted I did nothing overtly threatening,,,
But still, it somehow remains my responsibility to "un-frighten" those two people.

So I came up with a solution,,,
I just don't assist them when they have a problem. :D

I won't say I have lost friends so much as my circle of friends has polarized to include fewer politically liberal people.

And don't you know,,,
That's perfectly fine with me.

Aarond

.
 
eh, i havent lost anyone who was worth keeping.

the company i keep now, while they may not always agree with my choices, respect me enough as a person to not let small differences in opinion get in the way of the things that actually matter in a relationship.
 
Being pro gun or anti gun is a fundamental part of someone's belief system and his/her value. So losing a friend simply based on firearm view differences is justified. We don't understand them and they don't understand us. I use to be all about lets get the other side onboard, lets teach them gun safety, etc But if you are not awake by now you are a lost cause.

I know, I am such a downer! lol
 
Yes, my ex-wife, when she killed her BF in my kitchen with my S&W Model 27, she also hit my new refrigerator, that was the last straw.
 
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