Is the economy/Ukraine impacting your hunting plans?

[D.B. Cooper]

If it gets into WW III, we may see more ammo on the shelves.

Yeah, but it will glow in the dark.

 

[.38 Special]

I just hope we don't all end up subsistence hunters out of necessity.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I think we likely saw the end of cheap rusky 7.62x39 ammo.

We already had that conversation, ad the mods shut it down. Which is too bad as it was a good discussion, but I digress. In any event, I don't think anyone was hunting with cheap Soviet steel cased ammo. At least not legally.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I just hope we don't all end up subsistence hunters out of necessity.

We can't. It won't work. We would far out pace the carrying capacity of the land. If you look just at my local Alaska history, before the arrival of Europeans (the Russians in 1741), there were less than 100k aboriginal people in AK, and they lived in small communities (a village of 300 would have been a metropolis) that were spread very far apart to avoid competition for game and other natural resources and still hunger and starvation were not unheard of. There are 700k people in AK today. If we threw out the hunting regs and everyone went hunting, the resource would be wiped out in a month. I imagine it would be ever more severe in the lower 48.

 

[.38 Special]

We can't. It won't work. We would far out pace the carrying capacity of the land. If you look just at my local Alaska history, before the arrival of Europeans (the Russians in 1741), there were less than 100k aboriginal people in AK, and they lived in small communities (a village of 300 would have been a metropolis) that were spread very far apart to avoid competition for game and other natural resources and still hunger and starvation were not unheard of. There are 700k people in AK today. If we threw out the hunting regs and everyone went hunting, the resource would be wiped out in a month. I imagine it would be ever more severe in the lower 48.

At least in my neighborhood, we'd be going hungry after the first day or two.

 

[Chuck R.]

At least in my neighborhood, we'd be going hungry after the first day or two.

IAW the KS F&W guys I'm supposed to take about 400-450 lbs of fish out of my pond a year to keep the population healthy. That's a over a pound of fish per day! I just hope I can trade some for beef with my neighbor with all the cows, cause I can only think of a couple ways to cook fish.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

IAW the KS F&W guys I'm supposed to take about 400-450 lbs of fish out of my pond a year to keep the population healthy.

Can your pond even produce that much fish?

That's a over a pound of fish per day! I just hope I can trade some for beef with my neighbor with all the cows, cause I can only think of a couple ways to cook fish.

Watch the movie Forrest Gump. His Army buddy, Bubba, tells all the ways there is to make shrimp. Just apply that to fish.

 

[brewer12345]

I wasn't concerned so much as Ukraine as a trade partner but rather what the impact from the war and, really, the sanctions will do to the global marketplace. Oil is shipped and sold globally. Any reduction in the supply anywhere in the world will result in higher prices everywhere in the world. The same is true for fertilizer. Russia is a significant player in the global oil and fertilizer markets.

Connect the dots. Price of fuel goes up. Fuel is an input cost for farmers and ranchers. As is fertilizer. (Grain has to be grown to feed livestock that is slaughtered and shipped to your grocery store.) Fuel is an input cost for shippers. Those two inputs alone have been and will continue to drive up food costs.

This is why I'm changing my hunting plans.

Its not just fertilizer. Russia and the Ukraine accounted for a quarter of all exported wheat for the world. They produce 90+% of the worldwide supply of neon (used in lasers to etch microchips). They and Belarus are large exporters of potash as well as nitrogen fertilizers.

I will be eating a lot of wild meat as all this plays out. Hopefully I get to supplement it with small farmed pork as in the past, but I bet that will get pricey.

 

[Armored farmer]

We already had that conversation, ad the mods shut it down. Which is too bad as it was a good discussion, but I digress. In any event, I don't think anyone was hunting with cheap Soviet steel cased ammo. At least not legally.

I missed that conversation.

 

[FL-NC]

I'm pretty much right there with you. Except I envy your 30 mile hunting commute. I drive about 8-9 hrs one way, then I still go about 30 miles from the road. I've hog hunted in FL over corn. Those guys have it down to a science. In some ways, I think you're ahead of us down there in that there is no limit on hogs, and, as I recall, a pretty large limit on deer.

Hogs are considered a pest and can be hunted 24/7, x 365, with anything you are legally allowed to possess. About the only restriction is no hunting from an aircraft. Statewide deer limit is 5 deer, of which only 2 can be does. Archery season (in my zone) starts late Oct, general gun mid Dec., ending in Feb. The downside is Fl isn't known for large "trophy" deer, the rut map/dates are all over the place, and the weather isn't ideal in that there are frequent showers or high afternoon temps (think, 70 degrees at sunset sometimes), which makes patterning deer in daylight difficult. Fl is the most difficult state I have ever deer hunted in.

 

[Chuck R.]

Can your pond even produce that much fish?

Watch the movie Forrest Gump. His Army buddy, Bubba, tells all the ways there is to make shrimp. Just apply that to fish.

IAW the F&W guys..9 acre pond stocked with LM bass, crappie, and blue-gill.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

About the only restriction is no hunting from an aircraft.

Well. No place is perfect.

The downside is Fl isn't known for large "trophy" deer, the rut map/dates are all over the place, and the weather isn't ideal in that there are frequent showers or high afternoon temps (think, 70 degrees at sunset sometimes), which makes patterning deer in daylight difficult. Fl is the most difficult state I have ever deer hunted in.

Well. By comparison. A moose is a year's meat for a family of 4 eating it every day, but the statewide success rate for moose is 20%. By comparison, a fried of mine, who lives in FL, maxes out his limits on deer and turkey every year and has a freezer full of hog. I don't think he has bought meat at a store in 10 years.

Weather is problematic every year. I'm sure you struggle to keep your meat cool in those warm temps year around. On the other hand, the last moose hunt I was on it was 25 below and the snow was so deep I lost a snow shoe and had to dig to find it. Without a snow machine, winter hunting is next to impossible.

That said, the current world affairs may be encouraging me to hunt more and put more priority over success rather than enjoying the hunt, but I'm still not planning to hunt in the winter.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

IAW the F&W guys..9 acre pond stocked with LM bass, crappie, and blue-gill.

IAW. It took me a minute. You must be an A&P.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I missed that conversation.

It was in the General Gun section. No need to rehash it here, but if you're interested...

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/thats-it-for-russian-steel-case-right.902300/

 

[Chuck R.]

IAW. It took me a minute. You must be an A&P.

23 years army, then another 4 contractor, followed by 13 (so far) as an army civilian.."IAW" saves 3 words when writing reports! As in "Failed to do IAW XXX".

 

[entropy]

We already had that conversation, ad the mods shut it down. Which is too bad as it was a good discussion, but I digress. In any event, I don't think anyone was hunting with cheap Soviet steel cased ammo. At least not legally.

Not necessarily so. 203 gr. SP 7.62x54R was imported in great quantities back it the early and mid 90's. Kicks like a mule, but it'll kill deer dead. As for x39, not imported (nor cheap, for that matter) but Hornady makes (or made) steel cased SP ammo.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

Not necessarily so. 203 gr. SP 7.62x54R was imported in great quantities back it the early and mid 90's. Kicks like a mule, but it'll kill deer dead. As for x39, not imported (nor cheap, for that matter) but Hornady makes (or made) steel cased SP ammo.

Interesting combinations. I thought the whole point of steel cased ammo was that it was cheap cheap cheap and, accordingly, rather poor quality. I've never owned a combloc gun, so I'm certainly no expert.

 

[Armored farmer]

Interesting combinations. I thought the whole point of steel cased ammo was that it was cheap cheap cheap and, accordingly, rather poor quality. I've never owned a combloc gun, so I'm certainly no expert.

I had an sks....actually two....but I quickly learned to despise it.....I eventually sold both of them and bought a ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 to shoot up the cheap surplus ammo that stocked up on . I found them to be a pretty accurate, low recoiling thumper.

 

[HowieG]

I am going hunting tomorrow. I just topped up my tank in prep for that. 17 gallons cost me 61 bucks. I would say that is an impact. I won't be hunting much. That being said, I am not going to totally blame the war. The Biden administration bears the brunt of my ire because they shut down domestic oil.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I am going hunting tomorrow. I just topped up my tank in prep for that. 17 gallons cost me 61 bucks. I would say that is an impact. I won't be hunting much. That being said, I am not going to totally blame the war. The Biden administration bears the brunt of my ire because they shut down domestic oil.

Certainly. And I didn't intent or desire to go full political (I've been kind of dancing around it), but the same principle applies. Shut down production of a globally traded production-no matter where, and prices will rise.

$3.58/gal isn't bad. I've been paying that for years.

Have you thought of partnering up with another hunter to share expenses? My hunting spot is several hundred miles away, but when I calculate all of my expenses to figure out a per lb cost of my game meat, I always come out better than the meat market or grocery store.

 

[jmorris]

I wasn't concerned so much as Ukraine as a trade partner but rather what the impact from the war and, really, the sanctions will do to the global marketplace. Oil is shipped and sold globally. Any reduction in the supply anywhere in the world will result in higher prices everywhere in the world.

Oh, I think prices will go up and some will want to place blame on what’s happening in Russia instead of the actions the current administration have put in place (that already raised prices on pretty much everything). Not to mention the 40 year high in inflation that makes a dollar buy less now than before they began executing their agenda.

Fact is we export mineral fuels to Ukraine, if we stop that is more here. If the .gov in its efforts to punish Russia stop importing their oil, without resuming our own efforts would raise prices even higher but I don’t think they care much about that. The “green new deal” is basically steering us away from fossil fuels in favor of renewable energy, so they want fossil fuel prices to be astronomical. It’s the only way, with current technology, for solar and wind power to make any sense.

Their complaints about fossil fuel prices rising are supposed to convince us they are on “our side” and have compassion for our “pain at the pump” but the actions they took he moment they stepped into office, resulted in higher prices, long before Russia/Ukraine was a news story they could blame for the results of their actions.

… I believe we can do things to offset circumstances that are out of out direct control. I see hunting as one (of several) ways to mitigate our circumstances.

You could be your own food source. Cattle can give you both dairy and meat (personally I suggest different breeds for the two food sources), you don’t have to feed them grain, ours eat grass when it grows (saves fuel vs mowing) and hay (excess grass we cut and bail) in the winter. Anything else we feed them are “treats”.



A side source of food, if needed would be the pigs we kill to keep them from tearing up the meadows we bail for hay. Hunting is pretty ineffective at that goal but trapping puts a good dent in them though. One could feed many with one set.







If you wanted a continuing food source, all you need to do is not kill a male and female, keep them contained and breed them.

Sounds like a lot of work because it’s something most don’t know how to do because they never have needed to but just a few generations ago children often maintained farm animals. Pretty much the opposite of rocket science, just keep them fed, watered and contained.

Chickens can survive on the crumbs of food you have left over and the bugs around your home and have an even faster gestation period. It’s 120 days for pigs and just 21 days for chicks to hatch.



If things ever got real bad, having your own food source, that you don’t have to go hunt for, will be the most valuable asset to have. A fishing pole would be more valuable than a stuffed 401k to someone that needs to eat to live.

 

[HowieG]

Certainly. And I didn't intent or desire to go full political (I've been kind of dancing around it), but the same principle applies. Shut down production of a globally traded production-no matter where, and prices will rise.

$3.58/gal isn't bad. I've been paying that for years.

Have you thought of partnering up with another hunter to share expenses? My hunting spot is several hundred miles away, but when I calculate all of my expenses to figure out a per lb cost of my game meat, I always come out better than the meat market or grocery store.

Just because you have been paying $3.58 for years doesn't mean it isn't bad. I don't know where you live, but $3.58 actually sucks. Perhaps your state political leaders need a forced retirement.

 

[Chuck R.]

If things ever got real bad, having your own food source, that you don’t have to go hunt for, will be the most valuable asset to have. A fishing pole would be more valuable than a stuffed 401k to someone that needs to eat to live.

I've got a few fish....and the 401K.



I've been building "capacity" over the years..have an orchard, garden etc. I've got enough attachments for the tractor to put in a pretty substantial garden in addition to what we have now. The woodstove on the main floor heats that area nicely, the downstairs we'll just "shut down". I've shied away from livestock due to the periodic travel required for my current job and between my wife's dog trials and my match schedule it'd be a PITA to find someone to care for them when we're both gone.

Honestly I think this is a blip, it too will pass like every other periodic disaster we've faced. It's an enormous country with a a lot of resources that at time we "choose" not to utilize for whatever reasons. From oil to farmland to coal, we've got a lot of resources on "standby" just due to "policies".

 

[jmorris]

I've shied away from livestock due to the periodic travel required for my current job and between my wife's dog trials and my match schedule it'd be a PITA to find someone to care for them when we're both gone.

Cattle need hay in the winter I put it out once a week this time of year. For the Chickens I built an automatic door on the coop to secure them at night and let them out after dawn, I can go for more than a week without having to add food or water to their feeders.

The dog does require a care giver if we are absent but the others can live without us for awhile.

I agree, it will be over when it’s over. The current administration would like to share/shift the blame on our current conditions though, with anything they could find, so this is convenient for them.

 

[jmorris]

Just because you have been paying $3.58 for years doesn't mean it isn't bad. I don't know where you live, but $3.58 actually sucks. Perhaps your state political leaders need a forced retirement.

Yeah, many coming from places like CA, come to Texas and vote for every spending increase that comes across. Using the mentality of “it’s a lot less that I used to have to spend!” Without any forethought that the end result of their actions are to turn the place they fled to, into the place they tried to escape…