lee has a new single stage press coming out Lee APP

[GravelRider]

Post 132 for 223 cases falling over. Cut off the ends of small zip ties and make some fingers to hold case when it drops.

If time allows today I hope to experiment with some of GW Staar’s suggestions.

I tried that suggestion. Those were the fingers I was talking about. I just couldn't get them to work for me.

 

[GravelRider]

Okay, so I think I have it figured out now for feeding the .223. First off, part of it was my fault. I forgot to change to a different tube support with a smaller diameter. I was using a larger one I had been using for other calibers. This extra bit of wiggle room causes the cases to be able to move forward in the support and that's what caused them to fall forward. However, after realizing my mistake there and switching out for a different support tube, I still have problems with cases moving forward, just not as bad as before. I epoxied two pieces of zip ties to the case inserter arms. This seems to keep them from jumping forward.

 

[GW Staar]

I had a few minutes this morning, so I also played with .223. I ended up cutting a piece of 7/16" tubing the same length as that for .308. Purpose was to make it so I could locktite the nut that goes against the rail and use that location for both rifle calibers......of course I cut it out on the side to fit the .223's neck and shoulder. The only problem left was that the 7/16" tubing was loosey going up in the smaller hole. Fixed that with a 1/2" wide piece of aluminum tape of the sort HVAC guys use to tape ducts that stay in view. Two wraps of that made the tubing go in just right....tight yet removable.

Tested it and it works just like the .308.....drops straight down and no issues. In fact there was no need to telescope the tubing above the feeder.....cases lean a little in the tube but it makes no matter. The stock Lee tubing above is fine. Will post pictures and video tonight.

 

[Bang!]

I tried that suggestion. Those were the fingers I was talking about. I just couldn't get them to work for me.

They need to come in from the top and slanted to contact case half way down.

 

[R44 flyer]

Okay, so I think I have it figured out now for feeding the .223. First off, part of it was my fault. I forgot to change to a different tube support with a smaller diameter. I was using a larger one I had been using for other calibers. This extra bit of wiggle room causes the cases to be able to move forward in the support and that's what caused them to fall forward. However, after realizing my mistake there and switching out for a different support tube, I still have problems with cases moving forward, just not as bad as before. I epoxied two pieces of zip ties to the case inserter arms. This seems to keep them from jumping forward.

View attachment 900540

It sounds like you need to tighten the little screw to close the fingers they will stop the case from jumping forward when the case drops. They open fully after placing the case in the shell holder no matter how tight you have the screw set

 

[cadet3]

It sounds like you need to tighten the little screw to close the fingers they will stop the case from jumping forward when the case drops. They open fully after placing the case in the shell holder no matter how tight you have the screw set

In my experience they still jump forward even if you close the jaws tighter or the case drops on top of the jaws causing more issues. Mine does this with 223 and 308. Haven't figured it out yet.

 

[GW Staar]

What a day.........223 was a bigger problem than I bargained for! I had this great idea to fill all four tubes with crimped LC brass.....a proper test!
I had no clue that LC brass would be that much of a pain.....
I'll take a little of the blame....the drop tube wasn't in the best place, but Lee gets some blame too:
1. Those d...mned plowed shellholders even tip finished brass .223 on the way out.....least ways LC brass.
2. Lee beveled transitions where the brass falls into the the "C" shaped entrance points......you want to know why everyone is having trouble with brass falling straight? That's why!
I even had a case fly away like it was jet powered!....you'll see it in the video below......granted in spite of all that, it's STILL the fastest way to deprime that much brass. So here's the video in all it's unglory below....I even picked up the pieces off the floor and reinserted it.....so what you see is the whole banana, beginning to end.



Then I went to work to rid myself of that beveled drop points:

Think of a case sliding on the surface and going across that bevel before it drops the rim takes off at an angle.....now you can understand why the cases drop out of the target zone!

I got my sanding drum in my Dremel Tool after the height one to test whether it would make a difference.......it did!

Below: works better, but that isn't depriming for real.


Below: Depriming for real....notice the second to the last one didn't drop as well even still. I think the lightweight .223 cases are partly to blame.....I never saw a trace of that on the heavier .308's.



Bottom line: This machine feeds cases pretty well....really well when tweaked and makes a great, and very fast fast deprimer.





.

 

[GravelRider]

What a day.........223 was a bigger problem than I bargained for! I had this great idea to fill all four tubes with crimped LC brass.....a proper test!
I had no clue that LC brass would be that much of a pain.....
I'll take a little of the blame....the drop tube wasn't in the best place, but Lee gets some blame too:
1. Those d...mned plowed shellholders even tip finished brass .223 on the way out.....least ways LC brass.
2. Lee beveled transitions where the brass falls into the the "C" shaped entrance points......you want to know why everyone is having trouble with brass falling straight? That's why!
I even had a case fly away like it was jet powered!....you'll see it in the video below......granted in spite of all that, it's STILL the fastest way to deprime that much brass. So here's the video in all it's unglory below....I even picked up the pieces off the floor and reinserted it.....so what you see is the whole banana, beginning to end.



Then I went to work to rid myself of that beveled drop points:
View attachment 900683
Think of a case sliding on the surface and going across that bevel before it drops the rim takes off at an angle.....now you can understand why the cases drop out of the target zone!

I got my sanding drum in my Dremel Tool after the height one to test whether it would make a difference.......it did!

View attachment 900682 Below: works better, but that isn't depriming for real.


Below: Depriming for real....notice the second to the last one didn't drop as well even still. I think the lightweight .223 cases are partly to blame.....I never saw a trace of that on the heavier .308's.



Bottom line: This machine feeds cases pretty well....really well when tweaked and makes a great, and very fast fast deprimer.

Now for the bad news. I tried the swager kit on the .223 cases I deprimed tonight.......was really disappointed. No feel. Really hard to tell if it swages or misses or how hard to push the handle down....you have to prime to find out whether it's swaged...and often you have to go back and do it again.

The RCBS or Dillon bench swagers do a better, faster, easier on the body job. Doesn't do a bit of good feeding cases fast when you have to swage and swage again....and prime in order to tell if you did anything.

Maybe it does better on large primer cases.

Ergonomically it is hard to swage.....hurts after a while....I'd rather use the old RCBS press swager.....and that's saying a lot, because I'd much rather use the newer bench swagers than that one.


.

The biggest reason I bought this press was to quickly swage new crimped 223 brass. For decapping, putting a decapper die on an empty toolhead on my Dillon is far faster, but it's just a pain to empty out the priming system to do it. I have the exact same feelings about the swaging system as you do. I'm definitely having buyer's remorse with this press...

Thanks for posting the videos and questions though!

 

[Bang!]

I set the APP back up and taped some “fingers” back on to get pictures. No videos as my ISP is via satellite.

They come in from the top and high enough to avoid case slider.

At an angle to hit the case lower than the slider pushes on the case. Hit case higher than the slider and they will push case over as it slides forward.

Didn’t keep count but ran around 1500 cases this way. Sizing as quick as I dared to work the handle. Appears some of you have a different slider and case holder than I do.

 

[R44 flyer]

What a day.........223 was a bigger problem than I bargained for! I had this great idea to fill all four tubes with crimped LC brass.....a proper test!
I had no clue that LC brass would be that much of a pain.....
I'll take a little of the blame....the drop tube wasn't in the best place, but Lee gets some blame too:
1. Those d...mned plowed shellholders even tip finished brass .223 on the way out.....least ways LC brass.
2. Lee beveled transitions where the brass falls into the the "C" shaped entrance points......you want to know why everyone is having trouble with brass falling straight? That's why!
I even had a case fly away like it was jet powered!....you'll see it in the video below......granted in spite of all that, it's STILL the fastest way to deprime that much brass. So here's the video in all it's unglory below....I even picked up the pieces off the floor and reinserted it.....so what you see is the whole banana, beginning to end.



Then I went to work to rid myself of that beveled drop points:
View attachment 900683
Think of a case sliding on the surface and going across that bevel before it drops the rim takes off at an angle.....now you can understand why the cases drop out of the target zone!

I got my sanding drum in my Dremel Tool after the height one to test whether it would make a difference.......it did!

View attachment 900682 Below: works better, but that isn't depriming for real.


Below: Depriming for real....notice the second to the last one didn't drop as well even still. I think the lightweight .223 cases are partly to blame.....I never saw a trace of that on the heavier .308's.



Bottom line: This machine feeds cases pretty well....really well when tweaked and makes a great, and very fast fast deprimer.

Now for the bad news. I tried the swager kit on the .223 cases I deprimed tonight.......was really disappointed. No feel. Really hard to tell if it swages or misses or how hard to push the handle down....you have to prime to find out whether it's swaged...and often you have to go back and do it again.

The RCBS or Dillon bench swagers do a better, faster, easier on the body job. Doesn't do a bit of good feeding cases fast when you have to swage and swage again....and prime in order to tell if you did anything.

Maybe it does better on large primer cases.

Ergonomically it is hard to swage.....hurts after a while....I'd rather use the old RCBS press swager.....and that's saying a lot, because I'd much rather use the newer bench swagers than that one.


.

There isn’t any feel involved set the push rod so that it takes a healthy push to meet the stops. Each and every time press the lever until it meets the stop. If you can’t reach the stop with healthy push your push rod is set too deeply. I started out with the push rod set too deep and it really sucked. By the way the stop is the connecting link hitting the upper casting near the handle pivot point. A little longer handle for swaging would be welcome. I am working on one from a broken shovel handle.

 

[GW Staar]

Gravelrider, R44 flyer: My apologies, I shouldn't have tried to read Lee's swager directions after a long day.....

Thankyou R44 flyer for posting your reply......I only saw the statement about "won't reach the stop" and quit reading. What I missed was the instructions to back off the swage rod until it does reach the stop at 25# worth of push. Now I need to redo my post.......as it did work much better after adjusting it properly. Sorry for the misinformation now quoted in both your posts!

I erased everything about the swager......so if people read the erased lines in Gravelrider's and R44 flyer's posts ....ignore it.

I re-adjusted the swage rod so a 25 lb push let the press handle reach the stops, and it worked pretty darn good. Still it's not as easy on my 70 year old shoulder as the bench swager I have, but it'll work fine, the feeder makes a big speed difference. The only repeats are true of any swager when you swage old LC brass. Some of it is old and hard and requires two swagings, but that's an exception encountered once in a while unless you ream.

 

[Demi-human]

After reading this thread, I finally purchased one of these presses from Mid-South Shooters Supply, as well as a Lee Collator. I batch load and have much brass. This will be a dedicated depriming press, my most loathsome task. The Lee Handpress I have in that role now is great for small numbers of cartridges, like the few Bushmaster or 30-06s, but a few thousand pistol cases at a time is a chore.

I hope this new press will turn it back into a process step.

So, as it comes in the box, it will run 45Auto cases? I have a universal depriming die. I have seen the modifications @GW Staar has made for .40, but, ¿Cómo se dice?

Ah...'Is this a universal apparatus, or will I need to buy separate "things" to run .223Rem as well as .45Auto?'

I should have thought of this before purchase, but impulsiveness is in my Nature. "Ne quis ego sum?"

 

[GW Staar]

I doubt you will have any trouble with .45. The cases are heavy and short enough to fall better, and rims are big enough not tip into the plowed case holders.

The tall light cases, .223 especially, In in my experience, fall crooked due to the 45 degree bevel on top of the shuttle....and the rims can dip into the plowed transition area.

The faster you stroke the less it happens.....

I made the tubing outlets at the bottom for both .308 and .223, because that helped control the drop angle of the tall cases. I'll check back on my posts to see if I gave the thinwall tubing size......if not I will add them to this post. .223 was the most onerous for me.....but I eventually won when I ground off the stupid purposeless bevel at the mouth of the shuttle.


the down tubes made of thin-wall, pressed into the 4-tube adapter are both about 1-7/8"long... Looks like one is shorter....optical illusion. I made them the same height to be able to set the 4-tube feeder once for both calibers... leaving 1/16" inch between tube and the tallest shuttle.

The tube for .308 is 9/16" O.D. and friction-fits, as is, into the widest outlet.
The one for .223 is 7/16" O.D. and had to be wrapped with aluminum HVAC tape, two wraps, to press-fit the other smaller outlet....the one with the notch in it.

Each is cut out on one side to allow the case to be held vertical closer to the slide, yet allow the case to progress on the slide past it without hindrance.


As for pistol, .40 S&W, the wire I added to the shuttle for that caliber wouldn't be necessary, if you fill in the plowed recess on the .40 shellplate....or get lucky and get one of the unplowed versions. You don't need a plowed shellholder unless you have proud primers.....or bunged up rims. I personally think that added more problems to the case feed than fixing problems.

 

[GravelRider]

Well after loading up finished rounds on a few hundred of the swaged .223 brass, I'm going to have to go back and re-swage all of them on the Dillon bench swager. The APP swager just doesn't do a good enough job. Tough primer seatings, mangled primers, unable to seat the primers at all, etc. I took about twenty of them and redid them on the Dillon and ran them through, and it was a night and day difference. The APP just simply doesn't do an adequate job, which is disappointing, as the main reason I bought this was to swage .223 brass.

Long ago I had sworn off Lee products, as I had concluded they were cheap and finicky after buying a few items. This was a failed experiment, and will be the last piece of Lee garbage I buy. I like the ingenuity from the company, but not their cheap execution of the great ideas.

/frustrated

 

[9mmepiphany]

the main reason I bought this was to swage .223 brass.

A combination of reliable swaging and speed, to process .223/5,56mm brass, for me has been the Hornady LNL Primer Pocket Swag Tool. It's ease of operation and sustainable speed is just amazing.

I was hoping to use the swaging function mostly on other caliber cases. It's primary function will still be de-priming...maybe even sizing handgun brass

 

[cadet3]

It seems like this press works ok for depriming pistol brass but Lee should have put more R&D into the rifle calibers. They have a good press, but it's not ready for prime time just yet.

 

[BBarn]

I currently have my Lee APP set up to handle 45 Auto brass and it seems to feed those cases well. My primary purpose in buying the press was to de-prime handgun brass.

I load most of my handgun on a progressive, but do occasionally run some on a single stage. I have also used the APP to bell some 45 Auto brass I was loading on the single stage, and it seemed to work well for that also.
It doesn't come with shell holders for 38/357 or 44 brass so I haven't tried de-priming or belling those yet. When I'm sure I can get the updated X-press shell holders (with the primer relief cut) I'll probably give those cases a shot on the APP as well.

Overall, the press seems to be best suited to light duty work. I consider the press to be a bit light for resizing and other moderate to heavy tasks. The press is small and the leverage is lacking for the moderate to heavy work. While resizing 357 mag brass with carbide dies and no lube on a typical full size cast iron press requires fairly low effort, doing the same on the little APP is burdensome.

 

[GW Staar]

The APP swager just doesn't do a good enough job. Tough primer seatings, mangled primers, unable to seat the primers at all, etc.

That was also my first impression, then I read the instructions better. You really can adjust it to swage more. I do much better with it now, but it's still not as easy as the RCBS bench swager, ergo-wise. On the other hand if you are younger than me, and don't get tired as fast....the APP is a hell of a lot faster.

One thing on the .223......do set the deprimer to bell the case enough or the press will catch on the swage rod....and that is annoying!

Have to agree with BBarn, it is not the best tool for resizing.....it is lightweight....after all it is made for brass processing not sizing....so sizing is an option but not a best tool option, for sure.

The concept is intriguing though. Which is why I'm wanting to mod and make my RCBS Summit press work with a brass feeder.....that one has the beef to do both.....too bad you can't mount dies top and bottom like the APP......maybe if I can somehow make RCBS think making a version to do that ..... is......their idea!

 

[GravelRider]

That was also my first impression, then I read the instructions better. You really can adjust it to swage more. I do much better with it now, but it's still not as easy as the RCBS bench swager, ergo-wise. On the other hand if you are younger than me, and don't get tired as fast....the APP is a hell of a lot faster.

One thing on the .223......do set the deprimer to bell the case enough or the press will catch on the swage rod....and that is annoying!

Have to agree with BBarn, it is not the best tool for resizing.....it is lightweight....after all it is made for brass processing not sizing....so sizing is an option but not a best tool option, for sure.

The concept is intriguing though. Which is why I'm wanting to mod and make my RCBS Summit press work with a brass feeder.....that one has the beef to do both.....too bad you can't mount dies top and bottom like the APP......maybe if I can somehow make RCBS think making a version to do that ..... is......their idea!

I read and re-read the instructions. I definitely had it set right. At one point I actually hung a 25 lb weight off my handle, I also adjusted for much more swage, and it still just doesn't swage well. Running them through the Dillon, albeit one at a time and slower, made seating primers smooth as butter.

 

[GW Staar]

I'm wondering if they need to replace your swage rod.....not big enough.....mine is barely enough and some of the old LC brass springs back and has to be done twice.....but that can be the case for any swager....you don't want it too big....that's worse.

If you can swage a few more.....pick one that doesn't allow a primer in, and pull the swage rod out of the tool and hand set it into the swaged pocket. If it goes in easily to the hilt (or stop) then the swage button isn't big enough........and that's a production tolerance problem. Been there with RCBS's old press tool years ago and they had me send in the button and sent me another that worked.

 

[katonk]

Just a FYI....I just very sparingly used a needle oiler on all metal hinge points on my Lee APP and what a difference!....so much smoother!

 

[R44 flyer]

I read and re-read the instructions. I definitely had it set right. At one point I actually hung a 25 lb weight off my handle, I also adjusted for much more swage, and it still just doesn't swage well. Running them through the Dillon, albeit one at a time and slower, made seating primers smooth as butter.

Before you give up the app linkage is a lot like a vice grip pliers. If you ever used one if you have the screw set too tight you can’t apply much pressure no matter how hard you squeeze. If you have the push punch set too deep you will have to push really hard on the lever to get any swaging. Try it, if you screw it in way too far you can put your full weight on the lever and you won’t get any swaging. Back the punch out and make sure you are always coming to the stops. The stops are the connecting link hitting the top casting at the handle pivot point. A case of less is more.

 

[GW Staar]

This could go in the what did I do in the reloading room today, but then some people interested in Lee's APP may not see it.....so I decided to post here one more time.

How's this for 20 minutes work ... including loading the four tubes by mounting my Lee shaker, modified to collate rifle, on top. That represents a whole nut jar full of tarnished .223 ready for the wet tumbler and pins:



Done with that case prep, I decided to tackle a harder problem. You see, I used the spot on my bench where my APS bench primer used to be. The idea was to buy another Lee tool base for the Lee base plate....which I did...but Lee doesn't make holes for RCBS tools....of course we know that. I just thought I'd figure a way....so I cut a couple of 1 1/4" square tubing pieces and drilled 2 holes each in the bottom (to screw into the the tool base) and two hole each in the top (and threaded those with a 1/4" course-thread die, so I could screw my RCBS bench primer into it).



Simple.....except cutting off Lee's special flat headed square shank bolts, and since they only supplied three, I had to make a forth by filing the more common round head square shank into a flat one the same thickness to fit between Lee's base plate and tool plate. Result below:


Since the APS version of RCBS's bench primer comes with a spring that keep the press handle wherever you want it, it fits stable on a shelf above my presses......but I think I will screw a single stud in the shelf for a wing nut so I can't knock it off.

 

[TTv2]

It's been almost 2 months since I found out about this press. Been waiting to hear feedback on it and I see some have had great success while others have had some troubles.

Given my machinist and manufacturing background, I'm not above tinkering and modifying things, so bottom line is the press worth getting? Mostly will be decapping and resizing.

 

[BBarn]

In my experience, it's OK for decapping, but too small/light duty for sizing.